scoutldr

Chuck, I think you answered your own questions. And you don''t need to explain anything to the other parents...just say, "yes, they must have worked really hard!" It could be the scout is an over-achiever. If so, don''t hold him back. It not, and the parent has cheated, there''s nothing you can do about it.

Gunny said, "You''''ve got me paranoid that I''''m one of the slugs who''''s not involved in my local schools.(You can never do enough!)" A psychiatrist once told me, "those who are truly crazy don''t wonder if they are."

Sarcastic??? Moi???? Au contraire! In this SMSA (standard metropolitan statistical area), there are about 7 school districts. It is a well known fact among those who have lived here all their lives, as I have, that two of the districts are excellent, some are average, and one, I wouldn''t send a dog to. When a new military member transfers in and starts looking for a house, the first question I ask is "do you have kids in school?". Now, why is there such a disparity in quality of education within a 25 mile radius? Per pupil spending is about the same. Buildings and classrooms look about the same. The teachers are about the same...and get paid the same (+/- about $1000). The ONLY difference I can see, is the SES (social and economic status) of the residents. The "excellent" schools serve primarily non-minority populations, while the "other than excellent" schools serve a large minority and inner city population. My observation is that in the excellent schools, the minority students do just as well, if not better than the "majority" students. I think the difference is parental involvement. When both parents live in the home and are ACTIVELY involved in the schools and interested in having their kids study and do homework, rather than letting them roam the streets, the kids will excel. It''s a cultural issue, and NOT something the schools can solve, regardless of how much money we pour into them. By taking your voucher and "escaping" the public school, you are part of the problem. The school collective no longer benefits from your interest and efforts, not the least of which is to set the example for the other parents who don''t KNOW how to parent. As I said, my wife and two sons and I are products of the public school and state universities. From the day my son started kindergarten, she was there volunteering in the clinic (an RN). They eventually hired her to be the school nurse. She was active in the PTA and eventually elected President and honored with a Life Membership. When my sons went on to high school, we spent countless hours sitting on the bleachers for Baseball and Football games, going to PTA meetings (BORRINNGGGG!), and buying band candy. The baseball coach knew us by name...because he was my teacher when I was in high school. When my son brought home a bad grade, I was talking to the teacher the next day. When you don''t even know who the father is, and you have to work all the time and can''t go to meet teachers and volunteer, that kind of rapport can''t and doesn''t happen. Don''t blame the schools...you have to hold up your end of the deal, too. Fix the culture, and the schools will follow.

MB sash: definitely OA sash: No. A BOR is not an OA function. His pocket flap will denote his current lodge membership in good standing.

I would bring it up at your next LEC meeting (you do go to those, right?). Let the group decide, with your Lodge Advisor''s guidance. Then everyone should abide by the decision and wear the same thing...even the adults.

No worries, Lisa. I appreciate the candor, but it''s not the deal breaker. I think my fellow leaders may want to attend, but not sure our 50-something pot bellies will still fit in a kayak :-). We''re still considering all options...our boys are all Star/Life and are looking for something beyond the standard summer camp fare, which is all our council camp offers.

Why don''t you offer to take the "Pack Trainer" position on the Committee. Then it''s your job to see that everyone gets trained (you are the "facilitator"). As for new leaders who sign up, training should be an expectation upon approving the application. Put it to them as if "everybody has to do it, it''s not optional."

Thanks for the replies. After talking to the SM who returned from out of town today, we may try to steer them to their second choice, Bayport Scout Reservation Chase Program. They went to Bayport this year and loved it. Plus, it''s closer by 3 hours. Don''t know...still kicking it around.

For the record, my two sons went to college and I paid the whole thing...no scholarships, no grants, no nothing, in spite of spending hours filling out forms. Not even a "work-study" offer. We are in that "middle ground" where I make too much for "need" and their grades and athletic ability were not good enough for "merit". Being white males didn''t help any, either. So, the great middle class takes it in the shorts again. How did I do it? Planning and sacrifice. I still live in the same home after 23 years and drive used cars. I felt my kids'' education was more important. I got a small inheritance when my parents died and it all went to college tuition instead of a new boat or cruise to Jamaica...otherwise I''d be paying off loans the rest of my life. And they didn''t go to Ivy League schools, either...they went where I could afford to send them and one lived at home. I told them "you have 8 semesters paid for...use them wisely". Both got their degrees...on time.

No regulations that I''m aware of. The official uniform is always appropriate except when engaged in non-popcorn fundraising. Otherwise it''s up to your CO as to what''s appropriate. Some churches, for example, may not like the boys going around dressed in devil costumes.

Concur. "SecondclassLifeMom" just doesn''t ring well...

I didn''t say it was good or bad...just throwing out the numbers. I think it is beyond the reach of most of our current families in our unit, unless they stage some major fundraising efforts. Just a few years ago, they made the trip by bus, and it was a 3 week commitment.

