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theysawyoucomin'

NEVER GIVE A BUM A THIRD CHANCE?

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We have a scout named Jerry Sienfeld(not really). Well last year old Jerry was caught stealing. Recently he had to be told repeatedly not to put his hands on other people. As he was walking away from the ASM he called the ASM a jerk.

On a recent camporee George(not real name) and Kramer(AGAIN NOT REAL NAME)were having an argument long after lights out yelling between tents. George exclaimed "You $uck". Kramer then explained how he had been doing something with George's mother "all night long".

All totally unsat behavior.

As a Webelos II leader I am on the Troop Committee and I don't like what I see. There's a vacant C.O. that already owns a Troop flag. It's looking quite inviting.

My question is, How much foul language and bad behavior is a SM to put up with before throwing the garbage overboard. Some of the well behaved kids are beginning to leave. Do we try to save the cr@p of the crop only to lose the cream?

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Save the cream and deal with the crap up to a point. The SM and ASM's need to meet with the committee to determine how to handle the situation so they are all on the same page. If the bad behavior or language starts, give them one warning and tell them that the next time will be the ticket home. You can either approach the individual parents or announce the guidelines to all parents. Any boy who persists in acting in an unscoutlike manner who disrupts the program and is disrespectful to the leaders after being warned will be sent home. Regardless of if it is after lights out or not. Regardless of how far the camp is. Take another adult and escort him out of camp, to the gate and wait for his parents to arrive. Hopefully, the parents will rectify the situation on the ride home. The committee can be notified and decide if further action needs to take place. Boys will be boys, but stealing, not keeping their hands off of others, calling the leaders (or boys) names and filthy language about someone's mother on a repeated basis has to be dealt with......or you will lose everyone else.

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Unfortunately, I think Beaver makes some good points. It's regrettably easy for bad Scouts to drive good Scouts out of a troop and out of Scouting.

 

Frankly, I've probably been too chicken in dealing with these kinds of problems, often repeatedly correcting Scouts rather than making it clear that repeated bad behavior will not be tolerated.

 

In my experience, this is a fairly common problem. I await with interest further comments on how to deal with this kind of situation.

 

 

 

Seattle Pioneer

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How much do you put up with? In my unit, none.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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Hi All

 

What about the parents? Do they care, do they want to care, and do they want to be involved? How would you feel if you just found out your son had this pattern of behavior for some time, but no one told you until after the last straw?

 

Sometimes we scouters forget that we are just one small cog the parents machine of making their son into a man. Sometime we let this program go to our heads because we are leaders in a values program. We think of ourselves as the character experts for each family, but we are really only one piece in the puzzle of their sons life.

 

Now maybe the parents don't care and we do have to make hard choices, but more often then not, they care very much and they have a lot of influence in the matter. My humble suggestions are call the parents and inform them of the problems. Request their help and guidance and see where that goes first.

 

I love this scouting stuff

 

Barry

 

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We've recently had a couple of incidents that have forced us to revamp our discipline policy. We haven't finalized it yet, but here is the gist of it:

 

Scout gets a verbal warning, if that is not sufficient to cease the offending behavior, upon consultation with the ASM's, the scout is given an 'official' warning, and parents are notified and asked to attend a conference with the Scoutmaster. ( SM and staff reserve the right to immediately send any scout home should the behavior be particularly dangerous or disruptive ).

 

The scout is then considered to be on a probationary status for 1-3 months, where he is on a zero-tolerance policy for any more offending behavior. Break the rules again, and the scout is suspended from the troop for 30 days. Before reinstatement, the scout and parents must have a conference with the SM.

 

Repeat offenders will be referred to the Committee, where expulsion from the troop may be considered.

 

 

Documenting this policy was motivated due to our recent situation with a scout we had to suspend for 3 months. The parents are trying to minimize the scouts behavior and are not supporting the SM and staff. I don't want to lose my good scouts due to the actions of this scout.

 

My staff and I are finalizing this and will present it to the SPL and staff next week for comment.

 

The way we look at it, Scouting is a priviledge. You earn that priviledge by living by the Scout Oath and the Scout Laws, if you don't, yer outta here!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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We had a scout that was much worse...

 

He double-dipped his chips

Refused to celebrate Festivus

Killed independent George

Spit one magic loogie

Stole my marble rye

Went beyond BO, had BBO

Failed the Architecture merit badge

Eventually joined the Van Buren Boys...

 

These are times when the SM needs to step up, take control and show leadership. Counsel first, discipline second, expel third.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by SemperParatus)

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Trevorum,

What I mean is foul language & bad behavior isn't tolerated.

 

I double dip all the time ;)

 

I have even re-gifted ;)

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10(This message has been edited by evmori)

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I have to say before I answer the question that I am troubled that a scout leader would use terms like bum, garbage, and cr@p when refering to children, even undisciplined children. I have had to counsel well behaved and poorly behaved scouts and I have even had to send two perhaps three home in nearly 30 years. But I have never even been tempted to use such derogatory terms toward a child. I am equally troubled that it was not addressed before now.

 

That being said. The BSA instructs its leaders to counsel scouts as needed. To counsel with parents when needed. You are also instructed that when safety or the effective delivery of the program is at stake to send the scout home and to have the committee and parents meet to work out a solution or to end the boys membership in the unit.

 

In my experience most bad behavior in scouts was a result of low self esteem, poor home environment, or bad habits (or a combination thereof). In all but the rarest of circumstances positive role models and positive counseling EARLY in the cycle solved the problems and helped the scout. But if their bad behavior contines after that effort you need to separate the scout from the troop activities and get the committee involved to find a solution.

 

BW(This message has been edited by Bob White)

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To All,

Thank you for your replies and your counsel. When a well behaved boy quits because of the actions of an ill mannered boy he is letting those who are inferior to him(by thought, word and deed) shape his destiny.

Totally unacceptable.

 

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I've experienced bad behavior from all walks of life. It can happen in the best of families and the worst of families. The common denominator isn't income. It's the parents.

 

What bothers me is leaders who tolerate disrespectful behavior for any reason. There is no reason for a Scout to disrespect a leader.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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While I agree that most boys will internalize the values by osmosis, either sooner or later, some never will. I prefer to spend my time and energy on the former, rather than the latter. I get them for an hour and a half a week -- as good as we are, it's tough to overcome the other 166 hours. Besides, by the time we get them, their personalities and demeanors are largely formed. I'm not Father Flanagan, and this ain't Boys' Town.

 

We've done parents' conferences for infractions a lot less serious than than what uz2bnowl described in his opening post...

 

KS

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