Eagle732

The troop's goal is growth to a comfortable level for our meeting facility, about 35 Scouts. We are expecting 8 to 10 new Scouts this February. That's why I asked that the PLC might consider reintroducing some of the jobs if and when membership increases or someone really wants to do a particular job.

We have a small troop of about 17 Scouts. At the last PLC meeting the group decided to reduce the number of SPL appointed positions. We will now only have the troop positions of SPL, ASPL, QM and Scribe. They decided to cut Librarian, Historian and Chaplains Aide assigning those jobs to the remaining officers as needed. I think this is a good idea considering that they usually have to beg someone to do those jobs and the Scout that ends up with the job doesnt do it. Im hoping that the reduced opportunities for PORs will encourage some of the older Scouts to take the PL job. Most of the time it seems like the new boy gets the PL job. I did ask that they might want to consider reintroducing some of the jobs if and when membership increases or someone really wants to do a particular job. Has anyone done this before? Was the effect that older boys needing a POR took the PL jobs?

The volunteer fire company I belong to had the membership requirement of "white male aged 18 or older" until the late 70's. I remember the discussion that took place when we changed it. It was the concern of legal action that go it changed. My property deed said it could only be sold to a "white person". That was changed when I bought the place. Heck if you want to go back far enough my ancestors owned dozens of slaves! The point is that years ago these things were common and accepted practices. Obviously BSA is not a racist organization today although it could be (and is argued) that BSA discriminates.

Next year our troop will hold its first annual "Scouting Ultimate Challenge" weekend. The program will be an individual competition that will test skills of all Scouts and offer an opportunity for T - FC to complete requirements that are part of the challenge. The skills that will be tested will be T - FC skills including; knots, lashings, orienteering, fireman chip, first aid, totin' chip, plant and animal I. D., and Scout lore. Adult leaders will be judges and score Scouts by using a check off sheet for points. Winners will receive gift cards from a camping store. Has anyone done something like this or have any ideas and/or recommendations on how to run it? How do you feel about gift card prizes?

"Inviting, is that by email or phone?" Invites are by regular mail. I had my SPL and TG write letters which were addressed to each Web. individually then they are sent to each Web. Also flyers for each event are sent by regular mail addressed to each Web. Also leaders get emails. "How about showing up to a Weeb or Pack meeting?" We've offered but we can't just show up without an invite. I could have a Den Chief at every meeting if they would agree. "I will bet some big money that the invite goes no further than the DL or CM. You need to get around the road block. Most boys love camping and the outdoors. But remember the age specific guidelines on the outings." How much big money? ; ) I think it's more likely that someone within the pack is pushing them to another troop and discouraging them to even look at us.

Thanks to everyone for the great tips and info. One of the things we would like to do is to visit Arlington and lay a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier.

Our troop has the opposite problem. We have a local pack in the same small town and we invite them to everything; troop meetings, camping trips, Webelos open house, Webelos camp out, we even offered a Den Chief. They just don't seem interested since none ever show up! Our troop helped to organize and start this pack, we share the same number, we even gave them money and equipment to start up! The boys from this pack travel 15 miles to another troop when some could walk to our meeting place. Our troop has a great program with a variety of camping trips including backpacking, canoeing (we own our own canoes), bike hikes etc, we camp every month. The troop is what I consider boy led. Recruiting from other packs is not a problem just from the pack in town. I don't understand it.

We will be spending three days this summer visiting the Smithsonian museums, Arlington, and the monuments on the Mall in Washington DC and I have a few questions: 1. Are daypacks allowed in the museums? I'm thinking we will carry lunch, water, rain gear etc.but would not want to have to leave someone outside watching 15 packs. 2. We'll be camping at Greenbelt. For those that have stayed there do you leave your tents and gear set up while your gone for the day? Is the campsite secure? I'm thinking that we leave the tents up but lock up valuables in a vehicle.

It's been over 6 months since we've heard from mdsummer45 about this appeal. How long does an appeal usually take?

Dues: $50 a year , includes BL Summer Camp: about $300 11 monthly outings @ about $30 each: $330 (actual cost varies depending on transportation costs and camp fees but never more than $30 each) TOTAL: $680 We do have funds available to help Scouts finically if needed.

