Vicki

What timing on stumbling across this thread! We're heading for Camp Old Indian Saturday. Glad to hear the kudos. And that "ELP" song is actually England's unofficial national hymn - words by William Blake in 1804 as a preface to his novel, Milton. Became a hymn when C. Robert Parry wrote the music in 1916. Your father smelled of elderberries! Vicki

Yep, this is what we tell our newly minted Eagle Scouts. Eagle is a state of mind, regardless of whether or not you have some piece of cloth on your pocket (yet). I'm with others who can't imagine telling a young man, at this exhilarating moment in his life, that he's not an Eagle yet!! Not to mention that the advancement chair or Eagle counselor (depending on the troop) should have gone over this part with the scout long before his EBOR so there aren't any surprises. Vicki >I do tell the boy that his application will be forwarded to the national council for verification of th

Chippewa, that was my experience exactly. When I did my certification, it was as grueling as you describe. Another camp, completely different (and WAY too easy). I will say that the YMCA certification I got as a youth was a lot harder than the BSA today. There was a lot more emphasis on rescues, how to escape from a panicked victim, how to identify/calm a panicked victim, etc. Caveat: the Y program may no longer emphasize that, I don't know. I also understand that the BSA program is designed so that you don't lose two scouts in a drowning situation. But, IMO, if you're going to cal

I can only say that I am very sorry others have had bad experiences with their OA lodges. Mine has been very different - yes, there are some politics involved (if there's more than one human being, there's politics!) but overall, a bunch of really hardworking, cheerful guys. The two troops with which I've been associated have taken the election very seriously and only once have I seen a candidate elected that shouldn't have been - strictly because the first years thought he was really cool and we had a big first year class at camp that year. That said, written secret ballots are the

I've staffed NYLT twice, am now part of the fall WB staff. I would have no objection to NYLT adult staff receiving a third bead if the level of commitment were the same, but it isn't. In my council, if you miss even one WB staff development it's frowned upon - two and you're off staff. You are also required to present the program directly to the participants - basically as a TG has to do in NYLT. That commitment just isn't there as an ASM or SM in NYLT. We basically help the youth staff (read: SPL) if a situation escalates and make sure we stay on schedule. Occasionally there's a problem

rf, love the second year's question - beautiful! And having just been at yet another event where the national anthem was sung and seeing how many people don't even put their hand over their heart or remove their hat (not being in any sort of uniform, obviously), I wholeheartedly agree with your post. We are laying the groundwork. Vicki

Rip, GSLAC isn't starting a rebellion - we're goin' along to get along on this one. The new uniform was a discussion topic at our WB Staff development weekend a couple of weeks back... Vicki

On the other side of the state from John, we have two Ordeal/induction weekends (Brotherhood testing and ceremony, too) - Fall Reunion (September) and Spring Conclave (March). Callouts are done every Thursday of summer camp. The largest weekend by far is the Fall Reunion where we might have an Ordeal class of several hundred. Vigil nominations are done at the winter banquet, not exactly sure when the vigil and induction are conducted. I know several Vigil honorees, I just can't remember the season as I sit here... Vicki

Michael, to answer your question - as you stated, your adult is already a member of the OA (presumably his dues are paid - if not, he will need to do that). If he is from another lodge, he'll have to get his membership transferred - there's a thread on that somewhere around here. Basically, he needs to call one of the lodge officers and get the ball rolling. Either way, he does not count as one of your nominees since he has already completed the requirements for membership. Vicki

or the hover-dad of my experience who stayed so close to his son that the poor kid couldn't even handle the spatula to flip the eggs without bumping into him. Giving instructions the whole time. Or, as I was trying to get through the swimming/lifesaving requirements for 2-1 class ranks, repeating everything I said, "so, did you hear that, xxx?" Or the one who reduced his son to tears because he couldn't swim as well as some of the others - ridicule works SO well. Or the one who was also a SM who didn't like the way I filled out his son's review after NYLT. It ain't just a gender thing

Herms, when we're doing dirty work, we're in class B - sashes and shirt put away safely. Wow, in your situation I would seriously think about the sleeve, even if I do agree with Calico. Dizzy, throwing bleach water at it took a lot of guts. That said, I store mine in a gallon sized zip-lock baggie. Vicki

This is what I love about the internet - a two year old thread, resurrected! I recently cleaned a 60's era sash, using Cascade dishwasher detergent directly on a 40 year old spaghetti stain. Rub in, allow to set, rinse, repeat. It eventually came out. Not so for what was identified to me as a chocolate stain, but it did fade to almost imperceptible. I will admit I was very careful not to come anywhere near the red, but the Cascade had to at least touch it at some point, if only during the rinse. No run. This was a request from the owner of the sash, who gave me a really fine cigar i

Karen, not knowing your specific geographic situation, I'll just throw this out - sometimes the training in the next council (or district, depending on the size of your council) over may fit into your schedule better. Just a thought, Vicki

Pack212, I would just count that as a vent - one that several of share, although I can only speak for myself:

I hate to be a luddite about it, but I do believe that if I keep my Nalgenes out of the microwave and the dishwasher (which I did anyway), I'll be OK. Vicki

Bob, I am not talking about a council activity, I am talking about a district activity. It really is that simple. I refuse to split these hairs any further. It's not worth the effort. Vicki

In our council the Eagle project is approved at the district level and the Eagle BOR is at the district level. The would put it pretty securely within the purview of the district. Back to pie. Vicki

Hey, good on you for recognizing there was a problem, seeing what you could do about it, and doing it! And, obviously, doing it without ruffling feathers, a second feat all by itself. Way too many people out there who like to armchair quarterback... Vicki

Apple pie. With raisins. Yum. Vicki

I like pie. I also think that I will go with the interpretation of the policy delivered to my face by people for whom I have an enormous amount of respect, respect given after years of interaction with them. Plus their copious amounts of training - from National and Council sources. Not to mention their own experience as trainers - they trained me to be a trainer, after all. Their interpretation will always prevail over some anonymous opinion opined over the internet. Especially when it has the benefit of making sense. The fact that eagle90 has had the same opinion delivered to him from s

Bob, I think you're making an unwarranted assumption when you assert lack of experience on the part of Eagle90's DE. That aside, when I was part of the district advancement process, I was also told that "outside the sphere" meant the intent of the project was to benefit some organization besides Boy Scouts. Made sense to me. Vicki

Before I go - GW, what does snogging with men have to do with the topic at hand? I made no reference to homosexuality, nor did I equate homosexuality with sexism. Two completely different topics. Vicki

Pack - enjoy your trip. I, too, need to run - however, I'll point out that I already said there's no double standard. What applies to me applies to you in terms of the statements I allow myself to make. Yes, claptrap was said wryly. Vicki

GW, you have the right to continue believing that the natural endpoint of evolution is sexism. Hmmm, I am human, I have evolved, therefore I am sexist. Not following that syllogism. sexist: discriminatory on the basis of sex Vicki

Actually, GW, I'm only one in a long line of women who have held that opinion - my mother among them. I will agree that I seem to be in the minority, but I'm not the only one. Maybe just the only one you know (grin). Come to think of it, probably not - the majority of the dedicated female scouters I know seem to disdain sexist claptrap of any variety. Maybe it comes with the territory. Vicki