johnsch322

Would you ask those who talk about the Holocaust to include the total number of people in the world when they talk about the 5 million killed by the Nazi's?

Of course.

No that is a terrible comparison. It does not even come close to the same thing. Now if you were to say there was a red light that almost every day someone ran that light and people were injured. Sometimes it was the same driver running that causing multiple injuries and when they totaled up the injury's caused from running this light it totaled over 82,000. That might be more accurate.

And here is another fact if or when this settlement is done it will be the largest CSA settlement in history. Yet there are still people saying that the BSA did a better job at YPT than other organization's, Hmmm?

Thank you. Of course the question was hypothetical and does not change history but it does show where your heart is at.

I believe you only want to look at the details and then interpret them to fit the scenario in your mind. You try to make the BSA look better by trying to point out others (though you fail to name them or show real statistics). You fail to answer key questions such as why did they lie to congress. You ignore the fact that it took the Oregon Supreme Court to have them turn over any of their files.

And exactly when did that effort start before or after the public was made more aware of the issues and why did the BSA lie to congress about sexual abuse?

So you are saying the ends justifies the means and you would not sacrifice your experience for mine?

Let me rephrase. Would anyone forego their wonderful experience in the BSA if it meant one less victim of abuse?

Your view of what happened in the past comes from someone with a rosy picture of the BSA. My view is as a survivor of what transpired in reality in the BSA. You cannot water down what happened by saying such society in those times. Child abuse was as illegal, abhorrent and cruel 60, 50, 40 or 30 years ago. The only difference now is that it is no longer covered up. Your arguments remind me of those who still defend Jimmy Saville because he raised so much money for charity. If you asked any of his victims I am sure that they would say that what he took from them does not equal any of the good that the money he raised was used for. I ask you this, if you could change history and not have BSA come into existence would you for the sake of all of the victims?

What is hypocritical is to expect coverage of the abuse that went on in the BSA to have it within the same articles/videos etc. to also paint a rosy picture of BSA when the BSA never acknowledged to the public its abuse issues until lawsuits/publicity and the Oregon Supreme Court compelled them to. As a survivor I find it repugnant that you use us survivors a basis for your objection to media coverage. The "media circus" has made it at times more aware of our pain but it also has been therapeutic and empowered us to speak out and try to bring change. You only have to look at powerful voices such as the survivor who spoke during the confirmation hearings and is using his voice to change YPT. To the moderators I try to refrain from using language of hate and I do not believe what you edited from me was graphic. It unfortunately is one of the constant reminders I have of my past abuse.

By your reasoning of showing only the bad /worst where were the Norman Rockwell Boys Life covers with little Johnny being molested or the stories within Boys Life of how to cope with ... abuse? Oh yeah that's right they only wanted to show the best and most wholesome because that is what sold subscriptions and helped recruitment which kept BSA professionals paid. And they knew that abuse was happening for over a century of scouting.

“I am not going to sit on my ass as the events that affect me unfold to determine the course of my life. I’m going to take a stand. I’m going to defend it. Right or wrong, I’m going to defend it.” — Cameron Frye

Soo what came first the chicken or the egg? Or maybe I should ask this differently, did the abuse happen first and then journalism and legal issues arise from this or was it the reverse? I do not believe this issue has been overstated or misused by anyone, but the BSA definitely understated and misled the public (including congress) to the extent of the problem.

Denial of the dangers or feeling of comfort in the level of danger in the program also leads to a repeat of history.

How in gods name could she possibly think this process would only take 90 days.

This bone of contention has been going on for a few years and I think that if you have been following all of this close enough you must have question as to the validity of all of the claims. When a lawyer filed a claim with no name (but his signature) and another who gave an unfilled POC with his signature and had intake people use that form coupled with the fact of 25% of claimants not even voting I sure have some doubts.

It is all getting murkier instead of becoming clearer as to the outcome. Hopefully whatever will come to pass will happen quickly. I hated "as the world turns" my grand mother used to make me watch it as a kid. Now thru this mess I definitely feel like I am living it.

Not just the Judge but also the BSA and the insurers. All of the California cases will be filed by the end of the year and if the bankruptcy does not go thru all of them will be scheduled for trial and all by jury. If it is a cramdown then the insurers, LC's and CO's will start facing massive legal bills and then the subsequent awards.

I watched all of the confirmation hearing today and must admit I was very disturbed while watching Ken Rothweiler's testimony. It was if he raised his voice loud enough and tried to answer 10 questions which were not asked of him, acted like he himself was a victim and at the same time was ignorant of facts that nobody would question his sincerity. Coupled with KR saying he was signing POC's just to make sure that everything was filled out and not as to the validity of them. On top of that the lawyer who admitted he didn't really read and just gave his staff a blank POC with his signature on it to use and the biggest bozo who could not explain how his firm submitted POC's without claimant names and I really have doubt to how many actual survivor claimants there are in this bankruptcy.

And I for one feel very grateful for finding him on this forum.

I have heard that a member of SWG will testify Wednesday at 10AM EST. I think this will be must watch TV.

I would say that James Patton has been raked over the coals with more coming tomorrow.

I think we all do!!

Bribe?