Eamonn

My reef-knot tying friend SSScout brings up Cub Scout Advancement. Those of us who have served in Cub Scouting and followed the BSA guidelines can, I'm almost certain tell stories about the Wolf or the Bear who's parent has gone through the book and signed off on all the requirements. I have been spending some time reading about the changes in UK Scouting. The move there seems to be moving away from Advancement and more toward participation. They still have ranks and badges, but participation in events seems to be the big thing more than meeting requirements as we know them. Eamonn.

We all face choices everyday. Most times most of us are aware if what we choose is right or wrong. My Mother-in-law was in her car on a fairly busy highway when she got a flat tire. Lots of people choose to drive by, but one nice man stopped and changed the tire for her. She offered him money, but he refused saying that he hoped if it had been his Mom someone would stop for her. Some years back I was dealing with a large food-service company, buying big boxes of crab legs. One week the amount on the bill was wrong, when I looked closely I seen that they had placed the decimal point in the wrong place. I had ordered and received 500 pound of crab legs,but had only been charged for 50.00. I called the company and explained their mistake. The Lady was less then helpful telling me that their computers didn't make mistakes!! I thought she was being a real pain, so I told her that next week I'd order 1,000 pound and we'd see if her computer made a mistake or not. The salesman came in( he stopped every week.)I explained that I owed him for 450 pound of crab legs and that I thought the Lady in their accounts payable was a real pain. He explained that he couldn't take my money without an invoice. He called the accounts payable department and must have got my Lady. She informed him that the computer didn't make a mistake. He got upset and when he got off the phone told me to go ahead and order the 1,000 pound. Sure enough for a month they kept sending me crab legs and only charging me for one tenth of what it should have been. Every week I called the accounts payable and gave them a running total of what I owed them. I now owed them several thousand dollars. Every week I kind of jokingly told the salesman that they had done it again. I wasn't happy so I called the company and spoke with a vice-president and gave him the entire story. He got back to me and informed me that the company that supplied them with the crab legs were at fault, they packed and weighted the boxes at sea and had messed up and in fact the Lady in accounts payable was right their computer hadn't made a mistake. I said that was fine, but I still needed to pay for the crab legs. He said that he had talked with the crab leg company and they were grateful that someone had pointed out the mistake, not only did they not want the money back but they were sending me a 1,000 of crab legs at no charge. I knew from the first delivery that something was wrong. I knew ordering them again and doubling the order was even more wrong. I was willing to put things right and pay the full amount for what I'd received. I like to think that I tried to do the right thing. We sold the crab legs at menu price, we made a heck of a lot of money. The Food-service company didn't lose any money, but the company that caught the crab legs were out. I know I wasn't the only person buying crab legs, I think I was the only person who complained and brought it to their attention. In the end the seafood company was pleased that someone had brought it to their attention. It's a shame the Lady in accounts payable decided that it wasn't her job, but the fact is -It wasn't her job. The person that is to blame is the guy who set the scales on board the ship. Sometimes trying to do the right thing is hard. Eamonn.

"Start little by little taking on more of the SM responsibilities. Maybe start with overseeing the PLC " I'm sorry Linda, I really have to disagree. The PLC works with the Scoutmaster, adding more adults takes away from what the PLC is trying to do. Also if the Scoutmaster who is on the way out is as Joe describes I can't see that the PLC is doing very much anyway. Things might be a little different if the SM wasn't retiring. If Joe has the time, he might want to visit and get to know the SM's of other Troops. Maybe he could ask the R/T Commissioner to do something about moving toward the youth led unit at a couple of meetings. As SM I seen the time spent at PLC's as the time I had with the youth leaders. I did invite our adult QM to attend on condition that he only spoke when he was spoken to or asked a question. Everything that the Troop does comes from the PLC meetings. It's hard enough to get the SPL to run and plan the meeting without adding more adults. pargolf44067 Whatever happens don't spent time beating yourself up on what might have been. Troops and I hope Ship's?? Seem to have cycles. One year the youth leaders will be the best group ever and things will go that way for a time. Then it seems like a group comes along that are lazy little toads, who need constant reminders and for some unknown reason even with the best will and training just never seem to get it. But then the tide changes again. We as leaders make the same oath as the Scouts, we are all doing our best. Troops change, for a while you might have a large group of older Scouts and then it seems that they are gone and have been replaced by a group of little Lad's who have just crossed over. Enjoy the ride. Enjoy spending time with the Scouts, they know and can see how much you care. They may not tell you now, but I'll bet my last dollar that 20 years from now they will remember you with fondness. Eamonn.

