District Review of Eagle Project Books

[SemperParatus]

As part of our District's Eagle Scout process, once the the Eagle Application has been verified by Council (all dates are compared with Council records), the Eagle Candidate is to turn his Eagle Project Workbook (consisting of the project plan, final report, etc.) in for District Review prior to the scheduling of the Board of Review. Now, our District Advancement Committee has turned the whole workbook process into quite an academic exercise, resulting in most project plans and final reports encompassing anywhere from 100 - 300 pages of task lists, materials lists, budgeting, volunteer job descriptions, organization charts, exhibits, etc. etc. Definitely more than probably needed...but neverthless the world in which our scouts must navigate through.

 

My issue is with the amount of time our District Advancement Committee spends reviewing the Project Workbook/Final Report in preparation of an Eagle Board of Review. Of our Troop's last five eagle scouts, 2 have waited in excess of 9 weeks between the time their book was turned in to District for final review and being contacted to set up the EBOR, 1 waited 5 weeks, and 2 waited less than 2 weeks (they were both 18). In all cases, the District noted that each Project workbook was exemplary and were impressed by both the leadership and documentation presented. So, I'm trying to figure out why in the world it takes over two months for a review of a Scout's work. As the Eagle Advisor to our troop, I know for a fact that each book can be read cover to cover in two hours or less.

 

In the last instance, I spoke with the Advancement Committee Chairman, who blamed it on 'we are all just volunteers'. Sorry, I can't accept that answer at all as an excuse for sitting on a book review for over two months. The process is simply the AC Chair handing the book over to another Advancement Committee member to do the review and the EBOR, so maybe its simply the luck of the draw of getting a scouter that doesn't have the time. Clearly, the 18 year old candidate gets priority, but 2 weeks vs. 2 months!!

 

Just curious, how long does your District/Council take to perform a final review of an Eagle Scout's Project documentation?

[John-in-KC]

Oh, about 20 minutes before we bring the Candidate into the room for his EBOR...

 

So far, I've been fortunate to sit Boards where the Candidate did something pretty WOW.

[Eagle69]

In my council/district they spend 0 hours on final review. It isn't done. Once the project is approved by the District they don't see the workbook again until the Eagle Board of Review. The project is done when the group that benefits from it says its done and the SM generally looks over the final write up and if satisfied contacts the District for an Eagle Board of Review.

[evmori]

The Eagle boards in my district are scheduled as needed which is usually weekly. When all the paperwork is turned over to the DAC, the EBOR is scheduled. Usually, a Scout waits no longer than a week.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[eisely]

Semper,

 

That is way over the top. We have a designated volunteer who reviews the plan before execution and nobody at the district sees the workbook again until EBOR time. If anybody even suggested what you are experiencing there would be a revolution at all levels. Somebody is on a power trip.

[dzierzak]

WAAAYYY too long. Once the project is finished and all paperwork is turned in, average time 'til the BOR here is 1-2 weeks. Kind of sounds like adding requirements?

 

ed dz

 

[scoutldr]

Ditto what Eagle69 said. I sit on lots of EBOR as the District rep, and I have never seen a project workbook in excess of, say, 20 pages, including photos. 100-300 pages??? That's ridiculous.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

[OldGreyEagle]

In such a district, I woudl love to see a scout come along with a knowledgeable parent and after the Eagle project is over say no, I am not doing this, its adding to the requirements and either give me a board of review or I will appeal it. The scout would eventually win, and make the supportes of the workbook look like the maroons they are. I wonder if such a youth exists?

[Beavah]

Now, our District Advancement Committee has turned the whole workbook process into quite an academic exercise, resulting in most project plans and final reports encompassing anywhere from 100 - 300 pages of task lists, materials lists, budgeting, volunteer job descriptions, organization charts, exhibits, etc. etc. Definitely more than probably needed...but neverthless the world in which our scouts must navigate through.

 

Holy Smoke!

 

Yah, hmmmm....

 

Yeh know, one of da things that happens every now and then is people plant good ideas. "Hey, we should encourage kids to include..." "Gee, it would have helped this lad if we had asked him to..."

