Crew21_Adv

Pmarius,

Greetings and welcome to the forum!

You have been given excellent advice already!

To use a few common clichs "You worst enemy, may someday become your best Ally" Some have suggested that the Committee ask her to assume a committee job or role.

Also, an oldie but a goodie (but maybe not too politically correct "Put up, or shut up!" may equally apply.

Your bad parent may be identifying shortfalls, which I would be thankful for. But not to the extent that is all she is doing. "Everyone's a critic" and "Everyone is entitled to their own opinion"

I have stated in committees and also at work. I don't care for all your complaints, unless you can come to me with a resolution. If you can do it better, by all means, please do it.

I can certainly tell you. I have participated in a few High Performance Teams or Packs and Troops, and some moving towards improvement. But even in the best High Performing Teams, there are occasional "bumps in the road".

Now some other fellow forum members have recommended revoking her membership and maybe her son's membership. Membership revocation may have to be done, for the benefit of the Troop. If that is the final solution, please, advise their family of other Troops in the neighborhood and community. If you are in a very rural area, Lone Scouting may apply.

Another clich', "One man's trash, is another man's treasure". This bad parent may be the best thing that ever happened to another neighboring Troop.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

http://www.cubroundtable.com/shadow/Boy-Scout-Roundtable-guiide-2006-2007.pdf

http://www.boyscouts-ncac.org/pages/30659_roundtable_planning_guides.cfm

BTPS,

Greetings!

I don't expect there is a large enough need for the National Supply Center, BSA to print and stock these guides. So it seems that it has become cost effective for national to print only a few, and to issue this guide electronically to the Councils. Some councils are good enough to publish via their webpages.

I would bet, your District Executive or Senior Field Director for your Council should have access to it each year.

Here are a couple of locations to find the Boy Scout Roundtable Planning Guide. There is a Ventuing Roundtable Guide and a Cub Scout Roundtable guide for sale via the Scoutstuff.org.

I don't know why they BSA doesn't sale the Roundtable guide. Probably too much in cost and it is now easier to issue electronically??

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Darren,

Greetings!

You have heard excellent advice already.

Traditionally, many Scouters pay their own way. Myself and my wife paid our own tuition cost, over the years.

When the Troop (or Pack) can afford it within their annual budget, I often recommend a Scoutership. This year, two of our ASMs are benefiting from a modest Scoutership. Not even half of the tuition, but it does assist just slightly and a small incentive to attend.

Our unit has also recently offered the same Scoutership for NYLT.

When a unit may budget it, I would concur, possibly a full-ride Scoutership. With some expectation of service to the unit.

Hopefully, with four members of your Troop attending Wood Badge, your Troop will really benefit from all that learning and hard work!

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Chuck,

Greetings!

Here is a thought to offer as a Diversity ticket item.

An Enlightenment Trail.

This type of event, I learned in the early 90's, participated in only one in the late 90's. I have heard about it in a few councils, but I do not believe every council conducts this event. But at least this style of event dates a little longer than WOOD BADGE for the 21st Century and the current ticket process. Equally, the Enlightenment or Ten Commandment Trail was highlighted in Scouting magazine a few years ago (circa 96), describing how a specific council conducts their Trail.

Most all councils have Historic Trails, and they are registered with BSA and may earn local Council medals after learning history and conducting a 5-10 mile hike. However, Some Councils have begun Enlightenment Trails, and earned an associated medals and patch by completing a brief Q&A test at the end. Most Enlightenment Trails, visit ten Churches, Mosques, Temples and Shrines, while listening to one verse of the Ten Commandments and a five minute history of that religious faith. It may also be known as the Ten Commandments Hike.

A quick search of Scoutingmagazine.org shows their online articles only go back to 1998, I could not find the article of the hike. But there was an article of The 12-Points Bike Ride, which was adopted from the Scouting magazine article "In Search of Reverence and Understanding," March-April 1996.

Most religious institutions would look at this opportunity as a diversity outreach ministry. They were please to have a staff of Sunday School or Educational directors wait for about 100 plus scouts on a Saturday to hike from institution to institution and arrive at their door steps. Scouts and religious may sometimes stir controversy, but their staff understood all that was requested. These different denominations did not consider this an opportunity for conversion, but they would offer to dispel myths about their denomination. During my hike, there were no prayers or sermons, only a brief history and the next consecutive verse (within their own literature) of the ten commandments. It actually was very fun and educational.

In most councils, these are downtown hikes, so all ages of Cub Scouts, Boy Scout and Venturers may usually all attend. With little risk of mud, or scrapes and bruises, or mosquitoes. And during my hike, most of these religious faith institutions had juice and snacks (sometimes ethnic treats) at each stop for us. So there was little chance of dehydration.

Possibly an Enlightenment Trail (or similar) in your council may be the precise answer for a Diversity Ticket.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

OGE,

Excellent Question..

Just from my own desires and thinking selfishly.. This is what I would like to see..

Where would I like it at?

Believe it or not.. I would say Lebanon, Kansas. There are adventurous things to do from the Washington mountains to the Keys of Florida, from the forest and woods in Maine to sunny San Diego and lets not leave out the Venturers in BSA Councils from Hawaii to Puerto Rico and USVI to Western Alaska, as well as Transatlantic to the Far East Councils. Lebanon, Kansas is the geographic center of the United States of America. The transportation should be much easier to facilitate than moving a Crew all the way across the continent.