Some years back OJ quit the Troop he was in because he felt that they were handing out Merit Badges. He freely admitted that he had several that he felt he hadn't earned. As far as I know (and please correct me if I'm wrong.) Once the card has gone into the Council Service Center there is no system in place to remove it or take it back. I can't remember who posted something that I remember as saying "They are using advancement as an aim not a method"? But if we look at advancement as a method of Scouting. We can use this situation as a great learning opportunity. I find that I'm in complete agreement with Eagledad (Barry). We as adults really should be asking: "Why wasn't the requirement completed?" Merit Badges should be like full gallons of 2% milk. Each and every Scout should meet the requirements. Just as a gallon of 2% milk should have 2% fat and be 128 ounces. I wonder why or what reason a counselor would have for not doing the job he volunteered to do? GernBlansten You might do better with the tautline hitch if you remember it as the Midshipman's hitch. Eamonn.

"The mission of the Boy Scouts of America is to prepare young people to make ethical and moral choices over their lifetimes by instilling in them the values of the Scout Oath and Law" Sure telling anyone they have to do something will achieve the right thing. "Along with that telling should be a explanation as to why it is the right thing to do" If we are doing what we should. Surely it is better if we explain why we think it is the right thing and then leave the choice of what to do up to the Scout? (Your Welcome) Eamonn.

"If he doesn't know, then he needs to be told" Told what? I think we should explain why it should be returned, (The Scout Oath and Law are great guidelines) but the we need to step back and allow the Scout to do what he thinks is right. Returning the money just because he has to is or because he was told to is not what we are trying pass on to the Scouts we serve. Eamonn.

Thanks for the more than kind words. I'm now a deep reddish color. I haven't seen or read the changes that have been made to the course. I'm really thankful to the course, it did more for me than I was able to give or get over to the participants. As a CD I spent more hours than I can count reading and going over the syllabus. While we pledge to present the syllabus, I spent a lot of time asking what does it mean and what does it mean to me? I spent more time reading just about everything Ken Blanchard ever wrote. While I wish I was maybe a little more religious I found a lot in the book he wrote "Leadership By The Book". Not so much from the religious stand point but that book really drove home to me the idea of Servant Leadership which I tried to really impress on our staff and tried to get across to the course participants. While maybe I'm wrong? I think that some Staffers are so overjoyed that they have been invited to serve that they sometimes seem to forget it is all about serving the needs of the participants while delivering the course. While the old Boy Scout course was a good course, it did need to be changed. Sadly over the years the stuff that many people had added(dare I use the word tweaked?) had become as important as the course. The SM had been elevated to such a high and mighty rank that it was silly. Yes I was there for Scoutmasters chairs and having to change uniform in oder to wear what he was wearing. The old Cub Scout Trainer course, did a wonderful job of allowing time to really look at what Cub Scouting is all about but it was about training Trainer's how to train and maybe it was just too good. The Staff had been working on their presentation for about a year and what they presented was out of this world. While back here on earth we know that we fit Cub Scout Training's in as and when we can and as sure as heck after spending hours making the best power point presentation we arrive at the church hall only to find that there is no electrical outlets!! The old Cub course was offered by the Region and the Staff never really got to know each other as most came from different Councils. A friend of mine is to be a CD next year. He has informed me that he wants the staff to be in the red wool jackets and wearing campaign hats. That of course is up to him. I don't agree with it for a lot of reasons, but most of all I didn't see it as being important when I was CD. If Her Who Must Be Obeyed is feeling a little better, I hope to attend Sea Badge Training this fall. I have to admit that so far I have not been impressed, I have received lots of E-mails about what uniforms are required and asking what size jacket I want, but not a word about the course. I'm happy to wear whatever is required, I'm OK with adding yet another jacket that I don't need to the uniform collection. I don't mind the five hour each way drive or the $200.00 course fee. I will be upset if the course turns out to be about how great the staff is. I know that a lot of Scouter's who took the old courses really came away with a lot. The Boy Scout course should have really impressed on every participant how important the Patrol Method is. But to my way of thinking it gave a really bad example of the role of the SM. If and I know it will never happen I had my way I'd like to move the Tickets to the very end of the course, maybe having the Ticket Counselor approve them. I know a lot of participants claim that working their Ticket was the thing that they got the most out of. But it seems to me that the Ticket over-shadows a lot of course time. I find the Win All You Can /Game Of Life, to be very upsetting, I think maybe because it tends to show us not as I'd like us to be. At times I think we over-rate the course. It is a very good course. As a rule everyone has a good time, but that shouldn't be a surprise, we are bringing together a group of people who share the same interest and values. While I know that my Wood Badge days are over, I would like one day to be invited to present the Leaving A Legacy presentation. A lot of the people I invited to be on staff and who did staff the course are now busy staffing courses. I feel much the same way as I do about the Scouts I've had the honor to serve. I look at them with great pride a smile hoping that I served them well. Maybe this will be part of my "Leave this jolly old world a little better"? Eamonn

