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ThenNow

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Everything posted by ThenNow

  1. Apologies if already posted. I may put it on the Concealment thread, as well. It is relevant to both threads. The True Story Behind Hulu's Boy Scouts Documentary Leave No Trace https://time.com/6188750/leave-no-trace-true-story-hulu/
  2. Do you have any marketing materials, parent manuals or materials for children from another NGO YSO that mirror the BSA excerpts I posted? I am truly interested in seeing them.
  3. Think about it for a minute or two. You'll figure it out. Remember, it was a statement from a pedophile and the contest had a winner who got a special "prize."
  4. Which war is that? WWII? These books and marketing campaigns were late 60's and early 70's, as in during and after the, "Don't believe your government" and "Question Authority!" eras.
  5. I'm not sure if you have been on the thread about the new YP terms in the plan (Non-Monetary Commitments). Apologies for not looking through it to check. It might be a topic addressed there or would be a good place to raise this issue. I know it has been raised a few times in various places. Just FYI.
  6. Thanks. Not at all. I was sorta being self-deprecating to reinforce my point.
  7. Perhaps I’m not a good choice to initiate or in any way facilitate this conversation. I am clearly biased, having been physically abused in my home and variously sexually abused by non-family men in authority positions. I can see the faces of each of them. Only one, my dad, ever showed any remorse. All had complicit actors. (Sorry, mom.) My SM abuser stood in camp, in the presence of another ‘adult’ (20 or 21 years old), and told his Scouts to “line up for a soft hands contest.” The winner, yours truly, being directed to his tent. No sneaking around or secreting me off to a hidden locatio
  8. As most in this conversation know, I am not anti-BSA, don’t seek a scorched earth scenario, am grateful to the TCC and Survivor Working Group for pushing to improve YP, and am ‘proud’ of BSA for incorporating those changes into the plan (regardless what it took to get them to that point). That does not negate my position that there was, in fact, a noteworthy elevation of leaders and their moral fiber such that they set themselves up to be held to a higher standard. Because they created for themselves a higher bar, they needed to meet that self-imposed metric in protecting kids over reputation,
  9. I’m very sorry. Yes. I encourage you to pursue it, even now while we are in limbo. You deserve it.
  10. Institution-wide, I’m only aware of the reimbursement for counseling and therapy. I can’t say what was done individually or locally. I hope some were compassionate and facilitated assistance. Based on some Scouters here, I want to believe that was the case. Old time Scouters? What say you?
  11. Based on adequate evidence and argument, the Trustee (and of course the Neutral) can alter the mitigation factor (discount) otherwise imposed due to the Gray State factor. My assumption has been, based on my legal interpretation of the valuation process and this provision, the reviewer may reduce the mitigation factor to zero by full tolling of the statute. Fraudulent Concealment is the strongest argument I’m aware of. I see no indication it can’t be done if an adequate argument can be presented to defeat the SoL defense. General note: the IVF relevant to my concealment case is inter
  12. I'm sorry these reporting and warning failures were added to the damage of the abuse itself. It's not good. Not good at all. I am waiting for my opportunity to request of BSA/the Trustee verification of the number of other claims that name my SM abuser, as well as any of those I know or suspect to be complicit. My discovery requests are already written. I also want to know dates and Tiers of abuse. I know for certain other boys were abused, but I do not know how many of them filed claims. I am 100% sure there are some, since I've verified that through backchannels after I saw my troop on
  13. Thank you. The example you gave, something I know of only bc of this forum, is perfect. It sets the boundary for the other side of the box I'm trying to draw. As to all those other YSOs, I am not kidding when I say I did pretty much anything and everything I could to stay out of the house. I have always been very observant, wanting to exceed what is expected of me. That goes back as far as I can remember, exacerbated by the various abuses from various people. During my youth, I know of no organized activity, not even the RCC, that had the repeated call to trust, obey, believe and follow.
  14. Yup. "Esteem" and "expectations." Do you have any similar documentation going to the incredible elevation of leaders in those organizations, which elevation was used to attract and build membership, however well-motivated? I am making (or trying to make) a very specific and narrow point. Serious question and not a poke. That is the subtitle of this thread.