What would I like to see at a National Venturing event?

Well, bonding experiences usually are memorable. National Jamboree is a camping event, while NOAC is a dormitory event. I would like to see a national Venturing event offer the option of both. To bond the Venturers together, I would like to see, adventure in the daytime, and entertainment in the afternoon. I would like to activities that may satisfy or touch upon all five Bronze themes. Exposing all Venturers to Outdoors, Arts and Hobbies, Religious and Community Life, Sports and Sea Scouts during one gathering event.

Nearby Lebanon, Kansas, there are large American Indian reservations in Oklahoma, and many plains Indian tribes and heritage groups. Equally, there are Wild West recreated towns, urban educational science and arts museums and a few amusement parks. An Action Alley of this type would be spectacular. Also, looking at Service to America, BSA has teamed up with some larger known service groups, such as Habitat for Humanity, Venturers could probably provide a half day, maybe a whole day of service at a nearby location. Watching a few thousand Venturing teenagers handing over house keys to a deserving family, I doubt they will ever forget. Maybe the geographic center of North America is not on the scale of high adventure in Washington state or snorkeling off of the Florida coast, but there is a sufficient outdoor experience. Another common bonding experience would be music concerts. With video games you can say E or T rated, but for music selections you would have to say selections that do not have mature audience warning, but a family approved genre of Country music, Rock n Roll, Pop Rock each night.

Probably another question to ask may be when to hold an event like this. At least that would be my third question. I'm sure with college semesters, traditional school year, year-round schooling, multi-track school scheduling and the adult advisors work and vacation limitations. I would recommend early mid June to correspond with Flag Day June 15th.

Virginia is on the East Coast with transportation hubs, and many historic sites. The National Jamboree events are spectacular and combined with the July-August months when many Scouts are traditionally off from school. But beyond human control though, the weather seems to hit the extremes if you are camping for ten (or more) days in Virginia. During the last few National Jamborees there have been natural weather phenomena from hurricanes hitting the East Coast to extreme heat waves. So I would recommend Spring Break time or mid June.

Like I said, these are my own selfish requests... But this is what I would like to participate in, if my Crew were to attend a National Venturing event.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Dianna,

Greetings!

I only have a brief moment to reply..

It would be disappointing for a 15 y/o boy, to be told that he will have to demonstrate a skill completely and all over again.

Some of the basic outdoor skills from the BSA Handbook, maybe performed further in depth in Venturing. But few are identical.

In the Venturing/Ranger Handbook. There is a statement about multiple credit. Venturing begins leading towards five different program areas and bronze award, vice merit badges and rank. But still, there are a few items that are similar between the Venturing Handbook and the Boy Scout Handbook. Mutual credit is allowed, but look in the Venturing/Ranger Handbook for the specific statement..

As far as your question regarding council documenting credit. I would say, yes, somewhat. Most all councils have subscribed to Scoutnet. This database helps the maintain the completion status of rank and merit badges. A database is only as good as the information being put into it though. Unlike a unit database, Scoutnet and councils will not document progress towards rank or merit badge. Councils won't document camping days per youth. They will document the completion of merit badges and completion of rank(as submitted on the unit advancement report) and entered into their Scoutnet (or similar database) by the council registrar.

Hope this helps.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

OGE,

Greetings!

Just like Gonzo1, I enjoy using the "Grin and Bear It" from Boy's Life.

Sometimes during the Outdoor Leadership Skills or Basic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation campfire with just the adult learners, I will use those one-liners for transitions between the patrol skits and songs. They are corny and make for good segue or run-ons.

Weekly, at the end of the Crew meeting, during my "Advisors Minute", I may open with one of the Boy's Life jokes before proceeding with a "Thought of the Day". They usually grin (that's about it, when I am jokingly slapping my knee and wiping my eyes.) What a hoot! But then the Venturers will listen to my advice for the week.

There are a few good longer jokes out there. One that I enjoy, when I do an FOS presentation, I tell my fellow Scouts that I was almost late to their Court of Honor.

As I was driving thru the winding roads, to their Pack meeting or Court of Honor, my wife and I came upon a bunch of sheep crossing the road. After sitting there in the lane for a few seconds, I realize that these sheep were not moving from one pasture to the other. There was no sheep herder or famer. These sheep had broken from their fencing and were just standing there, all over the road.

After a minute of watching these sheep, I angrily hit the horn, in the middle of the steering wheel. But no noise came out.

Now I am even more frustrated. I am late. There are sheep in the road. And my car horn doesnt work.

I tell my fellow Scouts. I quickly get out of the car, pop the hood, and shake the wires leading to the car horn. Hurriedly, I slam the car hood, run back to the drivers seat, press on the horn, and hear the loudest noise, which scares the sheep, and they run back to the pasture beside the road.

The road is now clear and all the sheep are running thru the nearby field. I can now rush to the Court of Honor.

My wife looks at me in haste and says Is everything alright?!

And I say,

Of course, Beep repaired!

Hahahahahahaah (snort) Beep Repaired. Be Prepared.

knee slap) Whew!!! I kill me sometimes.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Fellow Venturers and Summer Camp Staff,

Greetings!

