Eamonn

Thanks Beavah I didn't think the number was correct, but wasn't sure where to go to find out the correct information. I happen to like Boy's Life. Even when I was a little Lad in that fair and pleasant land across the pond, I used to get my hands on the odd copy and thought how cool it was that American Scouts had their own magazine. We never did and even as a adult you had to buy and pay for Scouting Magazine. OJ, never has been a fan of the Magazine. At one time he requested that he be taken off the mailing list, but the Troop was a 100% Boy's Life Troop. Over the past couple of years I have seen the changes, I'm not so sure I like them? But am willing to admit that the magazine isn't aimed at an old codger like myself. As a family we used to subscribe to a lot of Magazines. Her Who Must Be Obeyed ordered them from the Publishers Clearing House. You name it, and our Mailman delivered it!! Slowly we got away from it, mainly because we found we just weren't reading them. Now we are down to the Reader's Digest, Good Housekeeping, and a few Trade type magazines that seem to arrive for some unknown reason? -The Magazine Fairy? Most of the stuff I used to read in Newsweek and Time can now be found on the web. I dislike the Reader's Digest as it seems that they send almost as much junk mail as AAA seems to send out. While I can't state it as a fact. There was a rumor that after some of the carry on about inflated membership numbers, some of the National Staff were looking at Boy's Life numbers and comparing them to the Council membership and if there was a big difference they seen this as a red flag. - Again I don't know how true this is or ever was. It's very easy for us the people who serve at Unit, District and Council levels to point the finger and blame National for just about anything and everything. I know that in the past I have had some concern about the age of the people who serve on the National Council. While I like to think that I don't have one foot in the grave. I do notice that I'm the youngest member of our Area Committee and was one of the youngest on the Council Executive Board. I really have no idea what is happening in Grade Schools. But the National Council does have volunteers from all over working and looking at improving what is going on. Some of us might not like what they come up with, but that's always going to be the case. The decline in membership has been noticed. I think that some steps have been taken to try and help stop the trend. I'll admit I only very quickly scanned the what it's called which is replacing Quality Awards till 2010. It seems to be a step in the right direction. The Race for Cub Scouts was a good idea, it just wasn't communicated very well. I personally am not a great fan of how the Venturing Program is set up. But it is so open that it seems to if the youth members want address all the stuff that brianbuf doesn't seem to like. Uniforms and that kind of thing. Scouting does change and does make changes. Some of them don't sit very well with old folks like me. Some may be very necessary even if we don't like them. I spent a little time yesterday talking with an old timer who was very upset that condoms were available at the World Jamboree (the last one.) He seen this as the end of Scouting as we know know it. I'll admit that I would be very uneasy discussing safe sex with any of the youth members I serve, but with AIDS on the rampage, maybe in time it will be something that Scouting and the BSA will need to take a look at. Looking back, the BSA seemed very slow to recognize how much computers would play a part in every day Scouting -Has it really taken this long for on line rechartering? Why were other volunteer led Scouting Sites doing what National should have been doing from the get go? However once they did recognize it they seemed to really do a fairly good job. Even handing out fun games on CD's to first graders. We are going through a time of great change. We have a lot of adults who are those who have belong to the group: Who hath smelt wood smoke at twilight? Who hath heard the birch log burning? Who is quick to read the noises of the night? Let him follow with the others, For the young mens feet are turning To the camps of proved desire and known delight. -- (Rudyard Kipling) While others are going to camp laptop charged and ready for action. Some of do believe that we need to keep the smell of wood smoke around, but we are not dumb enough to think that just the smell of wood smoke is going to hold the interest of the youth members we serve today and in the days to come. Eamonn.

Having been a District Chairman. Please believe me finding good people to work for the District is not easy. I think looking back I seen the loss of a volunteer much the same as I seen a Scout quitting Scouting. - I wasn't going to give up without a fight. I have never counted the stages of "The Loss" Of course there is always the "Thank Goodness he is gone" which of course meant that I'd selected the wrong person to start with!! So if nothing else you can think yourself lucky that you weren't one of them!! Then there was the "I'll have a chat with him" Stage. If that didn't work I moved on to the "I'll find him something that he might enjoy more" Stage. If that failed I moved to the "Give him a little time" stage. (Then back to have a little chat and more offers of other roles/jobs) By now I'm ready to admit defeat, in fact I'm beaten, but all is not lost!! Now is the time to see if the District Commissioner can recruit a new Commissioner!! Word that a gifted volunteer is foot loose and "under-employed" can spread like wild fire!! Council Chairpersons need help so they start sniffing around (DE's often offer them a little help.) Saying No can be very hard. Heck my job was to prevent you from saying NO!! While the great fear is that if you take a break, you might enjoy it and decide that you are never coming back!! A lot of people didn't believe that I was going back to become a unit Scouter and really was turning my back on the Council and the District!! But I'm having a ball and really enjoying being back with the youth members. You have to do what you want to do!! Burnout can and does happen. Sadly when someone really does get burnt-out, they rarely ever want to return. You have to follow your heart. The very best in whatever you decide. Eamonn