 

After yeh plant enough good ideas and give 'em a bunch of years to grow, yeh can find that you've created a jungle.

 

Time to get out the saws and axes and hatchets and do some trimmin' of that jungle, Semper. Doesn't sound like the process is servin' kids anymore. Sounds like kids are servin' the process. And it's gotten to be so much of a burden even the adults can't keep up with it.

 

Time to trim the jungle. You and your COR need to drop in on da next district committee meetin'.

 

For comparison, every council I've been involved in does project reviews as part of or just prior to the EBOR (or now via email a few days before the scheduled EBOR). No muss, no fuss. And 50 pages of project stuff with all supportin' documents and such would be more than sufficient.

 

Beavah

 

[packsaddle]

All I can say is WOW! I've never heard of anything this extreme before. I feel pretty much the same as all the others so far. Way beyond the call. Our reviews are little more than that, a review. To make sure everything is completed and to make sure the requirements were met. Takes about 20 minutes at the beginning of the BOR.

I actually try to get the boys to be as concise as possible. Kind of like doing a briefing for top brass - who are too busy to read a thesis. I tell the boys that if they can't fit their project documentation into the spaces allotted in the workbook, they are allowed to add pages. This tends to make them more organized and focused. They don't add many. WOW!

[GernBlansten]

Our district handles it a bit differently. When a scout is ready to propose his project, he fills out the proposal part of the workbook and has the SM and CC review and approve. The proposal is then sent to the DAC. If approved, the DAC assigns a district eagle advisor (he has several who work with him) to work directly with the scout. Once the project is completed and written up, he works directly with the district eagle advisor for writeup approval. The project never goes back through the DAC, however when certifying the application, the signed off project workbook must be presented to the district secretaries. Then the BOR can be scheduled.

Since the scout is working one on one with the advisors, the delay varies.

 

Never seen a project over 100 pages. Most are 20 to 30.

[fgoodwin]

I've sat on several EBORs and I've never heard of such a thing.

 

Our council provides two EBORs for the candidate: the first to review & approve the project proposal; the second is the actual approval of the Eagle rank.

 

District "pre-review" of the project proposal seems a bit much to me; I wonder what is covered there that can't be covered during the actual proposal review? Or is the purpose of the pre-review to make the actual proposal review & approval a formality?

 

I agree with what the others have said, if push came to shove, I think a Scout would win on appeal as this certainly walks & talks like a dreaded added requirement.

[scoutingagain]

In our district the Eagle Application is submitted to the District, along with the Eagle Project Workbook. The last two EBORs were scheduled within 2 weeks of the submittal of the documents. Both Workbooks were around 30 pages +- and both were fairly substantial projects IMHO. 100 - 300 pages? I can't concieve of what information could be included that would increase the page count to that number. Maybe a personal biography of everyone that helped on the project?

 

Yeah. Someone needs to politely suggest the District Advancement Chair benchmark what he's doing compared to others around the country. A request for a Regional Review?

 

 

 

SA(This message has been edited by scoutingagain)

[John-in-KC]

Fred,

 

Are you saying a full-up BOR to review the ELSP?

 

Now, there is, in ACP&P #33088, a requirement for a member of the Council/District Advancement Committee to review and approve ELSPs before they begin.

 

I cannot imagine that folks have so much time on their hands that they can do a BOR level review of each ELSP proposed...

 

I guess truth is stranger than fiction.

[SemperParatus]

Thanks everyone. Yeah, I knew our District has been running amock on this for some time. Every few years or so, a new crop of adults makes a run at throttling this back and it goes no where. Instead, every year some new 'helpful guidelines' are added to what is 'expected' in the project workbook, that then morph into a 'gotta have'. For example, this past year our eagle candidates are being asked to include an additional spiral notebook in the back of their eagle books that includes a diary of their discussions along the way, preliminary thoughts and drawings, etc etc. Definitely, Twilight Zone stuff!

 

I was asked by someone on the district nominating committee if I would consider the DAC chair position. My fear is that I would be on a slash and burn mission from the start to bring sanity back to the process.