If I may add a few comments... My fellow Venturer EMB021, stated it correctly.. but maybe a little too briefly....

Venturers may wear the OA flap, as EMB said. But a Venturing Crew is not allowed to hold elections, OA Elections are only held in the Troop or Team. The Venturer must already have been recognized by his Troop/Team to wear the flap on their OA uniform. (check the Q&A on the oa-bsa.org webpage).

Also, a male Venturer may continue to earn the Boy Scout Ranks if they have already earned First Class Scout in a Troop. They are allowed to wear their Scout rank on the Venturing uniform. Rarely (but it does happen) do units recruit a 14-15 year old brand new Scout. I would expect the uniform guideline allowing male Venturers to wear the rank on their shirt, would be reserved for the First Class Scout rank patch and above; and not for Scout rank thru Second Class rank patches. Essentially, I would not expect to see a 15 y/o Venturer wearing a Tenderfoot Rank patch on their Venturing green uniform shirt.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Gonzo and Fellow Scouters,

Myself coming into this string late. You have already been given excellent advice and thoughts.

While some committee members may hijack a PLC, maybe their ideals were good but their method and approach was in error. Possibly, a fund raising event like this could pay for everyone to attend Summer Camp and pay for a year of programs. (good ideals).

But her delivery method or presenting the idea, should have been brought before the committee as well as the PLC especially if a fund raising event takes place during a regular advancement program meeting night (bad method/approach).

Quiet often, via adult association being a method of Scouting, our SM and ASMs have to hijack the PLC. Maybe hijack is too aggressive a term, but more steer or guide is what we do. As often as we may, our comments sound more like, I dont think skydiving is an approved activity, Dont you think that someone will get hurt if we juggle flaming torches?. And we attempt to steer some PLC discussions Can we achieve any advancement during this next camp out. If we all consider bringing our backpacks to the weekly meeting, we can inventory and see if we are ready for the next campout, and accomplish a Second Class requirement. Often ending with, What do you think? to the SPL and PLC.

Between the personality difference in your Troop Committee, and they do occur in quiet a few units. Either within Scouting, local PTSA, the local churches, community based organization and of course city politics. It sounds so familiar to see you type, that your Troop Committee Secretary feels she is fully trained and completely understands the program. Further that she was not inviting training from yourself. She does not want to hear what you have to say.

As EagleInKY stated, Invite the District Commissioner staff to meet with the committee.

I would invite the Troop Unit Commissioner, Assistant District Commissioner or District Commissioner to conduct the Troop Committee Challenge during a Troop Committee meeting. While they are there, they can discuss real life scenarios, and ethical decision making. Lets say (In a hypothetical presentation. The PLC had an okay plan for advancement for the night, maybe the PLC was going to look at the second class requirements for 5 minutes and play 55 minutes of dodge ball. A little advancement, a lot of fun. But an adult had a plan to pay off Summer Camp in one swoop, if the advancement and program meeting was diverted.) Would this be good vs. good, good vs. bad, or trivial?

Hopefully, the Commissioner staff, can mediate issues and shed some light on the Troop Committee and maybe even some non participating parents. I would personally say, good ideals, but bad approach based on the actions of your Troop Secretary.

Good Luck!

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Fellow Scouters,

Eagle76 brought up a good question. Are adults required to earn the Toten' Chip?

Well the card refers to a Scout, "This certification grants a Scout the right to carry and use woods tools." So while it seems it is not required for adults to earn, it is the smart thing to do. It practically follows the BSA Teaching EDGE ideals. Explain, Demonstrate, Guide and Enable.

Most adults would earn the cards for Outdoor Code, Toten Chip, Whittlin Chip and Firemn Chit during Introduction to Outdoor Leadership Skills and Basic Adult Leadership Outdoor Orientation, when they visit the axe yard, fire pit/fire lay and the campsite selection lessons.

I personally dont carry my cards on me, but rather place them into my binder of training cards. So I would be stuck trying to provide my credentials on a weekend camporee.

While staffing my most recent IOLS, I learned something completely new about the Japanese camping saw, and cutting on the pull stroke. Guess you can say I had a Wish I had a V8 or Holiday Inn Express moment. But this fabulous instructor, (he was really good), omitted the camp shovel being considered a wood tool and its use in the fire lay to move fire and coals. Maybe not as exciting as a pocket knife or ax, but it is still considered a wood tool.

So I would comment, again; while not a requirement, it is a smart practice for adult leaders to earn and obtain the Toten Chip. Ideally, that the leadership may understand the BSA rules and adequately teach our Scouts the wood tools proper use and keep everyone safe. Also, so that we are instructing our youth from the Boy Scout Handbook Second Class requirements, as well as the Guide to Safe Scouting and clarifying when applicable our local Camp and local Troop policies.

Similarly, it is a practice for most Troops to give a Scout up to three chances, and only take one corner of the card for each offense, when the Scout has demonstrated they do not know the rules they have sworn to on the card.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

ASM915 and Fellow Scouters,

With only so many hours to give. I only spent half the day at JLTC years ago, but I did staff the entire NYLT. I have both sets of curriculum, but since the last time I looked at JLTC course material, I did not realize they did not have commitments in the course and this was a council/district addendum. Surprising to me. I thought that was an actual difference.