Exactly my point. How much better is it if a Scout returned it on his own, without having someone tell him he had to. Eamonn.

Making sure the right thing is done, can be hard work but is in most cases possible. We can line our Scouts up and march them to the shower house and with a little luck the end result is something that might be acceptable as clean Scouts. Not that hard. We can impose a rule that states Scouts have to attend X amount of meetings or else they will not be allowed to participate in a certain activity, like going to an amusement park. (If they have missed the Training's for an event a different rule applies.) Or they will not be allowed to advance. I suppose if there was enough paper in the world we could have a rule for just about everything. Don't do this and Must do that. Still at some stage even with all the rules there will be a time when something will come along which is the right thing to do because it's just the right thing to do. Getting things done right is not the same as doing the right thing. Fairness? Doesn't come into it. Is it fair that some people get away with not doing the right thing, while others go the extra mile to do things right? Making sure things are done right eliminates choice. If we think about feeding a Troop of Scouts we can make sure they are fed by having the adults cook all the food. Having the Patrols cook the food might not ensure the same quality of food, but the Scouts learn by doing it. The same can be said for teaching making ethical choices. We can make sure that they do the right thing, but what are they really learning? What happens when there isn't a rule or someone to answer too? Eamonn.

Going along with a Scout is Kind. Remember that even a stopped clock is right twice a day. Cut the poor fellow some slack and count the days till he is gone. This Youth Led program is good stuff. I really like it. Someone a lot wiser than I once said: Train Them, Trust Them, Let Them Lead. Sadly there isn't a Youth Led Fairy!! That first part the "Train Them" bit doesn't happen over night. Even in Troops where they have a tradition of using the Patrol method, they still have to go back and train both the youth members and the adults. Grab a group of Scouts, stick them around the table and tell them that as of now they are "Youth Led" and you will get the Deer in the headlights look. Sending a few of them to NYLT and running an in house Training will help, but the best training will be the on the job training. What I'm trying to say is, I'm overjoyed that you are heading in the right direction. But.. It isn't going to be easy, take it easy, take pigeon steps and remember KISMIF. Eamonn.

Fuzzy, If you do this in the Alps you might be a Swiss Fuzzy Bear Roll or maybe a Vienna sausage wrap. Eamonn.