I was talking with a very nice Lady. She is an RN and the Director of Nursing for a Rehabilitation Center. She found out I was involved in Scouting. She said that she has two boys. One to her first husband. a Lad who she said was really into Scouting and went on to become an Eagle Scout. She has a little fellow to her second husband. It seems he came home with a paper informing them about Sign-up Night. The little Lad wanted to join Cub Scouts. She said that there was no way she was going through that all again!! So she promised the Lad a Fish if he didn't join Cub Scouts. Of course there is nothing scientific about this story. It could well be an isolated case? I don't know. I did question the very large drop in the number of Venturers in the NE-Region. I was told that most of the number came from 3 Councils!! I know that in the Council I serve, when we had the 2% growth a shall we say very ambitious Field Director signed up an entire HS Grade as a Venturering unit, about 650 kids. They were moved from Venturering to LFL. Movement of numbers like this while they should never have been allowed in the first place do give false information. Most of the loss of membership seems to be in the Cub Scout program. There does seem to have been a break down in communication from what the Cub Scout Division at National were trying to do with the Race For Cub Scouts and what was getting to the Packs. I very much doubt if sales of fish are up by 30%. But I do believe that a lot of parents do not want to get involved with an activity that they see as being a tie. I could mention that all the service organizations are seeing a decline in membership, but I'm not going to. I for one am not overjoyed to see Lions added to the Scouting family, but it looks as if they are here. As we know it takes a lot of parental support to run a Den and a Pack. Cub Scouting is by design a family program. I'm not bright enough to know if because the Parents are not interested or willing, this means that the program is no longer viable? The Lady with the Fish said that she just doesn't have time, it seems that Hubby number 2 is not around and she needs to devote her time and energy to her work. That being the case the fish is a good choice. Eamonn.

A long time ago I was asked to take the Pepsi test. I don't drink cola, so I didn't take the test. I do seem to watch a lot of the programs that PBS airs, so I the station in West Virginia a check, I think they do a better job than our local station. I don't like all the programs that PBS airs, but I'm glad that even the stuff I don't like has a home. I was born and raised a Roman Catholic,I have attended other churches, but never wanted to really spend the time finding out more. I don't agree with everything the Church does, but as long as I'm going to remain in the Church I'm going to follow the rules. OJ did his Eagle Leadership Service Project at and for our local YMCA. It's a new YMCA in a brand new building. The guy in charge is a super nice fellow. He asked if I would serve on a committee. I declined, I don't know much about the YMCA, I do know when I look at this new YMCA I see state of the art gym equipment, treadmills, stair climbers and lots of middle and old aged people sweating like crazy. I don't see any young people. I remember the old building which was in bad repair, but when I went in there were kids everywhere playing basket ball and just hanging out. Of course it was in the center of our little town and the new one is outside of town and the kids would need to be dropped off. I still think the YMCA does a good job, but what they are doing is not my cup of tea. I have been in Scouting for a very long time. Most of the time I'm so busy with the project in hand that I don't even think about Councils, Regions or what National is up to. I don't have time to worry about what changes are needed to improve the National program, I'm busy trying to do my best for the kids that I serve and the kids in the community where I live. I get the membership reports every month, I might not be happy with them, but while I do drive several hundred miles to attend meetings about membership I know in my heart of hearts that the only real difference I can make is with the kids in my area. Many of us have heard the story about the Lad on the beach tossing starfish into the sea as the tide goes out. The beach was covered in starfish. Someone said to him that he was wasting his time that there was no way he could save all the starfish, as he tossed another starfish into the sea he replied "I know, but I can save this one." Eamonn.

I don't see the President making any changes, that's not his job, we have a lot of volunteers serving on the National Council that do that. If we the adults are serving the youth by treating them as individuals and tailoring the program to suit each individual, I fail to see how the the program wouldn't be attractive and relevant? I think if I thought what I was doing with the Scouts was irrelevant I'd be wasting my time and wouldn't do it anymore. If the program was not attractive the Scouts would see it as a waste of time and wouldn't participate in it. Can new things be added? Of course. Can some things be changed? Of course. Do I need a 100 page memo to add new activities or change the way that I do things? I don't think so. Scouting is like cooking an omelet, the eggs are the basics found in the Oath and Law, but the filling can be what ever you want. Of course some people don't like eggs so they don't join. Some people are on special diets and we can make special omelets for them. Eamonn.

Jeffrey, I took Wood Badge back in the early 70's at Gilwell Park -I had fun and learned a lot. I took The Cub Scout Trainer course in the 80's I had fun and learned a lot. I have staffed both courses and had fun and learned a lot. I have staffed and directed the new course and yes I've had fun and learned a lot. Back when I was a Lad I was an alter boy, the Mass was in Latin, I enjoyed being an Alter Boy, I had fun and learned a lot. My Grandparents never did like the Mass in English, they went every week and said the Rosary. Having the mass said in English was a big change, it took a little getting used too. But I got used to it and think I'm a more active participant than when it was in Latin. A local church once a month has the Mass in Polish, I don't understand Polish, still I understand what's going on. I'm a big Wood Badge fan, but lets not get carried away it's a training course, some courses will be better than others some people will get more out of the course than others, some might get nothing. Near the end of this new course the CD is supposed to inform the participants and staff that training never ends. Go to the course have fun, learn what you can. But don't ever think that once you have your beads that you are done. I've talked with people who say that they got as much from a week at National Camp School as they did at Wood Badge, some Sea Scouters will claim that Sea Badge beats the pants off Wood Badge. Other will say that they learn as much from spending time with old time Scoutmasters. I'm not going to say that they are wrong. I do worry that at times we hold Wood Badge up as the be all and end all of all training's. This can be a mistake. It is just a course. Eamonn. Course Director NE-IV-153

