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Per WSJ -BSA may declare bankruptcy

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1 minute ago, Eaglein87 said:

Does anyone know if Chartering Organizations have been named in any of these suits?

I suspect not.  This is a matter of suing those with deep pockets.  Each charter org would be alot of cost to sue and there are questions of links to deep pockets, etc.  

 

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Not all CO's just the ones where the alleged SA took place. I would think that a prosecutor would go after National, and all those involved which would include Chartering Org especially if it was a church (deep pockets). When it happens (because it will) will not bode well for CO sponsorship of BSA Troops. Already hearing grumblings from CO's on this issue. Church members are wary of possible litigation that may Trickle down. We have a major problem folks.

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52 minutes ago, Eaglein87 said:

Not all CO's just the ones where the alleged SA took place. I would think that a prosecutor would go after National, and all those involved which would include Chartering Org especially if it was a church (deep pockets). When it happens (because it will) will not bode well for CO sponsorship of BSA Troops. Already hearing grumblings from CO's on this issue. Church members are wary of possible litigation that may Trickle down. We have a major problem folks.

I wouldn't be surprised to see some additional transparency around volunteer background checks.  Today we fill out an application and send it in.  We really don't get feedback on that application.  I could see something where national will have to process the application and acknowledge the volunteer passes before they become an officially registered adult.

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1 hour ago, Eaglein87 said:

Does anyone know if Chartering Organizations have been named in any of these suits?

lawyers get quite specific on who they sue and why

some factors  they use to decide, funds and insurance policy, higher you go in the org structure generally more funds and insurance liability they have access to,

state of such orgs and their rules for liability issues, some states make it easier to sue than others.

once this case is settled and national does dissolve and lawyers cant as easily sue new org.

they will probably then go after individual councils and CO's where the crimes were committed,

this is similar to church scandals, for churchs, Vatican being foreign cant easily sue the Vatican, so they went after each US based dioceses instead, each dioceses is equivalent to scout local councils

 

 

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On 12/16/2018 at 2:57 PM, PACAN said:

Wow...amazing how fast the councils are trying to separate themselves from National.  All the notices are almost identical as if "someone" had prepared a boilerplate for each council.  We hope National can get out of their mess but it's not our problem.

Well I mean councils and National are completely separate 501c3 organisations. It's not so much distancing as it is providing correct, clear information.

I've already had plenty of units talk about folding or not paying recharter fees because they are afraid the BSA is about to disappear. Councils are just trying to calm the waters. 

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1 hour ago, Eaglein87 said:

Not all CO's just the ones where the alleged SA took place. I would think that a prosecutor would go after National, and all those involved which would include Chartering Org especially if it was a church (deep pockets). When it happens (because it will) will not bode well for CO sponsorship of BSA Troops. Already hearing grumblings from CO's on this issue. Church members are wary of possible litigation that may Trickle down. We have a major problem folks.

Yes, I have seen COs (only when churches) named as many times the individual, church, council and national are all being sued at once.  

https://www.ajc.com/news/breaking-news/another-georgia-boy-scout-leader-sued-for-sex-abuse/zHH6ygpw9CAlhnygOVpCXP/

https://nypost.com/2018/07/24/4-men-sue-boy-scouts-of-america-over-alleged-sexual-abuse/

I’m sure more are coming 

https://www.classaction.com/child-sexual-abuse/boy-scout-lawsuit/

 

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8 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

So anyone want to take guess as to whether a CO (church) in this case will want to take risk of sponsoring any current or future BSA Troops?

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22 minutes ago, Eaglein87 said:

So anyone want to take guess as to whether a CO (church) in this case will want to take risk of sponsoring any current or future BSA Troops?

It was tough to find new COs before this, or keep the legacy COs....

It's going to be difficult to find new ones.

 

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9 minutes ago, desertrat77 said:

It was tough to find new COs before this, or keep the legacy COs....

It's going to be difficult to find new ones.

 

Out of some fairness to the BSA here.  This seems to be a generic problem facing any youth serving organization.  How do you make sure that your adult volunteers do not abuse youth?

The BSA's error was that they had a list of known offenders yet were loose enough in vetting the new volunteers that they didn't catch the problems.

  • Upvote 1

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40 minutes ago, ParkMan said:

Out of some fairness to the BSA here.  This seems to be a generic problem facing any youth serving organization.  How do you make sure that your adult volunteers do not abuse youth?

The BSA's error was that they had a list of known offenders yet were loose enough in vetting the new volunteers that they didn't catch the problems.

Catholic Church, USA swimming, USA Gymnastics, US Soccer all have had issues.   Any group that deals with youth better have strong YPT training and background checks or face lawsuits.   

This is not BSA unique.  For example, see this law that went into effect this year   

https://unitedsoccercoaches.org/web/web/News/Articles/March_2018/New_Law_Brings_New_Responsibility_to_Youth_Coaches.aspx

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1 hour ago, desertrat77 said:

It was tough to find new COs before this, or keep the legacy COs....

It's going to be difficult to find new ones.

 

Perhaps adopt the British model which I believe @Cambridgeskip  described - no CO's, rather parent groups?  

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1 hour ago, ParkMan said:

Out of some fairness to the BSA here.  This seems to be a generic problem facing any youth serving organization.  How do you make sure that your adult volunteers do not abuse youth?

The BSA's error was that they had a list of known offenders yet were loose enough in vetting the new volunteers that they didn't catch the problems.

True, but I'm thinking primarily of the public's perception of the BSA as this issue continues to unfold.  Previously, many potential COs didn't want the extra work or potential liability.  I'd say that the reluctance level to charter is going to be much higher now.

Edited by desertrat77

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1 hour ago, RememberSchiff said:

Perhaps adopt the British model which I believe @Cambridgeskip  described - no CO's, rather parent groups?  

RS, I think that is the ticket.  The parents are the ultimate stakeholders when it comes to the safety of their children. 

Also pondering:  is there anything barring a CO, a group of parents, or scouters leaders, from conducting their own background checks on applicant adults?  I'm sure there is a legal hoop or two (consent forms, credible security sources, etc).  There may be an extra fee.  But it would be worth the trouble to catch someone who may have slipped through the net in one background check.  It would also show due diligence on the part of the unit, if I'm using that phrase correctly.

Edited by desertrat77

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4 minutes ago, desertrat77 said:

True, but I'm thinking primarily of the public's perception of the BSA as this issue continues to unfold.  Previously, many potential COs didn't want the extra work or potential liability.  I'd say that the reluctance level to charter is going to be much higher now.

Perhaps, but I think it's addressable.

  • These lawsuits are from events of 30 years ago.
  • The BSA has significantly stronger YPT training today
  • The BSA has significantly more stringent YPT rules today
  • The BSA has a much more thorough adult vetting process today.

 

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