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BSA merchandise should be "Made in America" not China - Online Petition

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So, this may be a silly question stemming from my lack of experience...

 

I've read this thread completely and a variety of other threads concerning uniform rules and standards.

 

What's stopping a troop from adopting/purchasing its own uniform? If there are no real 'uniform police', if troops can vote on certain parts already (like neckerchiefs), if wearing and meeting current uniform guidelines is encouraged, but not actually enforced, etc.

 

Could a troop decide...

 

Hey, we want American made, and we found this company that can provide similar pants, shirts, socks, whatever at a price and quality level we feel is a good value, made right here. We are going to buy those instead and sew on official emblems and patches rather than buying the overly expensive, inferior quality (insert your criticism here), made in China official uniform from the scout shop.

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A Venturing Crew can design anything they want for a uniform.

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Well, if it was up to me, I'd pick a BDU style pattern sewn up in a modern wicking type/microfiber cloth. My BDUs were about the most comfortable and practice uniform I ever wore.

 

Or maybe I would eschew bifurcated pants all together. My kilt is pretty comfortable too...

Edited by Tiger Foot

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 Although Congress has authorized the BSA to wear active duty uniforms (i.e. Sea Scouts and BSA's first uniforms were US Army uniforms with Boy Scout buttons) today such practices for appearing military are now inappropriate for Scout wear.  This all changed back in the 1970's with the Oscar de la Renta uniform being anti-Vietnam/anti-war knee jerk reaction in society.

 

In the 1960's we had our full scout uniforms, but our backup clothing was all military surplus as was most of our camping equipment.  The lucrative reaction of anti-military was a boom for profiteering of the Scout Shops when they then pulled the sale of scout equipment out of the department stores and into their own Scout Stores and catalogs.

 

I'd go with the kilt.... The BSA hasn't figured out the historical significance of the kilt so until they do, enjoy. 

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So, this may be a silly question stemming from my lack of experience...

 

I've read this thread completely and a variety of other threads concerning uniform rules and standards.

 

What's stopping a troop from adopting/purchasing its own uniform? If there are no real 'uniform police', if troops can vote on certain parts already (like neckerchiefs), if wearing and meeting current uniform guidelines is encouraged, but not actually enforced, etc.

 

Could a troop decide...

 

Hey, we want American made, and we found this company that can provide similar pants, shirts, socks, whatever at a price and quality level we feel is a good value, made right here. We are going to buy those instead and sew on official emblems and patches rather than buying the overly expensive, inferior quality (insert your criticism here), made in China official uniform from the scout shop.

 

Well since the scout uniform is optional and assuming you do not call it a "scout uniform" etc , I see problems only at Council/National activities.

 

-  attending a Jamboree, Philmont, other BSA HA with a Council. Councils are usually insistent upon uniform. No uniform no go. I would not buy the new Centennial uniform and Council would not accept my old Made in USA uniform. I did not go to Jambo.

 

- Council "leader" training NYLT, Wood Badge this is where the uniform police nest. I think a scout without official uniform will be allowed at NYLT, but his patrol will be punished at uniform inspection and it will be downhill from there.

 

- Some summer scout camps are strict about "official scout uniforms" for photos, colors, dinner. 

 

- You will not be popular at RT, boo-hoo.

 

There are Congressional Charter restrictions on Scouting uniforms resembling military uniforms, yet the Sea Scouts have done so. Explorers too. Ironic, as scout uniforms were derived from military uniforms.

 

Oh your hand-me-downs would be limited to just your troop members.

 

Wish you success. My scouts would like just a UnderArmor T, cargo pants, ball cap, no necker. :o

Edited by RememberSchiff

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I was just speaking hypothetically, sorry. I am waaaaaaay to new at this to be arguing changes

 

I've read a lot of comments saying that the uniform is optional, don't be the uniform police, don't punish scouts who can't afford a uniform, and that sort of thing.

 

In this thread lots of folks have made very good critiques of the official (but optional) uniform, so I wondered why not just pick your own uniform that meets the criteria agreed upon by your troop. I understand the benefits of being uniform, your answer explains (at least some of the reasons) why the official uniform is important despite being optional. Thanks!

Edited by Tiger Foot

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What's stopping a troop from adopting/purchasing its own uniform? If there are no real 'uniform police', if troops can vote on certain parts already (like neckerchiefs), if wearing and meeting current uniform guidelines is encouraged, but not actually enforced, etc.