But the real reason for my response. ASM915, Dang!! Ohio can afford an NYLT course on 150? and Summer Camp on 150?

Move over, I'm bringing my family to Ohio!!!

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

dScouter15,

Greetings!

One council running two and up to three full NYLT courses simultaneously is an accomplishment.

If I may offer my own personal thoughts (and not advicelol).

I thoroughly enjoyed the new NYLT course, the curriculum is educational and at the same time a blast. I would hope that every Scout would attend NYLT once during their tenure.

Before commenting about the benefits and pros, I would like to mention some of the common distracters and cons against NYLT. Between the changes from the JLTC and the NYLT, there are no longer any commitments that the attendees must complete to earn the NYLT compass patch. The skills are easily learned, but not necessarily placed into practice like they once were after attending JLTC. As for attendance. To me it seems to be like Summer Camp issues each year with most Troops. A BSA Summer Camp could cost between 250-500 Dollars for a quality week, high class food, luxurious tents and recently the most costly transportation and gas. Some families will have to make a choice prior to the Summer months; either their Scout attends an NYLT experience or attends Summer Camp. Primarily, most families cannot afford to send their Scout (much less 2 or 3 Scouts in the family) to both NYLT and Summer Camp. Also, even though a Scout is thrifty, I do not know of any 14 y/o First Class that can shell out 250 Dollars just for enrollment alone. Not including uniform, equipment, and transportation. I don't like it, but I can empathize with many families, and understand why NYLT attendance may begin to decline.

Regarding the normal compliment of summer programs. A council only has to sell Wood Badge to one person, the adult leader. But a council has to sell NYLT to three people.

Now for the benefits and pros. The adults that would most commonly speak to the individual Scouts (and prime NYLT candidate) and their parents are their Scoutmasters and their SPL's. Even though there may be many NYLT savvy Scouters, Commissioners Staff, Roundtable Commissioners and etc. It is going to be the Scoutmaster which is the almighty "Gate-Keeper". Just beyond the Scoutmasters reach will be the parents, holding the wallet, checkbook, or purse. Sending their son/Scout to the right NYLT experience (or Summer Camp), you would think they were investing in a four year college tuition.

Finally, my Crew21'ism. I target the sell of NYLT to the Scoutmaster, Parents and then the Scout. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, but usually they listen and consider NYLT.

I said to Scouting friends and Troops and Camporees that Ive visited., "Scoutmasters, if you want an "over the top" successful Troop, you attend Wood Badge while your SPL attends NYLT." "Parents, if you want your son to learn to clean his room, do his homework, and set his own goals and accomplish those goals. Send your son to NYLT". "Scouts, if you want to attend a camp that is a rage, a riot and a blast, ask you parent if you may attend NYLT"

Bottom line. I would expect the NYLT attendance is directly related to the sell. How can you best sell and summarize NYLT to the Scoutmaster, Parents and Scouts?

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

P.S. I've never received "salesman of the year" or similar, but hopefully I'm heard on occasion.

MarkS,

Greetings!

Excellent comments already.

I would appreciate the effort of the youth staffer; it he was not attempting to be rude, but merely attempting to be safe.

Unless this young staffer was behaving as the local camp police, and pointing out violations (of his own interpretation). Not everyone can memorize the entire Guide to Safe Scouting, as well as their own Troop manuals, and the local camp policies word for word. It may be easy to confuse a troop policy for a local camp policy.

Also, rarely, in BALOO or Introduction to Outdoor Leadership Skills, we go beyond BSA policy and begin to provide our own advice. While advice on knifes, fire lays, stoves and fuels, and first aid is good and usually welcomed. But, It should be stated as personal advice and all of the attendees should be demonstrated where the actual source is and what the actual literature states.

Hopefully, someone may re-educate this young staffer on the actual rules and literature. And ideally, hell be quiet when it comes to quoting his own rules, but he will be vocal to speak up about safety, when warranted.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Fellow Scouters,

Greetings!

I don't desire to deviate too far from Stosh's coments about Scouting Libraries and Resource and how they have changes. But to follow up on both Stosh's and fgoodwin's comments regarding the Interpreter Strip. I concur with fgoodwin's comments about it being a recognition of a skill that a Scout has achieved. It is not an advancement requirement, so there would not be any actual literature or BSA programs to teach languages or ASL.

But in addition to recognizing Scouts with the skill of being multi-lingual. The recognition is suppose to aid Troops, Leaders, fellow campers in translating between languages.

Some Troops apply for International Tour permits to camp abroad. Multi-lingual Scouts may assist in international camporees, international scout shows, a troop camping in French Canada or maybe at Northern Tier, or a troop participating in high adventure white water rapids in Mexico. A Venturing Crew from Washington state (as written about in Scouting Magazine) has climbed Kilamanjaro in Africa and hiked the mountains of Peru. And, just imagine the confusion at World Jamboree this Summer!! (It doesn't take much to confuse me)

Having a Scout, which has earned an Interpreter strip, is really a big deal. They have the opportunity to do a good deed, by helping their fellow Scouts communicate well.

Finally....There is a joke I enjoy that goes like this.....

What do you call someone that speaks many languages?

Multi-lingual

What do you call someone that speaks two languages?

Bi-lingual

What do you call someone that speaks only one language?