The Ship members seem to have a hard time selling a product of any kind. Parents of older kids don't seem to to want take things to work to sell. The HS Band seems to move from one sale to the next. I haven't done any research to back this up. But I think a lot of the problem is popcorn. While most people know that when they buy almost any product that is a fund raising product they are going to pay a little over the top. The popcorn now seems to be a lot over the top. While we know that the money is being split with the Council, for prizes and for the unit. The guy in the street sees the price and isn't happy. I gladly fork over the money for Girl Scout cookies, I like cookies and tend to look at buying a box of GS cookies as buying an expensive candy bar. (I know once open I'm going to eat the entire box in one sitting.) I can't remember what they cost I think about $3.50 a box. We at home all have the type of cookie we like best, so we normally oder 12 boxes at a time. Spending $50.00 on something that we enjoy and know that we can't find elsewhere and will only be around for a little while till next year is a lot different from buying popcorn. The sad thing about participating in the popcorn sale is that while you are peddling you can't really run another fund raising event. That seems greedy!! I really think that Councils who use tactics like this UC is talking about will mean that fewer units will use the correct paperwork and before they know it units will be running ticket sales and bingo. Maybe popcorn has had it's day? Maybe if Councils came up with something new the support might be better? I happen to think that a PLC should be given the choice, but they need to let the Council why they made the choice. This might act as a wake up call. Or of course I might be full of beans and have it all wrong. Eamonn.

I have sat at our Council Recognition Dinner when the Silver Beavers are being awarded. I know that the certificate reads Service To Youth. But at times I'm amazed at how much some people can fit into 24 hours. Over the past couple of years I have cut back a lot on the time I spent being active in Scouting. When I at my most active some months seen me doing something outside of the house 20 or more days a month. This didn't sit very well with Her Who Must Be Obeyed. I at times tried to justify it by arguing that I didn't hunt and wasn't out playing 36 holes of golf a day with a few of my friends who were. I cut back when she first became ill a couple of years back. It was hard. I was a Scouting Junkie!! It also seemed very unfair. We had just said goodbye to our DE who was and is a very dear and close friend. We had spent almost ten years working together as part of the District Key 3. Our communication with each other was almost embarrassing, some people thought we were romantically involved. She by the way was and is a she!! My cutting back left a very new DE who had no idea and still doesn't seem to understand what he should be doing. Out there with little or no support. My decision to cut back was mine and mine alone. I have friends who think the world of Scouting and the program, who for one reason or another can only support the program with their financial contribution, they still take an interest in what is going on and what the Scouts are doing. I have other friends who seem to be every where doing everything. At times I wonder how their spouses put up with them? But I do understand that it's none of my business. Some of these people do a wonderful job for Scouting and some are just a pain. Still they are there and it is up to who ever is leading what ever they are involved in to try and give them direction and see that the job gets done. When I talk with the youth members of the Ship, I do my best to get them to see and understand what should be important to them. Sadly I end up preaching about what is important to me. It's all to easy for me to go on about Family, God, Work, but some (not all)of these Scouts are going through a rebellious stage. They don't all have wonderful families. They are questioning their religion, some of them while accepting that there is a "Higher Power" don't really belong to any organized religion, but are even questioning if there really is a higher power or whatever? Some are just filling in time by attending school and can't wait till they no longer have to attend. I don't have all the answers. I do try my best to really listen and ask what I hope might be the right questions. Still when it comes to adults. I don't have any right what so ever to judge how they spent their free time. I know that I don't want to spent the money playing 36 holes of golf a day or several thousand dollars going on a turkey hunt in Texas. A good pal of mine is our Council Camping Chair. He was up at camp every week while camp was open visiting 3 or 4 times a week, hanging out talking to the staffers till the small hours, he also staffed two Wood Badge Courses last year, sits on the Council Executive Board, is the Chair of The Holy Name Society in his church, is on the Board of the local Polish club, works full time and seems to work a lot of over-time. He has two daughters, one who was a Venturer for a little while until the Crew folded. Last year he managed to find time to add a deck to his house and replace the roof on his Dad's house. His wife has never shown any interest in Scouts or Scouting. They both seem happy doing what they do, they have been married for over 25 years. People in Scouting will do what they want to do. Some families will join as a family others will do their own thing. Her Who Must Be Obeyed never liked kids and said if she was ever a Den Leader that a few less Cub Scouts might be left at the end of a meeting!! She hates the great outdoors. Did attend Philmont with me for a week, said it was OK, but never wants to return. She has organized dinners and been Treasurer. She met me at a Boy Scout Camp, so I think or like to think she had some idea what she was letting herself in for. If there is a balance?? Each family must look at what they want to do and what they are happy doing. My thing was Scouting. Maybe if it if had been something else I would have spent as much time doing that. Maybe our relationship was made better because we both had and pursued our own interests? I really enjoy the time I spent with the youth members and while it might seem selfish I don't want to share it with others. Eamonn.

I really don't like Dr. Phil !! Somehow the idea of thinking that anyone who peddles a on line dating service is worth seeking advise from, just doesn't cut it for me. What's next Tom Cruise on marriage and child care? Eamonn.