 

Could a troop decide...

 

 

A troop I know in AZ adopted the old BSA 60's style uniform. Had the pants made to the right color, Shirt were surplus. The bling and patches are modern day but they are trying to get the old-fashioned patches online when they can. Hats were custom made garrison covers.

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A troop I know in AZ adopted the old BSA 60's style uniform. Had the pants made to the right color, Shirt were surplus. The bling and patches are modern day but they are trying to get the old-fashioned patches online when they can. Hats were custom made garrison covers.

 

That's not an unofficial uniform!  I have a reproduction 1910 BSA uniform I wore for the centennial and because it has 1910 buttons and collar brass on it, it is official. 

 

The uniform to be "technically" legal needs the proper insignia and the boys working at finding them is correct.  My 1960's uniform has the old OA lodge flap that was removed from service because of it's PC "racial" issue.  Finding community strips is probably the most difficult task, but I like them because meeting another scout within council/district doesn't do much for me when the only thing to tell me this is a number.  If their city/village name is on the shoulder, it's nice!  Never did like Council patches, but they are a great source of income for the councils.

Edited by Stosh

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That's not an unofficial uniform!  I have a reproduction 1910 BSA uniform I wore for the centennial and because it has 1910 buttons and collar brass on it, it is official. 

 

The uniform to be "technically" legal needs the proper insignia and the boys working at finding them is correct.  My 1960's uniform has the old OA lodge flap that was removed from service because of it's PC "racial" issue.  Finding community strips is probably the most difficult task, but I like them because meeting another scout within council/district doesn't do much for me when the only thing to tell me this is a number.  If their city/village name is on the shoulder, it's nice!  Never did like Council patches, but they are a great source of income for the councils.

 

Well, "unofficial" in that it did not come directly from BSA supply at any point. Agree it is a reproduction, ergo not "official" per se.

 

Still classy and cool.

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Well, "unofficial" in that it did not come directly from BSA supply at any point. Agree it is a reproduction, ergo not "official" per se.

 

Still classy and cool.

 

 

The buttons and collar brass did come from BSA supply and in 1910, that's what made a BSA official uniform.  In 1910 there was no uniform, just buttons and brass to be put on a US Army uniform.  At least that's what I have been told.  Later on, US Army contractors started putting BSA labels on US Army uniforms and then selling them to the Boy Scouts.  They were the same uniform with a BSA or US Army label.

 

Hunting down BSA collar brass and two different sizes of buttons was quite a challenge the way it was.  The sad part of the whole process is reminiscent of the 1960's when Civil War reenactors used historical uniforms and ruined them reenacting.    Same happens to historical uniforms.  Eventually only the moth eaten ones that got stuffed away in some attic treasure trove will be in museums.

Edited by Stosh

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"We are not making these products 100% from scratch in America, but we are using our current resources to focus on delivering the most innovative, high quality products we can. "

now now, TAHAWK.... I  realize that it's pert-near impossible for any entrepreneurial company to do 100% USA materials, construction, and assembly.... year and years of bad policy have pretty much cemented that.  We all know that.  But if you can find a product that that does as much as they reasonably can, I say support it.... don't undermine it.

 

So, this may be a silly question stemming from my lack of experience...

 

I've read this thread completely and a variety of other threads concerning uniform rules and standards.

 

What's stopping a troop from adopting/purchasing its own uniform? If there are no real 'uniform police', if troops can vote on certain parts already (like neckerchiefs), if wearing and meeting current uniform guidelines is encouraged, but not actually enforced, etc.

 

Could a troop decide...

 

Hey, we want American made, and we found this company that can provide similar pants, shirts, socks, whatever at a price and quality level we feel is a good value, made right here. We are going to buy those instead and sew on official emblems and patches rather than buying the overly expensive, inferior quality (insert your criticism here), made in China official uniform from the scout shop.

I'd bet if you sew on one of those World Crest patches, you'd be good to go.

 

And as far as the uniform police at camps and such..... I can see an out of uniform type give a person a hard time, but turn them away?  I'd find that hard to believe!....

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now now, TAHAWK.... I  realize that it's pert-near impossible for any entrepreneurial company to do 100% USA materials, construction, and assembly.... year and years of bad policy have pretty much cemented that.  We all know that.  But if you can find a product that that does as much as they reasonably can, I say support it.... don't undermine it.

+1

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I vigorously agree.

 

But what is the problem with judgments made on the basis of facts?

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