LongHaul

Merlyn, I use the term because the Post-Register, which exposed the BSA's complicity and attempt to seal the court records, used the term 'pedophile'. OH! So if I find a reference in print that equates atheism with what ever action or trait specified further use of that reference is totally justified because hey it was in print. If you're trying to improve current policies, yes, you DO need to know how well the OLD policies worked in order to measure if the NEW policies make the situation worse, better, or the same. Old data would also be useful for other kinds of analysis, like w

Kudu you assume a lot! Serving in a position of responsibly to the satisfaction of my Scoutmaster was a requirement 47 years ago so saying it is intended to serve the new leadership focused training is ridiculous. Considering the PL as holding a position of responsibility exactly the same as the Scribe is holding a position of responsibility in NO way affects or effects the training each is given. Just because I train scouts in the general skills and traits of leadership does not mean I do not train my PLs to be PLs. Are you saying that in your unit the PL is the only leader that is job specif

Meryln, Why must you continually equate pedophilia with child molestation? All child molesters are not pedophiles and all pedophiles are not child molesters. You object strongly to the equating of homosexuality with pedophilia even though they are both sexual preferences which by current belief are genetic in nature and beyond the control of the person in question. You hear pedophile and you think child molester but rebuke those that hear homosexual Scout leader and think POSSIBLE child molester. You list 4 things seemingly specific to BSA in reference to child molestation ca

I can't speak for the old boys in your council/district/area but I don't remember anyone in this thread or the others on the WB subject recently saying that those who took WB after 2001 are not as good, qualified,or worthy as those who took it pre-change. Most of the pre-change people that complain about WB21C just rue the loss of the old course. In the 70's I was told I would never really be a SM until I was invited to take WB. WB in my area back then was by invitation only. In the 90's I was told that if I wasn't WB then I was not doing justice to my unit. Now I'm told that even though I too

So in the spirit of inclusiveness why not include everyone. You get your beads as soon as you become a trained leader. All trained leaders would be recognized the same, no more knots, no more DAM or SB. How would that sit with you AvidSM? LH

AvidSM practically makes my point! The beads and woggle and neckerchief are important. The recognition of the name WoodBadge are important. It seems that the only thing that is not important it the fact that ALL the importance that is associated with the beads and woggle and neckerchief came from the OLD course. Powderhorn didn't need to rely on the WoodBadge name, woggle,beads, or neckerchief when it began in 1999. National knew it would get Venturing leaders to take the training even if they had take WB. Sea Badge training, started in 1970 by the way long before the corporate fad frenzy, did

>>Being able to transition them from parent guided and adult-led to self-directing seems to be a vital soft skill for a Scouter.<< Yes!,and that Scouter would be the Webelos Den Leader NOT the Scoutmaster. The New Scout program how ever it is approached is NOT supposed to be a Webelos III program. >>Understanding Cubbing also allows the Boy Scout program Scouter to give better reachback to area Packs, which in turn helps recruitment.<< Which is exactly why a solid and effective Webelos Transition Program is necessary in every Council, District, Boy Scout and Cu

OGE began this thread with; >>OK, from the thread on What WoodBadge is supposed to be I have a few conclusions. Many posters want to see WoodBadge be a much more Outdoor skill course. If that was/is the intent, then it may be best to allow WoodBadge to morph off into such a program.<< morph off into? How about return to? For 90 some years it was a more Outdoor skill course when compared to the present version. What about the rest of us? For 90 some years the Scouting program flourished with a course that didn't focus on "the rest of us". Kudu asked the question "Why call it Wood

(This message has been edited by LongHaul)

Rather than looking for someone to suggest a project try sitting down and asking yourself what you care about. What stirs a passionate response within you? What would you like to change in your community? Who would you like to help or who do you think needs help most? While there are many things you can do that will make a difference and be of value, ask yourself this; What will make a difference to me? LH (This message has been edited by LongHaul)

I too would like to do away with advancement but for the opposite reasons from Eamonn. I want to get rid of those that are interested only in advancement. Notice I say advancement but not necessarily skill acquisition or growth. These are the boys, and parents, that are interested only in making Eagle. They look to get past Personal Management early so the budget and record keeping can be all zeros. Bobby does not handle money. Camping is done in the back yard. Where does it say the tent has to be pitched outside? Acquisition of scouting skills, cooking, camping, hiking, are viewed as n

Anyone that is familiar with the current Leadership/Team Building seminar training will tell you it is designed to be delivered to the group not individual members of a group. Corporations don't send one person to this training and intend for them to come back and implement it in their business. For this type of training to work at the unit level we would need groups from each unit to take this training. If we could get groups of adults in each unit to be willing to pony up the cash and the time to take this training we would not need the training because these people would already be working