I'm a little confused what this thread is about? Is it the uniform or that Scouting is out of date? A thread about uniforms and uniforming will stir everyone up. Someone will of course remind us all that while Uniform is a method of Scouting, a uniform is not required for membership in the BSA. Someone will say that the uniform is made of all the wrong materials. Then there is the question of the cut of the pants. After about 60 or 70 replies the thread will fade away until it comes back and we rehash it all over again. I gladly confess to being an old stick in the mud. I really don't care that much what the uniform is. I wear it because it is the uniform. But I hear you say "You are not a Lad of 12-15 years of age" Yes I was at one time, but that was some time back. I attended a School with a very strictly enforced School uniform. So maybe that doesn't count. I do however have a 18 year old home grown Lad. A good looking Lad. He likes cute t-shirts with words of wisdom or just silly words written on them. The school he attends doesn't allow shirts with ads for beer, cigarettes, drugs or sex. He must have been really bored one day over the summer, as he left his bedroom and informed me that he has 229 T-shirts. He has them in all sorts of colors. He has T-shirts from different Scout camps, different Scouting activities, the OA, Philmont, National Jamborees as well as the ones from choir, Students for ethical decision making (It's a club at school)plain white T-shirts, tie-dye T-shirts, old Navy, and just about every brand you can think of. I think he even has my Beatles Let it be T-shirt. As a rule lately he wears a unbuttoned dress type shirt over the T-shirt. He likes T-shirts. But he never wears a Scouting T-shirt to school. The Scouting shirts are the same cut as the other shirts, the colors are fine and dandy, he has at times pestered me to provide my hard earned money to pay for these shirts. So I can't help thinking that if the coolest person on the planet were to design a Scout shirt that looked in any way like a Scout shirt he wouldn't wear it to school. For the past few years his mother has spent countless hours telling him to pull his pants up. He was into the baggy look, this year he went shopping for jeans for school. I tend to go with Lee or Levi's, this year he is into Aropostale and they are so tight he can't fit his wallet in his back pocket. Talking with the mother of one his friends she was upset that her son spent $70.00 on jeans with holes in. I suppose I should be thankful that he isn't into holes. TJ, is a youth member of the Ship. A fairly good bass guitarist. TJ likes Heavy Metal music, I don't think he knows much about King Crimson or In the Court of the Crimson King, but he was trying to talk his parents into allowing him to attend Ozzy" Osbourne's Ozzfest. Somehow I don't see him wearing anything that might might be taken for a Scout uniform. Strange thing is that both these Lads are Sea Scouts they are both very happy to wear their Sea Scout uniforms, parts of which date back to the early 1800's. No they don't wear them to school, but they take great pride in being Sea Scouts and wearing the Sea Scout uniforms. As for saving Scouts? First we need to look at the reason why young people join Scouting? This isn't hard. They join for Fun, adventure and to be challenged. The little Lads in the blue shirts might join because their parents think it's a good idea, but that's another topic. Youth members quit because they are not having fun, they are not being challenged and there is not enough adventure. Of course different age groups have different levels of skill and varying abilities. But the Scouting program can offer a wide range of activities that will hold the interest of any young person. Sending letters to the National HQ is to my mind a waste of 39 cents. The program is what we the volunteers make of it and holding the interest of our youth members is all in how we deliver the program. If the group of Scouts you serve are not happy with filling the woods with a rousing chorus of Ging gang goolie, life isn't that hard -Just don't sing it! If you don't like the Wood Badge song and the Wood Badge critters take the course in England, they don't use patrol names any more!! We as the adults should know that this is a game with a purpose. But so far I have yet to meet a youth member who joined Scouting to have his or her Character developed or because they wanted to work on their ethical decision making skills. On page one of the Boy Scout Handbook we promise the lad who is joining Scouting a lot of things. If we want to "Save Scouting" all we have to do is deliver the goods. Eamonn.

"Have you thought of organizing a Crew that leverages the band student council and the parents organization? " No I haven't. My role as Skipper is to train the youth leaders and help them carry out the program that they decide upon. Our COR,who is also a Ship's Mate is the Treasurer for the Band Boosters. All of our Scouts are very busy people, we have Scouts who are involved in a wide variety of activities. When it comes to planning, we try and get the most bang for our buck, by not clashing with other events. We ask that Scouts try and let us know as far in advance as they can if they are going to be around or not. They can do this by marking it on the calendar on our Yahoo Group Page. Looking back over July: July 18 Full Band Music Rehearsal (Tentative) They didn't have it! July 24 -July 28 Mini Band Camp (Tentative)- It didn't happen August 7 -August 11 & August 14 -August 18 Full Band Camp. Both were canceled. August 21- August 23 Marching Band Rehearsal (Tentative) Canceled. August 24 Parent preview. Yes they did this one!! August 25 Deer Lakes Football Game (Tentative) canceled because they hadn't rehearsed!! August 26. Kennywood - Again canceled due to lack of rehearsal. August 29 - August 31 Rehearsal. They did this. Mean while the Scouts didn't want to sign up for any activities because they didn't want to miss the stuff the band had put on the calendar. It seems to me that someone went over the calendar and just filled in any date that they thought something might happen. Some of the parents were very unhappy and a couple of Band Members who are also Sea Scouts quit the band. I'm OK with trying to work around or with the activities the Scouts are doing, but I'm not going to change the plans that the Scouts have made just to accommodate the band members. The Nygard is held over the Memorial Day holiday weekend. The Quarterdeck made plans to attend, nearly all the Scouts signed up. It's about a five hour drive. The band members remembered that they were supposed to play at the local Memorial Day Parade on the Monday. Our COR comes up with the bright idea that we would all return home on Sunday?? He wasn't very happy when I said that I wasn't driving that far, that late at night. The program Sunday runs until about 9:00 PM. I'm OK with the band members (Six Scouts) leaving early if that's what they want to do. He dives a small pick up truck. So he wants to rent a van and share the cost with all the Scouts? I say that we didn't need a van to get the Scouts to the event. If he wants to rent one that's up to him, if the parents of the band members want to help pay for the van that's between him and them. Or if the parents want to drive and pick up their child I'm fine with that. He tells me that I'm being unreasonable?? I remind him that the Scouts didn't have to attend. In the end he drove his son and one other band member home on Sunday, the other Band members were happy to stay. The next committee meeting he wants the Ship to write to the Regatta Committee asking them to change the date? I say that I'm happy with it being over a holiday and if he wants to write as a Scout parent he can, but this isn't the feeling of the Ship. I don't seem to have the same sort of fuss from any other group and we have Scouts in football, soccer, dance, track, rock bands you name it. Eamonn.