"At a BOR. Or when the Scout was asked to do something he should have learned" This smells a little like re-testing to me. In the other thread a Mom posted that she found out from her son that some requirements were not met. I think we would all agree that this isn't a good thing and everything should be done to ensure that it doesn't happen. Still we have a system in place and we either trust the system, trust the people who have been entrusted to do the job and trust the Scout to do the right thing. If we resort to re-testing at BOR and retesting MB's why go to all the bother of having a system and having MBC's? A counselor who doesn't do what is supposed to be done, can't be trusted and is not acting like a Scout. He or She is in fact cheating the Boy the opportunity to do what he signed up for. No blame or shame can be put on the Lad. If the Scout finds out that he has been cheated, it then becomes his choice what to do about it. He has the right to do nothing and take what he was given. After all what went wrong was not his doing and not his fault. However as we are trying to help Scouts make ethical choices (Yes choices) I would hope that someone would in a very nice and friendly way point out that the Badge is not really representing what it should. That nice friendly person might want to remind the Scout that by wearing the Badge he is in fact making a statement. The statement being "I met all the requirements for this Badge." They might ask if the Scout thinks he should wear the Badge? We spend a lot of time talking about uniforms in this forum, very often we forget that our uniform is also a method of communication. The Scout can if he chooses wear the Badge, but if he knows that he didn't meet the requirements it's just a badge with no merit. Eamonn.

Of course if we strongly believe that a Scout is to be trusted, the Scout will point out that an error has been made. The same as a Scouter would never take change for a $20.00 when he only gave a $5.00 If the Scout didn't know that the error had been made? I have to wonder how it would come to light? Eamonn.

Hi babybear4747 We don't know what your Vision or Mission is. Cookie cutter Ticket items are not what the Ticket is all about. The Diversity Ticket item does seem to be the one that participants have the most problems with. You might want to take some time to think what diversity means to you? Please don't tell anyone but when I first seen that the BSA had included a Diversity requirement to the Ticket I thought it was all about being political correctness. I was of course wrong. The Lady who covered the Diversity Presentation at a Course I was staffing gave everyone a penny. Of course all the pennies were different, some old, some new, some well worn and just to make life interesting she had a couple of Wheat Pennies in the mix. Everyone was asked to look at their penny and look at other pennies. She then brought up the fact that when we bring all these pennies together we can make things happen. The first thing you might want to think about and maybe brain storm on your own is what makes people different? Sure we can all come up with color, race and creed. But you can go deeper than that. A friend of mine who is CM for a very rural pack organized with an inner-city pack that they would have joint pack meeting in each others meeting place. What made these two packs different was geographical location. I was a SM for a Troop in London, which was only 40% white, the other 60% were from all over the world. We had black Scouts from the West Indies and from different parts of Africa. Indian and Pakistani Scouts with different religions. Many had very strict diet requirements because of their religion. Food is a great way of bridging the gap when it comes to cultural differences. Everyone has to eat!! While I'm a skinny little fellow, who works with diets, lately I feel that it seems we as a nation are picking on and giving heavy people a hard time. Not everyone who is fat sits at home all day doing nothing but eat junk food. Just because they are heavy doesn't mean that they are dirty or lazy. (My latest pet peeve!!) Which in a way brings up the next thing once you have a long list of different groups. You might want to ask what makes them so different? Getting all this on paper as a goal. Can be tough. I love music and like just about everything. I have a fair sized collection of CD's with music from all over the world. When I first heard rap music, I didn't really give it a chance and dismissed it all as being terrible!! It took a little time but the Scouts in the Ship worked on me and while some of it is really terrible, some of it is very good. I like to think that even though at times they complain about the stuff I might play when we are driving, I'm opening their minds to a more diverse taste in music. I feel sure if you put your thinking cap on you will see that it's a big diverse world out there and coming up with one goal isn't that hard. Eamonn.