We have a small troop in a small town with several boys who just can not afford Scouting. I recall a boy visiting a troop meeting and when he asked how much dues were he left and never came back. I promised myself then that no boy who wanted to be in Scouting would be denied because he couldn't afford it. Many just can't afford the cost which is about $500 - $600 a year including dues, summer camp and monthly outings. I don't have any problem with begging for donations from local businesses to help these boys stay in Scouting. To keep costs down we try to keep camping trips local and use private land and campgrounds that have youth group rates. We camp close to home to keep transportation costs down, and we camp at our council's camp which is 10 minutes from out meeting place. A uniform bank and donations of camping equipment also help to outfit these boys.

We have a small troop in a small town with several boys who just can not afford Scouting. I recall a boy visiting a troop meeting and when he asked how much dues were he left and never came back. I promised myself then that no boy who wanted to be in Scouting would be denied because he couldn't afford it. Many just can't afford the cost which is about $500 - $600 a year including dues, summer camp and monthly outings. I don't have any problem with begging for donations from local businesses to help these boys stay in Scouting. To keep costs down we try to keep camping trips local and use private land and campgrounds that have youth group rates. We camp close to home to keep transportation costs down, and we camp at our council's camp which is 10 minutes from out meeting place. A uniform bank and donations of camping equipment also help to outfit these boys.

Seems to me there should be no question as to why the Scout has not passed his board of review. Ask for the written explanation you are entitled to. From the 2008 Advancement Guide Book, page 30. "If the board decides that the Scout is not ready to advance, the candidate should be informed and told what he has not done satisfactorily....The members of the board of review should specify what must be done to rework the candidates weaknesses and schedule another board of review for him. A follow-up letter must be sent to a Scout who is turned down for rank advancement, confirming the agreements reached on the actions necessary for advancement."

The only thing I remember ever getting for good grades was when I was in elementary school my dad gave me a 1922 silver dollar for getting a good report card. I don't think it had so much to do with the good grades as it was that dad just wanted me to have it. I still have it today. My son got a cell phone after several good report cards(he's always been on the Honor Roll) but we wanted him to have a phone anyway. For Scout advancements my son gets praise and encouragement, not pressure or money. His incentive is that he wants to beat his old man in getting Eagle. I am not encouraging this but he has said he wants to earn it at an earlier age than I did (14 years, 3 ,months).

You might want to tell the Scouts what your policy will be on this from now on. I had to institute a new policy that all BCs must be completely filled out and have a MBC name on it before I sign it. Any cards that were out there without a SM signature (either mine or the previous SM's) had to come back to me for a signature. Apparently before I became SM there was no policy. The only exception is summer camp BCs since we usually don't know in advance who the MBC will be. The Scouts can chose their MBC or I can give them a name but I have final approval of the choice by signing the card.

No, we're on the east coast.

EDad, what is new to me is coming into a unit that is so beat down it's ready to fold and then trying to bring it back to life. I think one of the reasons why COR is so bent against the boy led troop is because he has seen the ugly side of it. When I first came to our troop it was boy led for sure. The boys made all the decisions. The car camped every month, they had a scam they had going, adults take boys to a campground where they get to do anything they want, non of it having anything to do with Scouting. No need for a program, no need for planning, no need for the Ideas of Scouting. The troop even got kicked out of campgrounds and was constantly getting in other trouble. Our meeting place is a 2 story building, the boys met upstairs, no adults were even allowed on the 2nd floor. If an adult would ask a Scout to do something you would get a look like you had three heads! Webelos would come to visit the troop and never come back. Boys living within walking distance to the meeting place would travel 15 miles to join other troops. I was asked to take over and make changes, it's been hard but we are making progress. Two years latter, we still suffer from the bad reputation we earned, it's tough to overcome something like that.

jb47, I've asked the committee for an additional ASM or two, there is no one. I've got 14 years of unit leader experience, I think I'll know when I need a break. When you have most of your Scouts coming from single (mostly mom only) families you don't get much help on camping trips. As far as limiting the boy's options, before I was SM not one of these boys ever went canoeing and kayaking, backpacking, or on bike hikes. The only thing they did was car camp because it's easy and doesn't take a lot of imagination or planning by the boys or adults. I guess if I'm limiting their experiences then the committee needs to find someone else to take the job.