The older I get, the more Libertarian I get in my thinking. How about let''s let everyone keep their tax dollars and use them to buy whatever they need. Want to send your kid to high school? Great...the Catholic HS down the road from me charges $10 grand a year. Too much? Maybe the Lutheran school or the charter school is cheaper. What''s that? You want the better Catholic school, but can''t afford it because you had three kids out of wedlock and only make minimum wage? Sorry...that was your choice, so you deal with it. My kids are out of school...maybe I''ll use my tax dollars to buy that new boat I''ve been wanting. After all...isn''t that what vouchers are all about? No, you say? You want to use MY tax money to pay for YOUR voucher? Now, why in the world should I be paying to educate YOUR kids??? Because it''s the best thing for society? SO every child can have an education??? Wait a minute...that''s why we gave you PUBLIC schools and you didn''t want them, remember???

We are on the east coast and our Council contingent fee is estimated to be $1300-$1600...flying into ABQ, includes tours of Sandia labs, whitewater rafting and two nights in a hotel.

The answer to your basic question is, no the BSA doesn''t have standards for the behavior of parents, except as it relates to Youth Protection policies. The parents are not members, the kid is. There is no background check performed on parents until they apply to become registered leaders. That is one basic level of protection...EVERY adult who regularly comes in contact with scouts as a volunteer SHOULD be registered (i.e., background and references checked). My previous advice still stands...have a chat with your SE and explain your concerns. But don''t be surprised if the decision is to revoke the boy''s membership (which is really all the SE CAN do, in the absence of abuse or neglect). Sacrificing one for the good of the group and the good name of the BSA is not unheard of.

At our troop meeting last night, the boys decided they''d like to try Pamlico Sea Base for 2008. Looking for comments, advice, critiques. We are about 4 hours away by car. I note in the literature that adult leaders are not required to attend...how does that work out?

Locust, what is your position with the Pack?

SE=Scout Executive...the "top dog" at your council. All of the Council professional staff work for the SE. You have already been given sound advice. Request a meeting with your Scout Executive and say it's a "youth protection" matter. This is a code phrase that will get an immediate response, without you having to do a lot of explaining to the secretary. Then do what he/she advises you to do. If the advice is something that you are uncomfortable with, or is incompatible with being a law enforcement officer, then you have a decision to make. (This message has been edited by scoutldr)

"One of our technical programs is considering a special remedial program to help certain students who are not prepared for college-level math, physics, thermodynamics, fluid dynamics, etc. This new program will consume extra resources that will take away from other parts of the overall program." To analyze this, we have to ask why they are "not prepared". My local (public) high school offers math through AP Calculus, AP Physics, and other advanced course work that bestow college credit if they pass the AP exam at the end. You can''t expect to excel in a college engineering curriculum if you make a D in high school Algebra 1 and stop there. My observation is that those kids who work hard and take the challenging courses in HS will do well at any college. Most do not want to do that, though...too hard. And the parents don''t push it...also too hard. Another observation...when I was going through HS and college (early 70s), we had a good idea of our major field of study byt 10th grade (certainly by 11th), so we could take the proper preparatory coursework. By our senior year in college, most of us were interviewing and had job offers in hand. Today''s students seem to be "developmentally delayed" in that respect. They are getting degrees just to have a "degree"...THEN they start making career plans...if then. And we need to return to honoring and respecting those who elect to learn a trade. HAve you had to pay a mechanic or a plumber lately...if you can find one who knows what they are doing???

So, how do we explain the millions of kids who go through the public schools and still manage to turn out OK? I can think of four fine examples...myself, my wife and two sons. When you talk of public schools as being a bad environment...that's my family you're talking about.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/TenWays/Story?id=3585399&page=1

To paraphrase, I remember when "common sense was a common virtue". They don''t teach it in school any more. I once had a discussion with my eldest son when he was despondent over his "mediocre" grades in middle and high school. He was a B-C student. I explained to him that I raised him to be self sufficient and well rounded, and with a modicum of common sense...he was a Varsity athlete, a Scout, active in church, and an all around good person...in fact, his senior year, he was voted "best all around" by his peers. To my knowledge, there were no drugs, booze or tobacco. I told him about the kids I went to school with who had 4.0 averages (that was the best you could get in those days), but couldn''t DO squat outside of the classroom. They knew how to study and do well on tests. That was it. One committed suicide shortly after high school. Another was accepted at all 3 service academies, but in an act of rebellion, enlisted as an E-1 instead. My kid only made it to Star, but at age 28, has his degree and is a partner in his own restaurant (and getting rave reviews), managing a staff of more than 50 people. He has a wisdom beyond his years (and schooling), and that''s what I was shooting for. Nobody really cares now what his GPA was. It''s the results that matter. As my dad (a retired Navy enlisted man) used to tell me..."don''t let all that fancy schooling interfere with your education."

Go to the BSA website and follow the links... www.scouting.org If you sign up, you will be given satellite images of the search area to inspect for signs of wreckage. If you see something, you flag the image and the search coordinators are notified. Pretty cool. Just got my latest issue of Eagletter yesterday, the national magazine of NESA. Inside the front cover was a letter from Steve, the incoming President of NESA. Obviously printed before he went missing.

Just checked out www.callingpost.com ...didn''t even know it existed. What a great idea! Thanks for the info...

Just to clarify, I meant to split the whole pack ... not just the new recruits. The challenge is to find a new CO, CM and CC. But you want each pack to end up with Tigers, Wolves, Bears and Webs...if possible. Bigger is not better, believe me. Been there.