PackCC99, Fuzzy Bear is right. While Scout Districts can and do a lot. While I don't want to go into the full workings of a District and do not want to belittle the workings of the people who make a District work. Districts are an arm of the Council and most of the goals they have to meet are all about numbers. * Membership Numbers. Each District should have a Membership Chair, who leads the District Membership Committee, they should work on new units and recruiting. * Finance. Again each District should have a Finance Chair, who leads the District Finance Committee. They should work on the FOS Campaign this is normally in 3 parts. District: How much will be collected from the members of the District Committee. Family: Working on the presentations that will be made to the units. Community: Money that will be collected from the local community. When I was District Chair. I wanted more effort put into the Community Campaign. My feelings were that the units have a hard enough time trying to come up with the money they needed to provide a worth while program. We were lucky that we had a very active Community Chairman, he worked with the District Finance Chair and the DE. The District was split into communities, each with a Community Captain, he or she was responsible for recruiting people who would "Work" 5 -10 Cards. The idea being that people will more than lightly give money to someone they know who asks them in person. We are a very small District in a rural area. At the time we were serving about 1,000 traditional members. My goal while it never was recorded was to bring in enough money to pay the salary of the DE. A little over $30,000 a year. While I was Chairman we seen a lot of the bigger companies in the area close or move out. This really hurt us as many of them did donate to the Council (by-passing the District and not helping us meet or reach our goal.) But a lot of the parents of our Scouts lost their jobs. Money was tight and they were unable to donate to the family FOS. The Council has a budget of almost $1.5 Million. That money has to come from some where. Last year we came up short. The Field Director we had left under a cloud, but was never replaced. He was the guy who gave leadership to the DE's, without a FD, I noticed that a lot of things that should have been done, weren't being done. There was talk about selling off the only Camp site we own (the other is leased from the state.) Building and maintenance of buildings came to a halt. 84 Lumber had donated over $100,000 worth of lumber, but the Council couldn't afford the nails, cement and shingles that was needed. Camp fees went up by $25.00 the biggest increase the Council had ever imposed. We can all argue if Councils spend money as wisely as they should? I know at times I feel that the pros are not doing enough and seem to rely too much on the people who are doing the most to give the most. I have never understood why each and every Council doesn't have a skilled Grant Writer on staff. You are correct when you say that money given to your CO can be given without following the Guidelines. Of course that money isn't really been given to the Pack and it would be up to the CO if they want to use it for the Pack. They could use it for something else, which might lead to a lot of ill feelings. Eamonn.

I have to admit to being a little surprised that the DE is OK with this. While companies can donate to a Scout unit,in most cases Scout units are not recognized by the IRS as charities and the donation is not tax deductible. A lot will depend on what are calling sponsorships? If the local restaurant is supplying the hot-dogs for nothing or the local trophy shop is donating the trophies, I don't see much of a problem, but if a local company is donating lots stuff either money or product you might have a problem. Councils do not like units getting stuff from local businesses, Scout units are supposed to earn the money that they get.Most Districts/ Councils rely on local businesses when it comes time for the community FOS campaign. I know when I was District Chairman we had a local florist that always donated to the District FOS, I called them to remind them and they said they had already donated. It turned out that a local pack had asked for a center-piece for their B&G. The florist didn't know that units and Districts aren't the same thing. The pack ended up with a $20.00 flower arrangement the council lost a $250.00 donation. You might want to check out the Unit Money Earning Application and the guidelines before you move ahead. http://www.scouting.org/forms/34427.pdf Welcome to the forum. Eamonn.

I used to try and be a Jack of all trades. At the time I was fortunate enough to belong to a unit that had tons of money. Sadly I now find that a lot has changed equipment is far better, but not the stuff I used to use and I have started to find out that I'm a lot different then I was 20 years ago. Most times I'm happy to introduce the Scouts I serve to a new activity. We are lucky in our area we have a lot of adventurous activities for the Scouts to try. I also know a lot of people who seem to specialize in doing what they do. Once I have introduced the Scouts to something I'm happy to help them pursue it further. We have taken Scouts caving and because I knew the guide he kicked it up a notch, but didn't go over the top. At the end of the day one Scout was offered a job at the caves. This past summer we went Sea Kayaking, next summer one of the Scouts is returning to the camp as a Sea Pup. I find that while I can still manage the activities I do at times hold the Scouts back. Keeping up with 16-18 year olds is hard and when I'm done I hurt for about a week. If you can find a good Silver Horn course that is being held in your area I think you might find some good resources. I do think it's important that you find a local course. We had a group of guys travel to Cleveland Ohio for the course, they all had a great time, but all the resources they found out about were in that area, while not the other end of the world, it's still a long way from home. The Venturing Handbook has a list of different organizations that you might want to contact. Right now I see myself as more of a facilitator, I tend to try and point the Scouts in the right direction and have them find out the details, report back what they have found and we take it from there. Very often all they need from me is my driving and at times use of a credit card to make the booking. I see my role as a youth leader not an expert in everything. I do try and make sure I know the basics and I follow up doing the stuff that is of interest to me, if they want to tag along that is up to them. Right now they want to do Scuba. I found the contact, helped set it up and I'm willing to provide transportation, I don't have any real need or interest in becoming certified in Scuba, but I'm happy to help them do what they want to do. On the other hand some of them want to work on the Ranger Award, I want to try and make sure we cover the core requirements, so I'm taking the LNT Instructor course, a couple of Scouts said that they were interested so they are also attending. Eamonn.