"The adults coordinate, plan, and execute the program because of their calendar constraints". I don't think the adults setting the dates constitutes coordinating, planning and executing an entire program. The Scouts could choose any date they want but then they would need to find the adults to go with them. Good luck with that in our troop. If it wasn't for myself and my assistant using most of our vacation time to get weekends off throughout the year our Scouts wouldn't go camping at all and we wouldn't have a troop! A little bit too high of a price to pay for being total boy led. Our Scouts are no where near coordinating with the adults, calendar dates, logistics of travel and equipage yet but we are working on it.

Barry, I guess I misunderstood your question about goals so let me take another stab at it. My goals for them could be summed up in a story about our latest Eagle Scout who turned 18 recently. When I became SM this young man was what I would consider lazy and would not do anything unless it benefited him. When he began working on his Eagle project we had a talk. We talked about how he was an example to the other Scouts. We talked about how he was an important part of the troop and how important it would be in life to always do something more than was expected, more than the bare minimum. The I asked him to be the Troop Instructor, I thought he would say no but he surprised me and said he'd like to give it a try. Well he was great at it! It a short period of time I saw this Scout do a complete turn around. When he turned 18 he asked to become an ASM and he does a good job with that too. He has a job in the local hospital and has a great deal of responsibility. I know the personnel manager for the hospital and he says he does a great job. So if you ask what my vision is than this is it. That the Scouts in my troop get enough out of their time here to one day say "hey I was in Scouts and it was great fun and it really helped me".

Well I could write a book in response to the posts so far but I'll try to be brief. E92: Scheduling camping trips: Both myself and my 1st Assistant work swing shift and most weekends, we use lots of vacation just to get off for camping trips which must be scheduled up to a year in advance so letting boys choose when they go on trips would probably result in not enough adults available. I agree boys need to be able to fail in order to learn, hey that's real life! Brent: COR is a past SM and not trained although he is going to take training. He was SM of the troop years ago, and your right I think he's hung up on "Boy Led". "Patrol Method" might be more to his liking! EDad: Goals? I wish they had goals. Any suggestions? They are working on completing a long distance bike trail section at a time. Beavah: Elections seem to be mostly about who wants to do the job, not necessarily the best person for the job.Lately the youngest patrol member gets PL. I'm willing to allow most any change they would like to try. COR says he use to appoint the most qualifies Scouts as SPL and PLs. We have and use the Troop Resource books. My vision for an 18 y.o. heading out to the real world, hopefully he will have the life skills needed to get started in life on his own. JB47: Great story. I guess boy led is in the eyes of the beholder. Thanks for the great advice.

We have a small troop of about 18 boys (of which about a dozen are active) in two patrols. I (the SM) dont know if it could be defined as Boy Led but he are some of the responsibilities that they have: Elections every 6 months for SPL and PL with most other positions appointed by SPL. The troop has minimum qualifications for SPL (active, 1st Class). PLC plans annual camping program with some troop guidelines to ensure a variety to the schedule. PLC needs to schedule one each, bike hike, backpacking trip, canoe trip, summer camp. Where they go is up to the PLC, the specific dates are chosen by the SM. PLC plans meetings including topic of instruction and game or activity. Patrols alternate monthly on taking lead on troop meetings and planning quarterly Courts of Honor. Patrols choose Grubmaster, plan menu and shop for their own food. An adult will usually check the menu and might make suggestions. Hopefully PL makes sure his Scouts get fed! Patrols camp as individual groups and have their own camping equipment which they are responsible for. Troop tries to follow a definite chain of command with the SM working with the SPL who in turn works with the PLs. SM tries to keep other parents out of the process but is not always successful! I would like to know how this fairs with other troops. One of the problems I see is that the boys will only do the minimum, if any, planning or preparation. The other problem I have is that our COR is vehemently against the Boy Led Troop concept. I think there is more the Scouts could do but every time there is a failure I hear and thats why I dont like this Boy Led Troop idea. So how does your troop define Boy Led?

Most of our votes revolve around expenditures.

Good point Beavah, In our troop we have "Parent Meetings" where ever parent is encouraged to attend. However the only parents that attend are committee members, rarely do I ever see a parent attend. As the SM I have refrained from voting on issues as per the Troop Committee Guide Book which seems pretty clear; "The Scoutmaster is not actually a member of the troop committee and has no vote". I was just wondering if there was someway I could have a say in what's going on.

Found this link to the 2000 edition of the Troop Committee Guide Book: http://www.bacarrowhead.org/training/TroopCommitteeGuidebook.pdf