Beavah's statement that these new requirements were not well thought out made me smile as I think most advancement changes are not well thought out. Some are just not as bad a others, laws of chance say you gotta be right sometimes whether you planned it that way or not. What really got me LOL was the DARE reference. The DARE program in our school district gave out thousands of pencils with DON'T DO DRUGS printed on the side so that which ever way the pencil was laying on a desk or table the face pointing up would have the slogan. Problem was they spaced the breaks between words so the slogan

Why isn't this part explained as well as the others? >> The second part of the review is the Board Of Review. If all the other steps have been met correctly, by the time a Scout gets to the BOR there should be no question if the Scout is ready or not. Ready or not for what? The BOR itself? Advancement? If it does become clear that something is not working? This needs to be taken up with the Scoutmaster. After all he or She has by sending the Scout to the BOR said that the Scout is ready to advance. Then why do we need a BOR that results in the SCOUT advancing or not advancing. Why not a

Hunt, Your opinion is based on your interpretation of the word test. You also go on to single out "skills". >> I am amazed the lengths to which folks will go, and the knots they will tie themselves in, to justify continuing to test skills at BORs. If you disagree with BSA, and think that retesting is good, that's one thing. But requiring a boy to demonstrate skills and saying it's not "really" a test is something else.<< So am I to believe that testing skills is a no no but continual retesting knowledge of the Oath and Law are all right? or is it OK so long as we reword the

Look thru some of these, http://kudu.net/outdoor/skills/index.htm

>>Per the National Website (scouting.org) a Board of Review is how the troop committee (or the Eagle Scout board of review) tracks the progress of a Scout to determine his understanding of the ideals of Scouting and how he applies them in daily life in the troop.<< All in the space of 30 minutes. These guys need to hire themselves out to screen job applicants for the government. wingnut that is what the SM conference is for IMO. >>"What does A Scout is Loyal mean?" Nope can't ask that. "Why?" Asked him that for Tenderfoot. "What does A Scout is Loyal mean TO YOU?" Le

Over and over we talk about No retesting how a BOR is not supposed to be a retest. When I look up the word test I find this; Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source - Share This test1 tɛst - Show Spelled Pronunciation[test] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun 1. the means by which the presence, quality, or genuineness of anything is determined; a means of trial. 2. the trial of the quality of something: to put to the test. 3. a particular process or method for trying or assessing. 4. a set of questions, problems, or the like, used as a m

>>If one of the requirements is that he earns 4 merit badges, one of which must be an Eagle required merit badge, then the Scoutmasters task is to check to see that the scout has earned 4 merit badges and that one of them is Eagle required. << Exactly my point and the topic of this thread when is the badge considered earned. Define earned. As I posted is earned defined as obtain accreditation by any means? LH

Its Me, actually while some of us may indeed be Man Scouts forums such as this don't provide enough audience or "center stage" for my idea of a Man Scout. They need control and power, while they can dazzle 'em with their brilliance and baffle 'em with their BS here they can't control, they can't stop opposition. In my experience Man Scouts don't respond well to people telling them they are wrong in public. They tend to avoid opposition. LH

Actually there is no requirement that I can find that says a Venturer must remain dual registered to attain Eagle. Page 5 of the 2006 requirements book (2007 being in the truck of my car right now) says that the SM conference will be conducted by the Advisor or Skipper which also leads me to believe that dual registration is not required. LH

OK, before I begin round two let me say that your #2 is exactly what I did with 3 boys who earned First Aid MB in a manner such as the one I described. I was promptly called in front of the TC by the CC for exposing these poor boys to shame and embarrassment. These poor boys should not be held responsible for the lack of QC on the part of council. These poor boys attended the "class" in good faith and did exactly what they wee asked to do. Blah Blah Blah. One of these guys actually got to the point that all he needed was an Eagle project but neither he nor his mom could figure how go get cred

Female Eagle Scouts? IMO you'll see gay, atheist, sex offender SMs first. LH

Beavah has presented a progression which kinda says we learn right and wrong as children and then refine those definitions as we grow older or wiser. As children we learn right from wrong from those older than us and they from those older than they. Going all the way back to who decided right from wrong in the first place? Trev spoke about the evolution of attitudes. The validity of the belief not withstanding can we agree that our basic attitude of right and wrong originated in religious trainings long long ago in a place far far away? Taking the evolution of attitude to the extreme, event

Welcome cseltenright, My original post in this thread was a little jumbled as I was trying to think and type at the same time, not being female I don't multitask well. Originally I wanted to know if anyone knew whether females were allowed to earn merit badges. Male Venturers are indeed allowed to earn Boy Scout merit badges and those who had obtained the rank of First Class while registered in a Boy Scout troop could attain the rank of Eagle if they chose. Since starting this thread I have come to find out that the merit badge program is considered by National as part of the Boy Sc