An American

hahahahahaha (snort)

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

GWD,

Greetings!

Some great advice here already!!

On occasion, there are soooo many Scouters out there. Either we have developed our own practices, that are hard to change to a different method. BSA training courses offer great opportunities to learn the actual BSA literature and practices, as well as exchange some personal ideas and strategies. When I instruct, I occasionally speak about myself in the third person and I usually state this is a Crew21'ism, and these are my own concerns, thoughts and practices. Most of the BSA literature is a guide, rather than a law. Some items offer no interpretation; some items may allow the program to be modified to suit the needs. I.E. a Troop that camps feet away from the tailgate of a truck and a Troop that is extreme High Adventure and extreme Leave No Trace.

Regarding what was read in the Cub Scout part of the forum and what was taught in Outdoor Leadership Skills, it may be more stated Which is more correct? Which is more effective? Rather than, Which is correct?

From the Cub Scouters within this forum you may have read to dig a pit, from your Outdoor Leadership Skills you were told to sling the water and disperse it. Even in some Scouting literature, there are minor conflicts. I understand in the Scout Handbook it directs the three washbasin method to bleach the second water washbasin, in the BSA fieldbook it directs to bleach the third water washbasin. I've even heard that the literature conflicts with a cold rinse and a hot rinse depending on which manual.

With so many online resources, and literature around. Most Troops may have a Scoutmasters Library at their Scouthut, at least with the Scoutmaster Handbook, Scout Handbook, and the BSA Fieldbook. Recently, there is a webpage companion for the BSA Fieldbook. Here is the most correct answer, I can find in the literature.

http://www.bsafieldbook.org/

http://www.scouting.org/boyscouts/resources/21-105/index.html

Wastewater. Help prevent contamination of natural water sources: After straining food particles, properly dispose of dishwater by dispersing at least 200 feet (about 80 to 100 strides for a youth) from springs, streams, and lakes. Use biodegradable soap 200 feet or more from any water source.

Now for my advice. "Crew21'ism" I have heard this works as an alternative for a grease pit, and maybe used as a dishwater strainer. I have been told to carry a small "sack lunch" paper bag. After dining, fill the bag with leaves, and tear a small hole in the bottom. Use this leaf filled bag as a strainer, and then later deposit the paper bag onto the warming campfire for disposal. I have not had the opportunity to try this yet, but it does seem reasonable.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Beavah,

Greetings!

Communications and planning seem to go hand in hand.

I preach Communications at every Troop PLC, asking if they have their patrols emails and cell phone numbers, written in their Patrol Leaders Handbook. Almost the same for the Crew, asking them to write the same items in their Venturing Leaders Manual.

The adult leaders in the Troop who send emails out to a Troop wide distro are usually the SM, ASMs and Outdoor Activities Chair. Most all of these emails begin with a couple of sentences before we start typing the business.

"If you don't know what is happening, Ask your Scout. If you Scout does not know what is happening, have him ask his Patrol Leader. If the Patrol Leader does not know what is happening, request him to ask the SPL"

We may end in a joke, "If the SPL does not know what is happening, we are all in trouble"

Then we proceed with business in the email.

I will do the same for my Venturing Crew. However, I have one youth Venturing Crew Officer, that likes to forward Hoax or urban legend mail (AOL will send 7 cents to the American Cancer Society, Ossama Bin Laden has been captured.. etc,etc) This young Venturer seems to believe everything she reads, cries in sympathy for the whales, then forwards it to all the Crew youth, adults and parents in good faith. Later for someone to tell her, it was a hoax/urban legend email. But, that is a price we will have to pay, for using email to communicate.

Finally, our adults always cc email the respective parents, or at a minimum other adults when corresponding with a youth. Most of the time these emails are to coordinate advancement or program planning. I often receive emails from Venturing youth, but I will respond and cc their parent.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Lisa and Fellow Scouters,

I'm not one to brag...

Okay...Well, yes I am... (just joking Lisa)

You know you have a great group of new Scouts when...

The New Scout Patrol earns the National Honor Patrol Award (formerly known as the Baden Powell Star Award).

The Incredible Lightening Bolts, have a flag and cheer. They held three Patrol meetings a month specifically to work on camping skills and advancement, took their own local trail hike with two committee members-parents, advanced in rank, and scored the highest week after week in the uniform inspections. These Scouts really get a kick out of the program!!

Okay.. I'm done bragging, back to my normal humble self.. Not!

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Lady Leigh,

Greetings!

There are many different methods to relieve burn out and re-energize leaders.

Here are my thoughts...

Usually, Cub Scout leaders enjoy the company of their fellow Cub Scout parents. A pizza party at the local Italian restaurant, no children, only Den Leaders, and laugh, joke, and tell stories about the funny things you and your kids have done. I would expect the Den Leaders would come back to Den Meetings and Pack meetings, enthusiastic to see their fellow leaders and parents for quiet a few months.

Adult recognition. In some form or another. Adult training awards (knots) (I tell my friends If your Scouts are advancing, you should have already qualified for those knots) Dont wait for the Committee Chair, look at the form, fill it out, and hand the adult training award form to your DE, or if they absolutely don't qualify yet within the time limits then maybe gag gifts(camping supplies, marbles, waterproof matches, rubber duckies). But let them know they are appreciated for driving, taping, glueing, pasting, burning, hugging, cooking, first aiding, and the care and feeding of all of our Cubs. It is a "pat on the back" that makes them feel appreciated, and ideally, they will be coming back for more.