For a while in our District we had a fair amount of Crews springing up all over the place. While of course each situation was a little different. What seemed to be happening was that someone wanted to do something to hold the interest of old Scouts in a Troop and in most cases using the same CO and Boy Scout leaders started a Crew. These Crews really never had any idea of what they were about. If asked they would say they were a High Adventure Crew, but it seemed that there never was any adventure in anything they ever did. I was talking with a fellow from Virginia they seem to have a good Venturing Crew, they had been an Explorer Post that did a lot of activities that had to do with radios. The guy I was talking with works for NASA. The young people who join that crew join because they have an interest in radios. This seems to work for them. I know that there are some Crews that do very well working hand in hand with members who are also in the Boy Scout Troop with the same CO. However that wasn't the case in our area. The Crews never seemed to reach out to non-Boy Scouts or girls and the big activities seemed to be helping out at Boy Scout events. We do have one Crew in the Council where the adults are into guns and shooting, about once a month they go shooting and other than that they go ten-pin bowling every now and then. I used to think this was strange, but after talking with some of the youth members, they seem happy and the Crew is doing what they want to do. Very often a Venturing unit when it starts will take on the interest of the adults who are there or the organization that is chartering the Crew. The Crews that we seen spring up with no idea where they were going didn't last very long. I have to admit to being too much of an old Boy Scouter to really get the "Venturing Frame Of Mind", because of that I got involved in Sea Scouting. Sure we had some interest from a few Boy Scouts to start, but for my part I liked the fact it was very structured and someone with a pea brain like me could follow the program. We have grown by leaps and bounds. We have some members who never miss a meeting or activity, while others pick and choose what they want to participate in depending on interest and what else they might be involved in. The big problem we faced was communication. The Scouts needed to know what was going on a fair amount of time ahead so they could make plans to attend. For a while when we started I got very frustrated I was planning activities and events and they either weren't interested or were already doing something else. At the time we didn't really have any youth leadership, so if I hadn't we would have ended up doing nothing, so it was a catch 22 situation. Now we have the youth leadership in place and have spent a fair amount of time on Quarterdeck Training, things are getting better. I still have to follow up and chase them and I do hold them accountable to do what they have said that they are going to do. Some of the adults in the Ship still think we need to do stuff with Boy Scout Troops, thankfully the Sea Scouts don't see it that way. We are moving ahead, but still have a few problems with motivating them to get involved in Fund raising events. Maybe you should try meeting with the people from the other Crew? I don't know how many youth members each unit has? But what would happen if you joined forces and tried working together? With so much going on and this age group being involved in so many activities any event that sees 50% attendance is in my book a success. We have 32 Sea Scouts, some events will only see 10 or 12 (I hate that HS Band!!) Of course if you only have 6 or 8 Venturers and only half of them show it makes the event seem like it wasn't worth organizing particularly if one of the youth members has put a lot of time and effort into organizing it. Good Luck. Eamonn.

"Training a dog & training a boy are not even close to being the same thing. " I have to beg to differ. Sure we train them to do different things. But both dogs and boys respond well to love, affection, caring and consistency. Hopefully Boys will learn more than dogs. Dogs don't have ethics. But if someone is always going to tell the boy what he has to do, does he need ethical thinking? Both Rory and Joe are very well behaved when we have company. Next time your passing stop in for an adult beverage and I'll prove it. Eamonn.

"The Southern Region is sending 2 crews. I have no idea about the other 3." This is not the information that we were given during the teleconference two weeks ago. Admittedly everyone was from the NE-Region. So I will have to accept that I was wrong. The NE-Region will fill the open spots with Venturers from the Transatlantic Council. Eamonn.

I of course am to young to have been around when BP and the founders of Scouting were doing their thing. I really think BP and the others were way ahead of their times and to me seem to have had a good grasp and understanding of Boys, especially when I try to understand and think about the times and attitudes of the times when they were doing their thing. As a Kid growing up they seemed a lot more understanding than the adults I had to deal with. My Irish-catholic upbringing and education was not what anyone would term as "Jolly" by any means. As a kid growing up in the early 1960's. I seen in the media lots of stuff about Free Love and all that other stuff. But I was expected to be seen and not heard. I don't think I did the right thing because it was the right thing. - I think I done it because I was scared. Scared that if I got caught that I'd end up in hot water, scared that Sister Mary- Matthew would whack me, scared that if my parents found out that Sister had whacked me, they would add a whacking and scared if I got away with it and God got me before I'd made it to the confessional that I'd up in purgatory or worse still end up spending eternity with fire and damnation. Sure we did things that were supposed to be good. Every Lent I took home my little Save The Children Box and collected pennies for what was then "The Little Black Babies". I filled the box, but all the time I was thinking that it wasn't fair -Heck them pennies could be spent on something important -Me!! I don't think I gave a tinkers about ethics. My philosophy for life was based on "Only the mugs get caught." The easiest way not to get caught was not to do it in the first place. Doing the right thing wasn't about doing it because it was right, it was doing it because there was less fuss that way. At times I know OJ, does what is expected of him not for any other reason other than to get people off his back. This isn't ethics at work, there is nothing "Good" about it or in it. Right now I can't think what it is called? I like to think I care about the people I meet and work for, a lot of them and their families thank me for taking the time to explain things and go over things with them. At times my boss tells me that I'm getting too involved. I'll admit that there are some people that I seem to warm up to more than others and there are a few that I consider to be real pains. Still I try to do my best for all of them, even the pains. I don't get anything extra for doing this, I'm not going to lose my job if I stop. Maybe deep down I'm like the guy who helped change the tire and I hope that one day someone will do the same for me. Eamonn.

