Pack18Alex

Yup. My local Council forces all events to their properties, despite the fact that the county parks system is better equipped for some of them. The super irony, Council charges us more than our parks will. It's internal transfer costs so it's not real (nor do I care, as a council event runner, if the event makes a profit, which they do), but it makes the council properties look "profitable" when they are not, they are just moving programming money over to cover the boondoggles. I think that BSA should get out of the landlord business, because running expensive properties that are only

I think that that is a great analogy... also, put the shoe on the other foot. Would we want other hosts to be able to push their values and religious mores on our scouts at a World Jamboree? Put another way, how would people here feel about the host nation's religious views if the event were say, joinly hosted by Yemen, Saudi Arabia, and the UAE, and they prohibited female Scouters and Jewish Scouts from attending?

Small Pack. We actually organized our sibling dens into a Girl Scout Troop. We meet same night. We couldn't get leadership organized on Girl Scout side, ended up opening a few flag ceremonies jointly with Girl Scouts, everyone loved it. Right now, we are "one room" school house. Sometimes the girls go to another room and do their thing, sometimes the activity is mixed and we figure out how to apply everyone's requirements. We hate the GSUSA programming. My girls are transferring to my Pack the DAY Council will accept an application (one will need tenure for AOL). Parents all seem on bo

On a few pages of this thread, people would probably call my program "co-ed" -- and I guess it is. Our sibling den evolved into a Girl Scout Troop, which tried to forge it's own identity and collapsed under the crappiness of GSUSA. At this point, the GS Troop functions without our Pack as a Patrol (or two, depending as size), where they work of GS Advancement during Den Meeting nights and the Pack Activity during Pack Activity nights. We got a lot of amused looks at a district cub event last year where I had two patrols of girl scouts at it. My take on the matter: Cubs could go e

1. If the money is a legacy that you are a steward of, continue protecting it. You should keep a reserve that is the amount you need for 4-6 months of the program (i.e. time between fundraisers). 2. Invest in the future of the troop, spend some on recruiting. We have done custom signs, custom flyers, etc. Some are pitching our brand, some are pitching our specific scouts (instead of generic pictures). 3. Invest in your Pack. Does your CO have a pack? If not, start one right now. That's the best source of new recruits, and it's a no brainer use of money bequeathed to you.

Wife is a Girl Scout leader. The training is part of the problem, plus the ad hoc nature of the troops. A normal GS Troop is a two Kindergarteners, their mom, and 6 friends. As they drop out, they replace them or the program folds. They take their fundraisers and spend it on a single activity, never acquire gear or permanence. The Charter-Org system that gives BSA Unit's a sense of longevity is a HUGE part of the long term success. Not letting dads really volunteer in GSUSA doesn't help. When I go to Round Table, it's probably 60-40 men-women, and around 40-60 men-women with the und

FYI, one of my Scouts had really spotty attendence for a year or two. However, since he had previously been early registered (and was in too advanced a level), we just left him at the level for two years, earned rank with his classmates, and seems to be back active. It's really all about the boys. They'll get more out of the program if they are at the right age. The fact that we've slid back the grade by a year has made the program already too advanced... They don't get out of doing things ahead of the curve.

I think that someone who has his children in parochial school and running a scouting unit at said school would satisfy the idea of doing his duty to God, even if he doesn't believe in Him.

Irrelevant. Nothing is required. BSA and Council will NOT get involved in Unit Membership issues unless policy requires it. Unit refuses black members, Unit is in trouble. Unit throws out a boy for saying he's "gay oriented" (I interpret as SSA), Unit is in trouble. Unit throws a boy out for talking about his boyfriend, CO says, "we don't approve of middle school boys dating," BSA will say "find another unit." It doesn't matter what most people interpret it as, if a Unit wants to remove a boy, they can, as long as it's not for saying "I'm gay oriented." I think that 95% of peopl

The W2 Den is filled with boys that are Sabbath-observant Jews. Therefore, joining a Church based Troop that will do Saturday day events, is a non-starter. The Troop has a few Sabbath-observant Jews, but is primarily not. There is the disconnect. So we're in an odd situation where the Troop is overly Boy Led for their level of experience. But obviously, converting to an Adult Led W3 Troop would be lame, but strongly possible. When I get a chance to read through all these links and resources (thanks again everyone!), that will be helpful. I know that putting together the Pack Cal

Thanks for all the reading material and feedback. It'll probably be a few days to digest everything you've sent my way, a LOT to chew on.. Thanks for all the help! A few comments back to qwazse who gave a very detailed response. "But a dozen boys don't need a trailer." When the CO has no storage space, and none of the dads drive a truck, and the people storing gear in their garages are griping, it's a BIT of a concern. In terms of the Calendar, we have a few extra concerns... CO is officially of the opinion all Jewish Youth should be in Jewish Private Schools. Ther

Qwazse, Thank you, great and useful comments. Very true on the adults vs. group of boys. It needs to be VERY careful. However, if I were to listen to the other comments here, after appointing the Scoutmaster, depositing dues and turning in re-charter, the committee might as well disband, because everything should be on the boys. I don't think that's realistic, and doesn't jive with BSA policies. Might match some of Baden Powell's "Scouting for Boys" manual, but he was writing for older boys in a society where majority was obtained younger. So here is a big picture issue. Ch