Finally, for a new Pack or new leaders. Recruit parents to join, give them an application with their name in the top blocks already filled out. Then, Focus on the basics. Just the program for Tiger, Wolf, Bear and Webelos Books. There are so many recognitions beyond the Cub Scout ranks, I would call them "nice awards" or "icing on the cake" that are extra to the program. Totem Chip, most belt loops, Pinewood derby, Summer Time award, Scout show, these offer some excellent fun, but most are beyond the normal advancement program. Certainly, if your Pack is "banging away on all cylinders", I would want them at all kinds of events. But if it is a struggle and burning out the leaders. For a while, drop the "nice recognitions" and go back to the basics of the Cub Scout Advancement Program. Don't get me wrong here. They all have much to offer, but the Den meeting program and advancement is the core of the Cub Scout program. Bottom line, the advancement program supports the rank and growth of the Cub Scouts in Character Development, Spiritual Growth, Good Citizenship, Sportsmanship and Fitness, Family Understanding, Respectful Relationships, Personal Achievement, Friendly Service, Fun and Adventure, Preparation for Boy Scouts.

Good Luck and have some fun!!!

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

US3,

Greetings! and Congrats to your 15 y/o Eagle!

For a variety of reasons. Some parents don't desire an Eagle COH, or their Scout is "aging out", or the family is moving, for many reasons they ask when is the earliest it may be worn. I have had parents in my Troops ask similar questions, usually along the lines of "when exactly may our Scout wear the Eagle patch, and may he wear the rank before the Eagle Court of Honor?"

Similar to scoutldr and OGE, the application states the date of the EBOR (second to last signature) it states directly next to the EBOR "This date will be used on the Eagle Scout credentials". Then it is signed by the EBOR Chair.

I have been told...... (so you can take this with a grain of salt).

Due to mailing or hand carrying the application to the local Council service center, the EBOR and final signature on the application may vary by a few hours to a week or so. Ideally, the very next day is preferable.

The final signature on the Eagle Scout Rank Application is the Council Scout Executive, this is the date that is entered into Scoutnet and the Scouts information is submitted to National. The Council Scout Executive is responsible for confirming that all the Eagle Scout procedures were followed IAW the Advancement Committee Policy and Procedures. Again, as I have been told by a handful of Scouting professionals, it is when the Life Scouts application has been endorsed and forwarded to National (now most often conducted electronically over Scoutnet), that is the official time, and the Scout may be allowed to wear the Eagle Rank immediately.

I know this is almost the same (or just slightly different) as what scoutldr and OGE have stated, depending on how you look at it. But the EBOR endorsement by the Scout Executive is the final signature and after this final signature is when they are official considered an Eagle Scout. Like I said, take my comments with a grain of salt, since I am neither a professional or work at Irving... lol

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

MomofColin,

Greetings!

My troop has adopted similar methods from other units. (I wish I could say, we were the original, Boy Led Troop...lol).

Our Patrol Leaders have the Boy Scout Handbook, BSA Fieldbook, Patrol Leaders Handbook, and Patrol Leaders binder. Inside the binder are phone tree, Troop Calendar, Troop meeting forms, uniform inspection sheets, permission slips, but specific to your question. there are menu planning sheets and Duty rosters.

Two menu planning sheets are two duty rosters are written for each campout. One for the PL and APL, and a duplicate for their respective ASM. As far as Grubmaster, we do not have a rotation set, but we do inform the PL's who needs to plan, budget and purchase for advancement.

We have notified all of the parents that a 2 day weekend is expected to be 15 dollars for grub and a 3 day weekend is 20 dollars. This is collected in advance and handed over from the PL to our Troop Committee Treasurer. The money amount is not so large, so we state "No refunds" for cancellation. With email, we confirm which parents are aware that their Scout has grubmaster, so they are aware in advance. More writing and documentation, but it assures that the money is there upfront and no one goes hungry.

Further, with the two duty rosters (one of the PL/APL and a duplicate for the ASM). A favorite statement is "I cooked this morning, so I should have to clean". We also attempt to discourage parents from sending 48 hours of supplemental food rations. Some Scouts arrive with a backpack full of Vienna sausages and pop tarts. They seem to believe, if they did not eat their Patrols food, they should not be responsible for cleaning.

We have considered, "Everyone in the Patrol conducts KP for each meal" However, we may move to the "cooks conduct KP for their meal". Which would prevent burning and they would observe the amount of time left on the stove.

But Bottom line about Grocery Shopping. A set dollar amount for the weekend is established. The monies are collected before hand, given to the Treasurer, then re-distributed to the Grubmaster. Good Luck and Bon Appetite!!

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Brian,

Greetings!

I concur primarily with BrentAllen.

A District Awards committee, will primarily look at Scouters that have provided service to their fellow Scouts and Scouters across the district. District PWDs, District Camporees, District Roundtables, District Training, District Merit Badge events, District Scouting Expo or Shows. Events like these benefit a majority of the youth in a geographic area, or sometimes benefit their fellow leaders.

