Fat Old Guy

wojauwe, I wasn't insulted by your recitation of your son's honors. They just have as much to do with the discussion as my daughter's grade in English. The crux of the issue is that I don't see a need for a change. Many others don's see a need for a change. Let Venturing form their own organization. As for details, I have never understood why people think that you should ignore details in pursuit of "the big picture." The big picture is made up of details. Fuzzy thinking and terminology leads to confusion which results in ships running aground or girls thinking that they we

"I hear Venture Scout as often as I hear Venturer used." So? I see people write "there" as a possive adjective very often but that doesn't make it right. Does it? There are right terms to use and it behooves you to use the right terms. "My oldest was awarded . . . blah, blah, blah. . ." What's that have to do with you not knowing the right terminology? "Could you tell me what knowledge you have of The Venture program other than static history and vaque concept of terminology?" What's that have to do with your desperate need to change OA and obstinate need to use th

Do you worry about 8 year olds getting kitchen knives and doing wrong with them? I've carried a pocket knife since I was a Cub Scout and never did anything wrong. I'd let them show everyone their new knives so the newness wears off. Then they should know that the knife stays in the pocket or clipped to the belt unless its being used.

" That level of the Scouting program could when it was called Exploring and then when all but a few career based post were changed into crews they lost that right." I think that it went away in the early '70s when girls joined Exploring.

"Venture scouts(and yes they are called scouts)" Really, the last time that I checked, they were called Venturers.

We confiscate any electronics that the Scouts bring, put them in bags and bury the bags by a tree. We discourage adults from bringing electronic toys as well. Most adults that do have cell phones don't bother to call home very often. I view camp as a retreat, much like a religious retreat where you leave the outside world behind.

"We're not doing our jobs, folks. That was the point of my original post." I think that problem is rampant throughout Scouting. Maybe throughout society. Scouts get passed for promotion even thought they don't do their job in the troop or they don't live by the Scout law. The often cited reason is, "they'll quit if you don't advance them." Outside of Scouting kids who can't read get passed through to high school because "it will hurt his self esteem to be held back." Instead of letting kids build their own school projects, the parents take over and do it for them because the

My troop has loads of stories about outrageious things that have happened on camping trips. They include a Scout who chose not to put his rain fly on his tent and woke up in the middle of a storm with standing water in his tent. Then there was the boy who had to be medevaced to the hospital because he cut his hand so badly working on his woodcarving merit badge. There was the guy who thought it would be fun to chase a skunk. 'nuff said. I'm sure that many of these stories grow with time but that's the fun of folklore.

See s-nerd, there's the problem. If you aren't a member of a lodge, you aren't a member of the national organization. So the lodge flap implies national membership. Which still makes the dangle redundant.

"We may have to start a movement to continue to old program on our own." Is that legal in GSUSA? In BSA that would be like me deciding that I liked the 1965 requirements better (I actually do) and to run a 1965 style program. That just isn't allowed.

As Bob White would say, "use what it written and don't try to read into it." So the answer is, "No, long pants may not be worn with the activity uniform." So much for winter hiking.

"The ones that I use the district option for are all very active at the District level." From what you said, their primary registration isn't at the District level, so you are dancing around the rules. "The desire to see the inclusion of Venture stems from the fact that this is a valid Boyscout program serving the same age group as the OA and with very much the same structure." So? "You might want to look at the tendancy of Boy Scout troops to select every Youth who reaches first class." I haven't seen tha that in my troop and that would be a problem with the implement

Do a google search on "Baden Powell quotes" I don't know who said it but my favorite is "you never stand so tall as when you stoop to help a child."

"There is the option of selecting them as a district selection.I use this at least once each year and it is pretty much up to me.I need to convince at least one of the District key 3 that the person is a good choice." This sounds like you are dancing around the rules. I looked at the requirements as explained in the "Support Pak" www.oa-bsa.org/programs/ttr/ttrpak/A1-Unit-elections.pdf and it looks as though you should only nominate someone as "district selection" if their primary registration is at the district level.

Why the mad desire to open the OA to Venturers? Why does everything that is special to anyone need to be opened up to include everyone? Why can't people just accept the fact that they can't join an organization.

So FScouter, you didn't learn much while wearing that plaid skirt. Did you?

"If I had the time, ambition, funds, knowledge and management skills to do so, maybe I would." So what you're saying is that you really don't want to.

Sometimes letting the Scouts lead themselves can be painful to watch and sometimes they need the guidance of a size 12 in the butt. I've sat in on PLCs when they were doing the annual calendar. "What do you want to do this year?" "Dunno" "Do you want to do the same stuff as last year?" "Nah, that's boring." "Do you have any ideas of what you'd like to do?" "No." Downright painful.

Sorry F-Scooter but I leave the plaid to you. I know how much you like those Catholic school skirts.

What I don't understand is why those who don't like the BSA and its policies don't form their own group to teach the same things.

"All of the posters to this thread should be required to complete the Religious recognition award for adults for Zororastrianism" Also sprach Zarathustra Good thoughts, good words, good deeds. Alas there is no adult recognition for Zoroastrianism I also haven't known a Zoroastrian since my college days.

Gee Moi-Lin (aka Satan's Briquette), you got it all wrong as usual. Not all those who know that there is a supreme being think that they have an obligation to God but they could still be members of BSA. The BSA wants them to see that they do have an obligation to God and, by understanding that, they will become better citizens. Hence the statement in question applies to BSA members and not to atheists.

So if a Scout is wearing his Scout shirt and blue jeans, he's not in uniform and should salute the flag by placing his hand over his heart?

Sorry Cartoon kid, that statement is speaking of members of BSA. Since atheists can't be members of BSA, that statement doesn't apply to you. Come back when you learn to read. Hey Stapler Guy, go staple your tongue to your forehead.

"Nope, no hatred of atheists from boy scouts here, nosiree... " So? We don't speak for BSA, only for ourselves. Your statement was that BSA vilifies atheists, BSA doesn't. Now go home, your husband is calling.