OGE, You are as ever right. purcelce It's great that you are thinking ahead. Keep the idea that you have on a back burner. Go over the 20 question sheet and be really honest!! No one is going to see your answers. As the course unfolds how Tickets fit in becomes very clear. You might find that the item you have in mind now is just the Ticket (Sorry!!) Or you might find that it doesn't fit in with your vision and mission. In the past the problems I've seen with Tickets have been where people go with a shopping list of Ticket ideas, but they don't really have a vision or a mission. This can be a little like putting the cart before the horse. The Ticket is not and should not be that hard!! All you are doing is making a list of at least six goals that you will accomplish in the next 18 months, that pertain to your role in Scouting. These goals should help you move toward your mission which should help move toward your overall Vision. One goal should deal with diversity, but should still remain in the framework of your vision and mission. While the Troop Guide is there to help you think about and maybe put down on paper what your goals are and will approve the goals, they remain yours. If you think of your Ticket as you writing a script for a movie or a play. What you have right now might be a Spaceman Suit, but when you start to write your Ticket (Script) It turns out to be a Western, maybe the spaceman suit just doesn't fit in? Eamonn.

Not sure how this goes with this thread. As you know OJ finally completed his Eagle Scout in June. He is in charge of the COH. Except for the choice of disposables, which Her Who Must Be Obeyed has had in store for ever. He is a little concerned that I will in some way either embarrass him or take over. I have already decided that when the day comes, I'm going as his Dad not as a Scouter. He has said that I can have a few minutes. I know that I talk too much,so I'm not going to say anything!! I have put together a power point presentation of photos of him growing up, not just Scouting. I needed to cover five minutes and thats a lot of photos. I'm not trying in any way to embarrass him, no baby in the bath or that sort of thing. But a lot of him thinking -When he did on the rare occasions think he used to stick his tongue out of the side of him mouth. He was asking me about who should get the Eagle Mentor Pin? I have to admit that I thought that he'd present me with it. But as ever I was wrong!! He thought about it for a week or so and came back telling me who he had choose. It was someone I'd never have thought of in a thousand years. In fact to be very honest the guy has never really impressed me!! He serves as an ASM in OJ's old Troop. While I have kind of looked at everyone for what they do for Scouting, OJ knows this man as a friend. They have spent a lot of time talking to each other over the years. The guy has two son's both Eagle Scouts one a year older than OJ and one two or three years older. When I asked OJ "Why him?" He said that this fellow had always been there for him. Me not saying anything will be hard, but the music I have chosen to go with the PPP covers everything I would like to say. Bob Dylan . Forever Young. May God bless and keep you always, May your wishes all come true, May you always do for others And let others do for you. May you build a ladder to the stars And climb on every rung, May you stay forever young, Forever young, forever young, May you stay forever young. May you grow up to be righteous, May you grow up to be true, May you always know the truth And see the lights surrounding you. May you always be courageous, Stand upright and be strong, May you stay forever young, Forever young, forever young, May you stay forever young. May your hands always be busy, May your feet always be swift, May you have a strong foundation When the winds of changes shift. May your heart always be joyful, May your song always be sung, May you stay forever young, Forever young, forever young, May you stay forever young. My great hope is that we can celebrate his Eagle and the end of Jamie's Chemo. Eamonn.

The list of possible Chartering Organizations is almost endless. We have a Pack and a Troop in the District that has had a Funeral Home as their CO for over 30 years. My point was that as a rule a group of people who's only interest is fixing the problem at hand, don't make a good CO. We seem to have a hard enough time keeping the units that do have strong CO behind them up and running. Not because we can't recruit the youth members, but because adults seem to come and go. I'm very taken back that the DE isn't trying to do everything he can to help. Eamonn.

OK,I'll ask when was the last time anyone went anywhere with three spars about 6 to 7 feet in height? Unless of course you have spent the day Pig Sticking and you used the spars to carry the dead pig back to camp. Eamonn

Seems that our National Office has found out how to send E-mails. I received one yesterday with a code for free shipping and handling for Scout Stuff on any order over $25.00. I like free. But our Council depends on the income from sales in the tiny little Scout Shop it runs. As a rule I pick up whatever I have ordered.(They never seem to have what I need in stock!!) If I know what I want I can E-mail the Lady who runs the store at any time. If she has any questions she either calls or E-mails me back. She orders it and I don't pay any S&H. Very often if someone comes in the store and is passing my house, she will give it to them to give to me. If National takes away all the business,I'm not sure what will happen to her job? Most times I only pick up a couple of things. But what will happen when I need a couple of patches or the local Troop needs a few Merit Badges, if the store closes? The nearest National Store is in Pittsburgh, 45 miles away and the Tolls on the Turnpike cost more than any shipping and handling. I deleted the code. Eamonn.