Rory has just retrieved one of OJ's socks from the laundry room. A sock that didn't need to be retrieved. I as his Lord and Master, don't want him to have the sock. My options are: *Fight with him and do the tug of war thing. This will or could result in the sock ending up with holes in it. * Give him a whack and tell him what a bad dog he is. To date I have never whacked him as I think this is what makes dogs mean. * Bribe him by offering him a treat and when he opens his mouth grab the sock. This would work but what happens when I don't have any treats at hand? * Ask him to "Give". He has been trained to give up what he has in his mouth and in return I tell him what a good boy he is. Of course life would be a lot nicer if he hadn't retrieved the sock in the first place. He gives (gave) up the sock, because we have a good relationship, not because he is scared of me or because I'm going to bribe him. Of course the MBC should never have signed off on the requirement. Yes the guy needs a good swift kick in the pants. But the Scout is not to blame. What happens next is up to the Troop Leadership. If you do an inventory of what options are open and look at what Scouting is supposed to be all about, what are the options? Eamonn.

Hi Don, Welcome to the forum. I'm a little confused about what you mean when you post "There has been a bit of misinformation so let's get this straight." "For the 2007 WJ, there are an abundance of unfilled youth slots, particularly for female venturers. Cost is $3975 + about $1000 for expenses" I posted: 2007 is costing approx $5,000 per participant. ($3,975 per person + The cost of getting to the gateway airport and the shakedown + uniforms and special equipment. When it comes to female Venturers. Each Region is only sending one Crew of 36 youth members and all Venturers must be under 18. "Cost is highly dependent on host country fee set for attendees. Expect no more than $4000-4500 for the fee in 2011 unless air fare prices and exchange rates go through the roof." The cost of the airfare to Sweden is 80% higher than the cost to England. As a Ex-Londoner who goes home every now and then, I think $4,975 is a very expensive. We didn't spent that much for a family of 3, including a car rental, one week touring and a week at Baden Powell House!! Attending a World Jamboree is an unforgettable experience. Sadly it out of the reach of most families in the area where I live. Unlike many other activities the cost isn't off set by organized fund raising activities like you would find in unit or Council events. The money available for "Camperships" is very limited and most Councils tend to see participation as an individual choice, not as sending a Representative from the Council. Although I do know that some service organizations will help at the local level. The $7,500 I quoted is a guesstimate. I hope I'm wrong. But if you asked me five years ago what a gal of gas would cost? I would never have guessed nearly $3.00 a gal. Eamonn.

In the real world. I like to think I know the Scouts I serve and that they know me. If a Scout is supposed to know or have done something and he or she doesn't know or hasn't done what was to be done. I'd smile. Shake my head. He or She would smile back and we would revisit the whatever. While at times I can make a fuss and carry on, I try really hard to save that for things that are really important. - Normally issues that are about safety. The age group I deal with mostly 16 and 17 years old do not like being told that they HAVE too. I have had Scouts complain about doing something. When I say "No one told you that you had to do it." The answer I get is "Yes, but you gave me that look!!" I really wish I was better at trying to explain where I'm coming from. I think all of us would agree that signing off on a requirement that hasn't been met is just plain wrong. The easy way to fix it would be to tell the Scout that it was wrong and that he has to redo or do whatever to cover /meet the requirement. After we have made a statement like that, if the Scout were to refuse our backs would be against the wall. Looking at the aims of Scouting. While each Scouting Organization or Association specifies the Aim of Scouting a little differently and each section might word the aims a little differently at the end of the day it boils down that the aims are: Building Character Fostering Citizenship Promoting Fitness . While I don't want to get off topic, I do want to mention that these are not the reasons why Scouts become Scouts. I happen to think that the BSA at times is guilty of over using the word Character. After all Character is a fairly generic term. It means the combination of qualities or features that distinguish one person or group from another. Very often when I use the word Character, I'm talking about someone who makes me laugh. But maybe that's just me? Of course that isn't what we are talking about when we say that Scouting builds Character. In Scouting we are talking about a about the qualities of a person that makes him self-sufficient, motivated, charitable, concerned for others, and willing to accept the responsibilities placed before him. While discipline or disciplined might well be in that mix. I don't really think that we are really looking for people who can't think for themselves and only do things because they are told to do them. Scouting aims to build self-confidence, problem solving, compassion, acceptance of personal responsibility, and leadership skills within each Scout. This allows the individual boy well prepared for life in an adult world. Fostering Citizenship;Regardless of what country a Scout lives in, there are qualities and responsibilities expected of every citizen.Scouting aims to teach each Scout the rights and responsibilities of citizenship and provide him with real experience in citizenship. The end result of such training should be individuals who know what it means to be a citizen, what is expected of them, and what they can expect in return. They are prepared to participate in society and in many cases become leaders in their community or profession. Promote Fitness;Being fit means, of course, much more than being muscular or athletic. Scouting believes that quality citizens with good character should also maintain a good level of physical and mental fitness. That doesn't mean Scouting expects every Scout to be athletic and scholarly. What it means is that a Scout learns to challenge himself physically and mentally, and to remain fit in order to meet that challenge. Scouts experience a high level of activity, and are challenged to do many things that require physical and mental fitness. Through these experiences, the Scout learns to enjoy being fit. He learns the dangers of becoming sedentary and complacent, and of being tempted by lifestyles that lead to mental and physical weakness. Scouting's aims represent the ultimate goal of the organization for each Scout. The aims aren't the path we need to take, or the blueprint for our success. The aims are the end result, the destination of our journey. In Scouting, the aims represent the result we want from the process of Scouting. This is our ideal. We need to keep an eye on the aims, but most of our attention and effort should be on the steps we take toward that goal. That means it's important to know what the aims of Scouting are, but our main concern should be the methods of Scouting. The methods of the Scouting movement are the means through which the aims are achieved: Scouting Ideals Patrols Outdoors Advancement Personal Growth Adult Association Leadership Development Uniform. It is worth mentioning that: The aims of the movement can be attained without these methods, but it wouldn't be Scouting. Likewise, these methods can produce quality individuals without the aims. But, again that wouldn't be Scouting. Scouting is in fact a combination of these aims and these methods. When I think about the question: "If The Requirement Isn't Completed"? I have to think about the ideals of Scouting. The ideals are those outlined in the Scout Oath and Law, the Scout Motto and Slogan, and the concept of "Scout Spirit". The ideals define what a Scout should strive to be: trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, reverent, mentally awake, morally straight, physically fit, always prepared. This method permeates everything Scouts do, defining acceptable behavior, challenging the Scout to do his best, and even to do better than his best. Scout spirit describes the level of commitment a Scout has toward these ideals, and challenges him to do what needs to be done. Some people might say the answer to the lies in here? I tend to agree, but I see the Oath and Law as a personal commitment. I think maybe the answer is to be found in Personal Growth.Much of what we do in Scouting involves boys facing unfamiliar territory and learning to cope with it. This is what we call personal growth,this isn't just about longer hikes or that sort of stuff. It is about Scouts looking at themselves and taking on greater responsibilities and challenges. He also learns to make real decisions. The answer can also be found in Adult Association.Adults provide the safety net that allows Scouting to work. Through guidance and support adults in Scouting create the environment the Scouts need to take advantage of these methods. The Scout learns to work with other adults and develops the skills needed to navigate the adult world. In Scouting we are in the business of building character and we do that by presenting challenges for youth and helping them develop the confidence to meet those challenges. As each challenge is met, the Scout's confidence grows, as does his self-esteem. It is the process of trying and failing then trying and succeeding that does that. Eamonn.