It is an honor to work directly with Scouts in a unit, as a Den Leader, Cubmaster, Assistant Cubmaster or Scoutmaster. But sometimes, their skills may benefit more Scouts around them by occasional taking charge of larger events.

This is a dilemma. If a Scouter chairs an event for 750 Scouts and Adults, they would need a temporary replacement leader for their 50 Cubs or Scouts in own unit. Probably more common at Cub Day Camps, where the experienced and seasoned DL's will run various activity stations, while parents will be "walkers" or "escorts. It is a family sacrifice sometimes though, watching your own sons pass thru your event or station, while you assist your managerial skills, pizzazz or specialty skills to a camporee staff. Some awards committees will look at fellow Scouters which diverse their time amongst the district as well as their own primary unit.

Although, on some occasion, in rural Scouting, a district may basically run out of potential candidates. (Ideally, over the years, all the Commissioners and District participants have been recognized with the District Award of Merit). It happens on occasion, then the Awards Committee will begin to review, Scoutmasters, Assistant Scoutermasters, Cubmasters, and Den Leaders, who have delivered the promise to their unit, and maybe "stood-in" at a Camporee station or accepted a "walker" position at Day camp.

Let me finish by saying. Some Scouters are against any and all adult recognitions, some are for adult recognitions. I am for it. Adult recognitions do a few things. It allows for the "atta-boys", it allows us to give a fifty cent patch to an adult and make them feel like a million bucks, but I believe ultimately, the recognition patches allows for us to recognize their sacrificed weekends, it give fellow Scouters something (to prevent burn out) and keep them coming back, weekend after weekend, and year, after year, after year.

Hopefully your District Award of Merit nominee is highly deserving and wears it proudly in front of their unit and their son(s).

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Jeff,

Greetings!

I am really confused by your SE and your council.

Now possibly a Pack or Troop may corner the market at a District or Council event, but then they would have gotten their Unit Money Earning Permit Application in first. Plus volunteer to host a District event on short notice after all the other units passed up the opportunity to host an event.

A story about unit money earning I thought it was a riot a few years ago, when I attended a yacht show that was open to the public. I figured just walking around these yachts, speed boats and luxury craft would make me feel like a millionaire. Honestly, the show, demonstrations, and free samples were all great. But to my surprise, the parking (in a very large and very dusty open field) was 5.00 dollars. It was soooo dusty, I had to run thru the auto-car wash at the nearest gas station just to see thru the front window. But guess who was directing people where to park.

one of my neighboring troops. I think they made their entire annual budget and all the Scouts did was point. The only thing I could think of was. Gee, why didnt I get my Unit Money Earning Application in sooner!!!! These guys were genius!!!

You state the Pack is charging an entrance fee, but only to cover the cost of the District Pinewood Derby. I have seen this done on occasion, other times the host has solicited the local chamber of commerce for trophies or obtained funding from the host pack or troop.

If I may tell another story, this time about Pinewood Derbies. Many years ago, I ran the District Pinewood Derby inside of a new car showroom. (They moved their cars to the side and behind velvet ropes so they weren't scratched) Opening up the main portion of the floor for us. The local police brought a cruiser by with lights and sirens, a father and son member of the Junior Dragster Association brought their dragster to the Pinewood Derby. I wish they could have peeled out in the parking lot, but it was fun for them to hear the loud pipes and engine running practically on pure alcohol. On that occasion, we did not sell any concessions, because the new car showroom and management provided them. Hamburgers, hotdogs and sodas. When the pinewood derby cars were surrendered to the "pit crew", we gave the contestant a "matchbox car" for their submission. Some Cubbies were excited to watch the entire race, while some were only excited to watch their car compete. So the car lot provided a big screen TV to watch Cartoon network, and some specific child movies we brought, just about 75 feet from the race track. Finally, that afternoon the trophies and ribbons were purchased and donated by the car lot. Even though the car lot that hosted us, they did not plan on a cast-iron sale that day, but they did spark a lot of interest in the next year models. I've seen better Pinewood Derbies that put mine to shame, I've suffer through others, but I was pretty proud of myself after chairing that event.

Now about your event. The only fees you are charging will cover cost. But you are offering concessions? It does not sound like you are forcing attendees to purchase only your hotdogs or only your sodas. I hope they can bring their own snacks and sodas if they desire. I would imagine the concessions, that your Pack desires to offer are available to purchase, and that the attendees are not coerced or limited to just your concessions.

Further, your District also was down to one month and still attempting to identify a host for the Pinewood Derby this year.

I concur, your Commissioner recommended the Pack submit a Unit Money Earning Permit Application. The Application ask if your unit does maintain an annual budget, how will the money be used and if your Chartering Organization concurs with the application. Further, as the Application states, revenue should be applied toward an actual need in your unit program. Not just putting dollars in the Packs general bank account. (paying for advancement and recognitions in a Cub Scout Pack would certainly reduce the familys monthly and annual dues)

I do see on the Application that the District or Council Finance Committee has approval. I do concur that there are ethics involved in Boy Scouts selling or providing services. But I fail to see any restrictions in offering concessions at District events. Maybe I need to dive into more of my Scouting literature. (I dont have every BSA manual, but I do have a pretty good size Scouting library filling a few book cases). I could be missing this restriction in Money Unit Earning Application.