Some time back I was watching a documentary about town planning and urban sprawl. Some guy with a PhD was talking about building a sense of community. He said it wasn't that hard and all you have to do is grab a group of people and let them live in the same place for a few generations. As a kid growing up in London, I think we had a very close knit community. I knew that if the people who lived in our area seen me doing something wrong, the news would get back to my parents long before I'd arrive home. If we were at a friends house or they were at our house at a meal time everyone ate. I was an Alter Boy and active in our church,which was attended by the Irish Catholics from the area, so just about everyone knew me. As I got older, I became a regular at a couple of local pubs and our Irish Club. Again these were very community based. If someone knew that someone had something happening they tried to help.Collecting money to send flowers to a funeral, looking after someones dog if they were in hospital, sending a meal to the fellow whose wife was in hospital. As kids we played with each other, fought with each other and got into trouble with each other. The local park was where we played as little fellows, hung out and smoked our first cigarettes as teenagers. Where I live now is like that. The nurse who comes in a couple of times a week to look after Her Who Must Be Obeyed,on her first visit informed me that she knew me. It seems I was Cubmaster when her two Grandsons were in the Pack. Everyone seems to know OJ? I just rented a house to a fellow who if he ever gets too close to a strong magnet will suffer serious injury! He has more bits of metal sticking out of him than a Sherman Tank. When I first talked to him, he informed me that his Grandma and my Grandmother-in-law (Who passed away 16 years ago) were friends. They played Bridge together. His Grandma is 104. Her Who Must Be Obeyed remembers polishing the silver before these little old lady Bridge Lunch meetings and how they would all try to be a little more "Classy" than each other. I have owned a operated a couple of businesses in the area and it seems that everyone remembers the white hair and the accent. Sadly our down town area is dieing. It has been dieing for a very long time, but we still have the best hardware store, where they don't try and sell you stuff that you don't need but have the stuff that you do need. We seem to have different Pizza shops every few months, one closes and is replaced. I do what I can to shop locally. I fought with my insurance company to allow our local pharmacy fill our prescriptions. They donate to the FOS. We have placed boxes at the local VFW and American Legion Post to collect flags. They donate to the Ship and FOS. When we have read Boy's Life and Scouting Magazine I put them in the waiting room of our family doctor, he donates to FOS and the Ship. Our local newspaper also does printing so I use them for all of our printing needs, even though thanks to PC's this isn't what it once was. When I needed menus designed I used local designers (And we won a national prize!!) He donates to FOS (I have yet to talk to him about the Ship.) The local Beer distributor also sells ice. He is a long time supporter of FOS. I had the camp buy all their ice from him. I used to send out a District News Letter to all the CO in the District 3 or 4 times a year. This has been replaced by the Ship's Newsletter, not because I have a hidden agenda, but because a few CO's said that they missed hearing from me. I like my small town and small District. The local Barber still only charges $5.00 for a haircut, I go in and he says "As normal?" I say yes even though I wish he'd take a little more off the back, but while he is cutting we talk about Scouts and what the kids in the area need. We both serve on the local Civic and Industry Committee, which for a community our size has a lot of money. A good friend of mine is a pharmaceutical salesman. They seem to move house about every four or five years. Each time they move the houses seem to get bigger and better, but they are in sub-developments and everyone else seems to move every few years. The kids in the developments seem to hang out together, but there isn't any real sense of community. They don't volunteer to do anything because they know that they aren't going to be there very long. They have a son about OJ's age, he was a Cub Scout in Kentucky before they moved to New York. He is a nice Lad they send him to a Catholic Youth Camp and seem happy to spend the $465.00 for the week. But then again they pay $22.00 for a haircut!! I know that we are very fortunate that we still have a community a real community, which is more than an elderly person standing in the door way smiling and welcoming us as we enter and checking the bags when we leave. But if we want the community to support us we have to not only support the community we have to be seen supporting the community. Eamonn.