  15. Would anyone like to comment on this? It seems to me that when it comes to expectations for transparency (reveal v conceal), the way an organization characterizes its level of integrity and moral rectitude has significant bearing on the standard to which it should be held? No? If you played Babe Ruth or Pop Warner in the day, you knew the coach may be a hard-nosed, unpleasant, hard driving, used to be a jock type person. With such people, especially in my town where men were gruff and loved to tease and taunt, you knew what you were getting. Suit up. Step up. Put up. Shut up or sit down. In BS
  16. Oo. Lockdown lifted. Do I need to wear a mask in here? Seriously, I have two small, possibly interesting points I’ve been sitting on during quarantine. Both go to the light year since the trial concluded. One, a friend relayed that JLSS’s mother passed at some point recently. I tried to confirm (pun intended), but found nothing. Second, since the Purdue re-do plan approval was appealed to the Second Circuit, the Circuit's ultimate decision on releases is still pending. Those working that case expected the ruling to have come down at least a week ago. Both of these things may be factoring into
  17. This helps me understand the tenor of the communications in the IVF I've mentioned several times. As I've gone over it 20 or so times, I can almost see people sneaking into the next guy up the chain's office with a sealed envelope in a lead box. "NO PUBLICITY" reads one page. "Quickly man, don't delay! Deliver the package to Mr. Ernst immediately! Do not kiss your wife or tell her where you're going. The Keeper of the Vault knows what to do. Speak to no one. Allow no one to read it. Be sure no one follows you. Your mission Jim, if you will accept it..."
  18. My baby sister texted me while she was watching. My phone was smoking by the time she was several minutes in. I still have the blisters. She's small, but not to be trifled with. She was in an abusive domestic situation for years, to the point my brothers and I were going to extricate her. She then broke free. The guy was loco and heavily into drugs. He died last year and she finally feels safe. In any case, she is a survivor and reacts strongly to any such content.
  19. Forgive the length. This is from a case and is in my POC. For me and others, this type of strong "trust and revere your SM" applied to all volunteers and professionals. (Please forgive any wonky formatting. I'll take assistance if it ends up a hot mess.) It states in pertinent part as follows:[1] BSA has issued various publications available to scouts, parents, and the general public. The Boy Scout Handbook typically contains the Scout Oath and the Scout Law. It also contains a description of troop leaders. The Seventh Edition of the Handbook was copyrighted in 1965 and r
  20. In what specific form(s) and substance did that "warning" come down to LCs, COs, Units, volunteers, parents and Scouts? Interested, not poking. I used the excerpts from the book to make a point and launch the discussion. As I've said, there is much I don't know. Thanks. (Sorry I didn't have a chance to respond to you thoughtful, detailed post up yonder.) One of the topics I brought up when I started speaking up way back when is the issue of the elevation of the SM. I said something to the effect of, "Our SM was set on a pedestal and was larger than life to us." I was summarily slapped dow
  21. This is what he was told by other Scouts. That's what he said. I can't speak for my fellow, but the subject "accused" is/was an adult BSA volunteer who abused a young boy. Period. The end. Nothing further, your honor. What's the point of this line of questioning? He was quoting someone else to make his point about potential foreknowledge going to the topic of concealment. Those words were incidental to conveying his point and not the substance of his specifically stated experience. I, for one, am not going to respond further on this baiting. It's irrelevant here and likely pointless, based upo
  22. What was the buzz among the Scouts and do you have any sense that adults had an inkling. I recognize this speculation, but I ask based on personal experience. As I posted eons ago, when I went to my 40th high school reunion a girl I dated and was very serious about was talking about how "complicated" I was and how sorry she was for not better understanding me, breaking up" yada yada. She was drinking...too much. Anywho, when I told her about the abuse, she told me something that blew me away. Her brother, 3-4 years younger, was a Scout. I mentored him. She told me one of our mutual Scout frien
  23. Yeah, well, I'm old enough and was involved in theater. I auditioned for a professional company and the 'diverse' sexual 'hits' I took kept me away. A good thing. Anway, in some areas of culture and society - I'm not saying Scouting - there was celebration of the new and emerging 'freedom' fueled by the sexual revolution. You're being hugely over broad and making a stereotypical faux pax of your own. (See below for more.) Did you really miss this entirely in your rush to jump to down his throat, based on certain hot button words that are simply a reciting of his actual, perso
  24. Several things from both a personal and professional perspective. 1. Envy (often misidentified as jealousy) is a huge driver of false accusations, especially when the accused is accomplished and, per your telling, above reproach. In today’s world, add to that being a politically conservative person of faith (politically incorrect in the minds of too many) and you become an easy target from many angles. 2. Be wary of “protesting too much.” Answer questions and provide the requested information. He will not serve his cause by getting out in front of the questions. Because this is not
  25. Please explain how you’re defining “paucity of information.” As to study, setting aside using the information to aid prosecution of perpetrators (and any negligent BSA folk) and protecting and caring for the specific boys/girls, what “useful study” do you mean? For me, simple pattern analysis and recognition across the data in the 11 files I read would have helped form profiles of perpetrator behaviors, locus of crimes, traits of vulnerable children victims, and contexts ripe for abuse. That’s all you’d need to conclude, “Huh. This is a pattern. We might want to let people know.” AND, I’m just
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