If council decided before your Pack volunteered to host the Derby or before your Pack submitted the application, that the Council would conduct a concessions booth. I have seen Council staff manning trading posts booths before. More power to them, they can staff a concession booth and benefit from the profit.

But if the Council decided they preferred to benefit from a concession, after your Pack has submitted a Money Earning Application. And further decided to refuse your application. GRRRRR Shame on them.. I do feel this is un Scout-like behavior on their part.

Just my 2 cents. If your Pack is hosting the event, if your Pack is offering concessions and not coercing obligated purchases, if the product or service you are providing is not violating any moral ethics. Then your Pack should have been approved in their Money Earning Application.

By denying approval of the application, it sounds like your District and Council just lost next years Pinewood Derby chair and host.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Pint and Fellow Scouters,

Greetings!

We have had similar discussions here before.

Using myself as an example, both at home or during Scouting, I probably know a large vocabulary of bad language. I tell my own children, in the past, I have probably used this vocabulary very fluidly. I really am embarrassed to think that I have used this language, but there is nothing I can do take it back.

Once a foul word is stated, it is out there forever. I can't take back the foul language. In hindsight, I do feel ashamed for ever using that type of vocabulary. I have probably lost a few girlfriends and dates, by attempting to appear cool. If you ever hear me using bad language, it will probably be in a loud voice. You better come running towards me with the first aid box, because I probably did some finger carving.

During the Troop or Crew excursions. I ask the youth if they hear any of the parents or adults using obscene language. If they don't hear any language from their leaders, what makes them think it is the cool thing to do? Dont they know, they will loose cool points with the young ladies, if they use foul language?

So... With my Troop, Crew and family, I share this with them.

- I know every word they can try

- I have used it at least once. I am ashamed

- I have lost cool points for choosing that language

- I can forgive, but it is harder to forget

- If you hear me using this language, bring the first aid kit

Now Pint asked How do we deal with bad language and swearing Scouts.

My Troop is currently going thru this with some language used by some younger Scouts just two weeks ago. While conducting Cooking Merit badge weekend camping, we invited parents and families to dine with their patrols on Saturday night.

Unfortunately, one of our patrols selected a cooking station that was outside of ear shot of the Scoutmaster and Assistant Scoutmasters cooking station. Some of our First Class Scouts thought it would be cool to demonstration their vocabulary, while the parents were visiting for dinner. Now this is a small minority (about 3 out of 35 Scouts) that decided to sound more aggressive by selecting improper language. These three Scouts are good Scouts, which made a bad decision.

The adult leadership has found out about this improper language on Monday after the camp from one parent (within hearing range).

The adult leaders have reassured the families and parents that we do take the entire program seriously. Youth protection, to camping and advancement skills, to the use of appropriate or inappropriate language. Further, that the adult leaders which have been selected do present positive role models to our Troop.

So we bring this up with the youth in question, that the adult leaders now know about their selection of language, that their parents now know about their selection of language. And, that this language is unacceptable.

How many steps between forgiving their mistakes to the Troop Committee expulsing them from the Troop... Well that is up to the Troop Committee to decide. The Troop Leadership can only advocate whether a Scout has learned and abides by our Troop practices or if they Scout desires to continue to use foul language.

With various language being found in youth sports, troops, schools, parents, playgrounds, movies, internet and etc. I don't think Scouting will every completely get rid of bad language, but it can certainly be reduced close to nil.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Fellow Scouters,

Congrats Hunt! or maybe I should say Congrats to Hunt Jr, if he is the one attending.

I certainly wish my family could join him and the others for the entire World Jamboree. At least my boys attending, but the price tag is still way too steep.

On a positive note for me. Ms Crew21_Adv came home from work a few days ago, asking me if we wanted to purchase day passes. Is she Psychic?!! I promise, I have not said a word about World Jamboree to her.

If things work out, we will have a modest London vacation, and a day pass on 2 August. It is a Thursday (weekday), so most British Scoutleaders may be at work. Although there hotels will probably be crowded with us International visitors (aka tourist). And it is the day after the 100th Celebration on 1 August (which is closed to visitors).

Again, if I am lucky, I will attempt to contact a few friends in the N/E Venturing Crew and some of the troops, to see if they need anything from the Chelmsford convenience store before we walk in. (If nothing more to bring in a few bags of candy bars)

I'd expect it will be extremely crowded, and Crews and Troops running to all the events (so no one will be at the campsites during the day), but I hope to get the chance to meet Hunt Jr, Eammon, and OJ, along with chatting with a few friends there.

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

Baden and Fellow Scouters,

Greetings!

I have seen these videos as well on the national website, they are pretty darn good. But not easily transportable to show to a Patrol or to the Troop.

There is nothing like having an Instructor, Troop Guide or SPL conducting basic Scouting skills instructions. But hey, we cannot always be that fortunate. These videos should explain each course of action, in easy to follow steps.

Best of all they are sending them to us, gratis?

I gotta say, Thank you National!

Looking into the Scouting Magazine, for this month. It appears that it is true, all Scoutmasters should soon be expecting a couple of DVDs in mail, one for Scout Advancement Tenderfoot thru First Class ranks and the Scout Zone recruiting DVD.

http://www.scoutingmagazine.org/issues/0701/d-news.html

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21_Adv