Eagle Problems....BIG

[Eagle92 110]

Ok I posted this in the NEW DEFINITION OF ACTIVE thread, but since someone mentioned the new policy here, i think it deserves to be posted here.

 

What I find interesting is that the new definition of "ACTIVE" Is different than the one from the BSA's July 2007 edition of the RULES and REGULATIONS book, page 6, found here

 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/8919606/Rules-and-Regulations-of-the-Boy-Scouts-of-America

 

Active

Clause 1 An active member is one who, with the approval of parent or guardian if necessary, becomes a member of a unit; obligates himself or herself to attend the meetings regularly, fullfills a member's obligations to the unit, subscribes to the Scout Oath or code specific to his or her program; and participates in a program based upon a member's age as promulgated form time to time by the Boy Scouts of America.

 

What I find interesting is that the RULES AND REGULATIONS do allow the unit to downgrade a member from active to "ASSOCIATE" a term that I've only seen once, the 3rd. ed. SM HB. Again page 6 of the Rules and Regulations

 

Associate

Clause 2. Any youth member who, in the judgment of the unit leader and unit committee, is unable top carry out the requirements of active membership may be carried on the unit records as an associate, provided the individual attends at least one meeting of the unit within a year and in all other aspects is guided by the obligations of an active member.

 

So is it me, or is there a major disconnect between the the Advancemnt Policies and Procedures, and the BSA's Rules and Regulations, which supersede everything except the by-laws?

[desertrat77 1144]

Perhaps one page more?(This message has been edited by desertrat77)

[John-in-KC 311]

This is my final post in this thread. It is time, and past time, to let this thread go "below the fold."

 

To the regulars: Look at our behavior online here. We have criticized and ridiculed the OP, Ms Summer. Ask yourself: Would you come back and tell the end of the story if you had been treated this way?

 

She owes us nothing at all. This is not a fee for service. We do the best we can with the resources we have. We make judgment calls on how to support a Scout, Scouter, or parent. This one may or may not have been a bad call. I'm almost certain, though, we will never know.

 

To Ms Summer, I simply say I hope your son learned and grew through the appeal process, whether he was awarded Eagle or not. Godspeed.

[Eagle732 27]

MDsummer has given me her word that she will let us know when she gets the results from National. Knowing both parties and a great deal of inside information about this situation I have no reason not to take her for her word. I believe she has been totally truthful in telling her side of the story. Much of what she has told me privately I know to be true from other sources. Many here believe this is a hoax or that she has received the answer but since it was not in her favor she has not responded. This is not true. Some have questioned the truthfulness of those who have information on this situation, that is sad. A few of you have been especially mean spirited and have made statements of "facts" such as the recent statement "there was NO appeal" without knowledge of the situation.That is unfortunate. Although I have never met mdsummer personally I have traded emails and I've spoken with her on the phone. I believe she is a concerned mom who strongly believes her son deserves Eagle. I know people who know her two sons, the younger of which is the troop's current SPL. I know the SM, he's a good guy and dedicated Scouter who believes in the program. He and I have trade program information, in fact he gave me a CD with pictures from his last Philmont trek, a trek that mdsummer's son was on. (great group photo!) I hope this all comes to an end soon so that mdsummer's son can get the answer he deserves.

[WAKWIB 107]

Thanks for the update.

[Twocubdad 665]

Wow! It's remarkable the effort people will put in to perpetuate a hoax!

 

Question: does this thread get an asterisk in the record book since it's been juiced by so many people just wanting to see the pages turn?

[evmori 11]

There is STILL no answer from National? What did this kid do?

 

You claim to know a lot about this Eagle732. How about some more facts for those who are interested! If there are any facts.

[Eagle732 27]

Twocubdad proves my point! To insinuate that I am perpetuating a hoax is equivalent to calling me a liar.

[WAKWIB 107]

Sorry Eagle732. All the folks who cry hoax have no proof of such. In the Almighty Court of Wannabee Scouting Experts, I suppose all are guilty until proven innocent.

 

 

[evmori 11]

Twocubdad proves my point! To insinuate that I am perpetuating a hoax is equivalent to calling me a liar.

 

Well, Eagle732, since this appeal is taking an exceptionally abnormal amount of time and you seem (at least from your posts) to have some knowledge of what is going on tell us what is going on and whay it is taking so long. All we want is the facts and to this point it appears there are many facts we are missing.

[nldscout 18]

Well I will say this. I have a friend who was the Field Director in a council I was previously in who is now at national, dealing in the Boy Scout area. We have stayed in contact over the years.

 

In asking him a simple question "Is there any appeal at national that is over 6 months old" His response after checking was "NO". I asked the question this way, because I didn't want to know any personnal information, just if an appeal was pending.

 

When you file an appeal, upon receiving it, national sends you and the council a letter acknowledging receipt. So unless someone can show us the letter you get from national after they receive your appeal, I will stick with what I know is true.

 

That being, there is no appeal pending.

[ljnrsu 10]

Eagle732 thank you for your post, like you I also have had recent contact with mdsummer but refrained from posting. There are posters that dont believe what I post is the truth or factual so I havent bothered posting additional info. Twocubdad,ev, among others has without saying it outright called me a liar and a perpetrator of a hoax. Based on what? Preconceived ideas of how long appeals should take. Prior experience that doesnt reflect Nationals current appeals procedures.

Ev what facts do you feel are still missing?

 

[WAKWIB 107]

Maybe wrong, but reading through this over the course of time, I didn't think the appeal to National was initiated over 6 months ago. Folks in contact with mdsummer could answer that. But it seems a post to this thread about a month ago said it went there in Nov.

Is that close to correct? If so, the way I do math, it's only a little over 3 months old. I wondered why folks were crying "this is taking too long." Maybe they thought the appeal to National went in way back in April 09 when this thread started.

[evmori 11]

Ev what facts do you feel are still missing?

 

What facts? What did this kid do to give everyone up to the council level the reason to turn him down for Eagle? There is more to this story than we have been told and apparently there are a few who post here that know more yet refuse to post it. All that does is lessen the credibility of the whole story.

 

From what I have read in this and another forum, this has been going on since around the beginning of 2009. Well over 6 months ago.

 

nldscout maybe you should ask your friend how old he oldest appeal out there is?

 

 

[WAKWIB 107]

ljnrsu wrote on 1/2/10 "Ev and vol_scouter, I can corroborate mdsummer45s story. In a PM I offered my help in assisting her, which she accepted and between May 19 and Sept 2 we each exchanged in excess of 50 emails and more than a few phone conversations. She also faxed me copies of Troop, District and Council letters of denial. I also know by name another member of the forums that also assisted her in critiquing and editing Justins appeal to National.

Mdsummer called me on Dec 2 after getting off the phone with National. At which time she informed me that the appeal was still sitting at National waiting to be given to the Appeal Committee and that the earliest would be mid Jan before she received a response from National."

 

Evmori, Don't get the time of the appeal application to National confused with the length of time of this thread. When the thread started on 4/1/10 (not a year ago, BTW) the scout and his mom were still jacking around with the troop trying to figure out the status of a scoutmaster conference. Factor in the troop appeal, district appeal, council appeal etc. this was a process not an event.

I know that it's a lot more fun to pretend this is a hoax, or try to speculate on how bad this scout must have been. I think, however, it was a long string of "hurry-up-and-wait" seasoned with a number of snafu's.