Joe, Attending the Jamboree as an adult isn't that easy. The host country normally can provide most of the staff that is needed and they have a lot of places where they can select staff from. They tend to need people who have very special skills (Doctors, nurses and clergy) and prefer staff who are fluent in English and another language.(French, Spanish and German are the biggies.) The BSA Troops are set up very much like the Troops are for the Jamboree: One Scoutmaster, who as a rule is someone who has either a lot of international scouting experience or has attended a WSJ before. Two ASM's and a younger ASM who is normally under 21 years old. Each Region is allotted so many Troops. There are always a lot more adults apply then there is openings, so the Region can be very selective. Wanting to go and being able to afford to go as an adult is great, but doesn't necessarily mean that you will be selected. Five years is a very long time in the life of a Boy. While the 11 or 12 year old Lad might be gung ho for Scouts and Scouting, that same Lad in five years when he is 16 or 17? - Who knows? Eamonn.

"What do you have to do get into your national contingent in order to attend a world jambo? Or can anybody go? " Youth members are approved by the local Council. Adults are selected by the Region. As a rule a lot more adults apply to go than there are spaces for. The 2007 Jamboree still had a lot of spaces for youth. In fact so many that the number of Troops was cut back, of course with less Troops the need for adults was also cut back. The cost is the killer. 2007 is costing approx $5,000 per participant. ($3,975 per person + The cost of getting to the gateway airport and the shakedown + uniforms and special equipment) 2011 is five years away. I had hoped that OJ and myself would attend the 2007 Jamboree, but $10,000 the same year as he is starting college would have stretched the family finances a little too far. Especially when we go visit England just about any time we feel like it for a lot less. We might visit the 2007 Jamboree and there is a rumor that the Dutch Sea Scouts are planning something?? Of course the 2011 will only be a year after our 2010 National Jamboree. Depending on where you are located that is going to cost about another $1,000 per person. I have to admit to being very disappointed that for 2007 the home hospitality has been replaced with a 3 day bus tour. Heck it 3 days to find a place to park in London!! The Scouts are staying at Hertfordshire University,which is only about 25 miles outside of London, but anyone who has ever tried driving in London knows that 25 miles can take over an hour. The Scouts are in tour buses, most people would go by train. While no numbers are yet available as far as what 2011 will cost? I'm guesstimating $7,500 per person. Eamonn.

Lisabob The letter should be sent to the Council Advancement Chairman of the Council. You might want to word how upset the Troop is that the camp failed to give the Scouts the opportunity to meet the requirements correctly and have placed the Scouts and the Troop leaders in an ethical dilemma. The final authority should rest with the Scout. It really is his choice to do what he thinks is right. As far as the BSA is concerned he has a signed blue card and is good to go. I feel sure that any Scout who was refused rank advancement (Eagle) because the SM wasn't happy with the standards of MBC would win if the Scout appealed to National. The card signed by the MBC will win the day. We may not like it or agree with it, but that's the way it is. We can in our own Councils do everything possible to ensure that MBC's do the job they are supposed to do. This might mean upsetting a few people. Eamonn. Eamonn.

In May 2004 the World Scout Bureau called on National Scout organizations (NSO) to host the 2011 World Jamboree, the deadline was July 25 2004. From the applications received the World Scout Committee brought before the conference the following invitations: Australia. Japan. Singapore. Sweden. Sweden was chosen. The proposed dates are July 29 - August 7, 2011 The theme is: "Join the camp within the camp" Details can be found at: http://www.jamboree.scout.se/ At this time all the information is in Swedish. Yes it is official. I attended Nordjamb and we had HOHO (Home Hospitality) in Sweden. It's a wonderful country. Eamonn.