Eagledad

>>What's your point? We're just ten years short of 100, doing things very differently and scouting is very successful in this country without kicking people out because of their sexual orientation, etc.

I'm saying that we couldn't even begin to teach the skills required for good leadership at the SPL level, so we ran the course giving the expectation that the scouts would go back and teach the skills to the rest of the scouts. THey were still ASPL and SPLs, but the burden on them from us was passing those skills on to the rest of the troop. We of course hope they use the skills and we got letters saying they did, but we wanted to set the standard of expected leadership maturity high. I would say in reality, less then 50% of the units actually did use their scouts to teach JLT. It was a scoutm

>>It needs to be done in a large group to get the real benefit and needs to be implemented back in the unit. The boy needs a backup.

>>Monocultures sooner or later will not bear fruit anymore. BSA might be the biggest organisation of its kind in the US today, but the way it is run, it will, in the long shot, fail.

>>I agree that there is no sense in having the SPL/ASPL attend if he is half way through his tenure.

>>I don't believe you're hateful; I do believe your perspective is driven by a feeling, not an argument, and I believe you prejudge gay people based on those feelings.

Boy Eamonn, sometimes I wonder if we were at one time joined at the hips. My thoughts are almost word for word the same as you wrote. Just when I felt National was starting to understand the training needs of the adults, they seem to go the opposite direction on the youth side. National just seems to struggle with the big picture. Still, this scouting stuff is pretty tough in the trenches. I'm know it isn't any easier for the professionals in the basement. Barry Barry

>>John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. Oddly enough it doesnt say "unless your homosexual"

>>3. If the MBC or Summer Camp counselor doesn't deny the MB work because the kid has no blue card, but instead lets him continue, marks the MB complete, and provides the Council with some piece of paperwork saying the boy completed the MB, the Unit and the Council shouldn't allow it to go through because the boy and the MBC didn't ensure step #'s 1, 2, or 3 were done correctly.

>>My guess is 30-70% of WB's are ManScouts, dependin' on your area. It often attracts da wannabe Eagles who never made it as a kid. I'd say it's a slightly better predictor than the knot-infested.

>>Finally, I would say that if you could see the scout as being SPL or ASPL in the next 1-3 years, then you should send them.

>>However, an SM who doesn't know how to light a fire or sharpen a knife doesn't have much credibility with boys who he is asking to do the same.

>>That menu sounds very similar to what we ate every day at Philmont!

I love this scouting stuff. I think you dont realize your gift as a SM. This is just the next step in the scouts growing maturity and independence and I dont think there is much to say or do for the scouts; they have been camping long enough to know what to do. So your job is find what you can do to ease the minds of the concerned adults, maybe even yours. We adults tend to limit our youths growing experiences by our fears. How can you ease the fears so the adults get out of the way of scouts growth. One idea is explain the adult's concerns to the scouts and ask them what they might do t

The widely accepted answer is the counselor has the final say. Our council uses the white MB cards and these cards only have one place for the SM's signature. We used to have to use the blue cards when we went to a camp outside our council and I always thought two signatures for the SM was rather confusing. Now most camps accept our white cards. As for lousy summer camp counselors, don't let them sign at the end and find a counselor at home to finish. We have been to camps with some good staffs and some not so good, but my opinion is any troop handing over their advancement program t

>>However, as Gern points out, today the tide has already turned in the US with respect to views towards homosexuality. What our parents generation thought of as sinful or perverted our childrens genertion is accepting as being merely different.

Very impressive. When I read about scouts in a troop like this, I want to personally meet the SM because it take a special person of wisdom and patience to not only encourage such leadership, but to also get out of the way. I only have a couple suggestions to add to the already good advice. First, let the scouts do the choosing so they are buying into the idea and have some ownership. Second, be honest about your concerns and gaols for the change. I find when the adults are up front about changes, the scouts will do the best they can to ease the concerns. Hope you hang around, I real

>>The SPL is looking at splitting the Troop into 2 patrols

What is the question? A few random thoughts; --I know the SM Handbook says the SM sets up BORs, but I never did, our Scouts set up their BORs when they felt the need. My way of doing SM conferences was summarizing my thoughts at the end of where I felt the scout stood at the moment. Then I allowed him to choose if he was ready for the BOR. Not by the book, I know, but I saw so many boys make man size decisions at the point. --The head of the BOR and I generally talked before and after the reviews so that we all had an understanding of our thinking. I (the SM) tried to always end

>> I'd hazard a guess that if the SM had a little more communication with the Life Scout, he wouldn't be surprised that the project was already completed.

>>Adults have to set clear expectations for behavior and then they have to be consistent about enforcing them. Senior scouts and those in leadership need to "buy in" to those expectations, and sure, have a hand in shaping them to some extent. Adults need to help senior scouts learn how to convey those expectations to the rest of the group too, instead of leaving them on their own and hoping they "get it," but then expressing dismay when some of them inevitably do not.

Hi All Once during summer camp a few years ago, four of our new scouts were so excited about their adventure that they were keeping the rest of the camp awake. The SPL tried several times to quiet them down, but they were anxious for what they saw coming in the next few days and couldnt hold back the tone. Looking for a way to let the camp sleep without throwing water on the scouts excitement, I ask the scout to join me on a midnight hike in the middle of the beautiful Colorado evening. The camp is rather large, which gave us plenty of time to stop and look at the stars, trees and m

>>Now, yeh need to make a similar "be comfortable" or "have experience" list for parents. Beavah

Ask the SM what his goals are for you son in the next year, and five years from now. See if that gives you a better picture of the adults vision, or if they even have a vision. As for the parents, explain the troops just as you did to us and let them ask the questions so you can educate to good and bad points. Both sound like pretty good programs to me. Barry

>>Did you have boys who went to other troops, despite this experience? Just curious.