Correct, when the Unit Committee is operating as a BSA Committee, votes are not taken. Roberts rules of order NOT followed, no motions/seconds/etc. One of my complainers started arguing that a decision that was made shouldn't me mine alone, it should be a committee decision, I explained that that's not how this works. However, when the Committee is instead operating as a committee of the CO, those rules may not apply. When the Committee Authorized us to open a bank account, a motion was made, a second was obtained, and the vote was taken. Why? Because Bank Account authorizations,

Read the rule change: 1. Sexual activity for scouts is totally inappropriate. 2. Same-sex-attraction is not grounds for dismissal. Essentially, a Scout can still be removed from a unit for behavior, not for coming out as gay oriented. No, a CO could prohibit all sexually active scouts, prohibit same sex sexually active scouts, or simply ignore the issue and assume that BSA wants to be done with this. I'm pretty sure we're all done with this issue, but BSA's rule change was written VERY carefully to not offend any religious groups that participate.

No clue. I watched someone testing some skills, and it was "couldn't do it to save his life." But, the basic knot tying stuff my younger daughters can do just from hanging around it at the cub scout stuff, so I'm pretty certain it's a training approach and a lack of practice. But I'm not entirely sure.

Correction. The BSA decided that gay attracted kids that were totally celibate needn't be thrown out until their 18th birthday.

MattR, You talk to the active scouts, they want to be better. Plenty of snarky sarcasm from the less active ones at campouts, but hey, they're teenagers. No, we had that Pack/Troop campout I mentioned elsewhere in the thread, the SM and myself were chatting. He runs the program his way, we're all on board with him and the program he's running, at a tactical level. The training needs work, so we want to get him the resources to make that better,, and the program needs some strategic focus with a longer term horizon than high schoolers have. I have also seen a HUGE improvement

Thanks for the advice. We're going to do out best to find slightly less drastic methods of fixing the weaknesses of the program than replacing the Scoutmaster. That seems like a baby and bathwater situation.

Awesome, sounds like it worked great. They got that side of the program, boys got excited, and started to work? Other than a missing binder sounds like a terrific success, even if they implemented it differently. Other than a 2 minute CM led discussion in the Pack Meetings about our monthly theme, I'm not sure what they are. I know the SM and PLC use them, they seem like a useful tool for simplifying the planning. But you demonstrated skill instruction and taught them, then backed off and let them do it. Given that most of the boys are lucky to get home from school by 5 P

Your assertion on not learning through example simply isn't backed by practice or theory. Leadership courses all heavily emphasize mentorship, along with confidence building exercises and practice putting it into place. Read an interview with ANY CEO, General, or other person who climbed the ranks, they'll all point to 1-2 mentor/leaders that taught them, then they took those lessons and perfected them. You have to put it into practice, but if nobody shows you proper leadership, you copy whatever you see in movies, you need someone to model behavior to copy, that's how mammals learn.

Sometimes it's important to get away from the theory and lead by example. In the First Aid Scenario, the ideal is: the boys organize it, decide what needs to be done (experience Scout/Scouter, EMT, whatever), call them up, get the resources handled, teach the boys, write the thank you note, practice their skills, pass their skill tests. The status quo: boys meander through the requirements by a transfer scout that had it signed off without mastering. Boys bomb their games. Nobody passes first aid. Scouts are discouraged. So how to we get from status quo to ideal? The sug

MattR and Stosh, Some great feedback there. Given I'm a Cub Dad and Key3 for the Pack, and just a Committee Member for the Troop, I'm not sure how many of your ideals I can implement, but I'm going to take these to the ASM and see what he can use from there. So the PLC has been able to handle the weekly meetings and the campouts, sort of. It's more the "big picture" side that's a mess. As an example, it took my 18 months to get this joint Pack/Troop Campout to happen. The SM didn't like the old CM from a few years back and felt the Cubs weren't well trained and out of control

Thanks. Dropping the idea of a Committee Policy of: 1st Class for Merit Badges, S/T/2 having to do Scout Skills. There is a small summer camp an hour away. The plan is to send the NSP there with a few carefully selected Scouts as PL/APL. That Summer Camp will be a T/2/1 Camp for the NSP to get them up to speed. This way, they'll transition from Webelos->Boy Scouts in two parts, 1: we teach you and test you now, to we teach you and test you next week, 2: you start to make decisions about your scouting advancement (a new transition 4 weeks later). Basically this Spring, We

Council also sticks fake Scouts on my roster that we drop each re-charter. They aren't exactly "boy scouts" when it comes to roster... I'll be honest, I've never checked Birthdates at re-charter. It'll get fixed when the cross over to a troop and re-apply. In terms of earning rank... if they are in the roster, they'll be editable in Internet Advancement, and that'll be that. It's dumb to falsify records, but when you lack Scouts, you get desperate to refill your rank. Also, the Kindergarteners that show up excited for scouting that we turn away never seem to come back the next ye

Stosh, I agree with your observations, but I don't agree with the first sentence. When a Webelos 2 crosses over to a Troop, we don't expect them to lead, we expect them to follow an older Scout assigned as their PL while they learn the basics. We expect them to master the basics of Scout Craft over 12-36 months and reach First Class, then with that training under their belt, learn to lead by teaching those basics to new Scouts that come up. As they master teaching new Scouts, we expect them to move up towards PL, then maybe ASPL/SPL or other senior roles. So, once a troop is u