Beaver I don't understand the " $1 fuel surcharge per boy" ? I do use the IRS deduction for mileage. When I attend a fund raising event, I get a tax receipt. I may have paid $200.00 to attend the dinner, but I'm only allowed to deduct my donation. So if the cost of the dinner is $50.00, my deduction is only $150.00. A lot of times I'm asked to make a speech. This could I suppose be taken as Me having to attend the dinner and could be taken as an expense, as maybe I didn't want to attend in the first place? But this is a volunteer organization, so I could just as easily have said that I wasn't going to attend. A few weeks back I was trying to work out how much Sea Base in Florida would cost. The Coral Reef Sailing week costs about $600.00 per person. The boat only holds seven and we need two deep leadership. If the adults don't pay? Where does the $1,200 come from? Do we expect the Scouts to pay an extra $240.00? Is it right that the money comes from the Troop (or ship) funds? I think I'd have a hard time looking anyone in the eye and asking them to support the Ship, while I knew that the money was being spent on my vacation and my hobby. If the Ship were to pay for the adults entire trip it would pay out about $1,200.00. If an adult were to accept the funding. He or she should declare the trip as income. Sure I have gone with a very expensive trip, but we are trying to help our Scouts make ethical choices. I just don't see how accepting trips and taking the money from the CO /Troop can be ethical. No matter what the amount is. As volunteers we surely don't expect to get paid? Eamonn.

Much as I hate to be full of doom and gloom. FScouter is right. We have had units that have tried to be their own CO and it just never seems to work. The turnover of adults in a Scout unit is such that after a while the unit just falls apart. Contact your District Membership Chairman and see if he has any ideas, if that fails contact the Council Membership Vice-chairman, once you have contacted him I think the DE might be more helpful. (SE's hate when these things are mentioned at Board meetings.) Eamonn.

I think I read that the attention span of a young Lad is about nine minutes. Divide this in half when you have a group. I think it's wonderful that you are seeing that there is a problem. Back when I was walking to school in the snow uphill... Education was a lot different than it is today. We can have a lively debate about that. Our Scouts are not used to having someone talk to them for what they consider a long time. The newsletter and web site are a must. The trick to good Scout meetings is in the planning. "Plan Your Work And Work Your Plan" Have the Meeting Plan on paper. Give copies to everyone who is doing anything. Before the meeting gather everyone and everything that you need for the meeting. Make sure you have everything at hand. Trying to do anything with a compass when you don't have one is just silly. Finding out that you left them in the car and telling the Scouts to "Amuse yourself for a couple of minutes" doesn't work either. I really like to start the meeting with something where the Scouts can let off a lot of steam.Use this as your gathering activity, have the ASPL run this while you are meeting with the SPL and the other people who are involved in that nights meeting. I have just started reading the new books that the UK Scout Association has put out about The Balanced Programme, some of it can be found at: http://www.scoutbase.org.uk/6to25/network/programme/zones/environment.htm After the meeting run a reflection with the PLC and grade what happened. Just because something worked well, don't fall into the trap of doing it too often and stop doing it before the Scouts get bored. The odd game of dodge ball is fine but every week for 20 mins is really boring. Mix things up a little. Have meetings outdoors. Throw in random acts of silliness. Add some Ethical thinking role play. Use boatswains chair knots in Patrol relays. Give each Patrol todays newspaper and have them look for stories that highlight the Scout Law. Have them write the closing prayer. Get a couple of PL's to do a Timmy Tenderfoot packs a back pack and then have a PL show how it should be done. Really go to town on inter-patrol competitions. Indoor pioneering projects can be great: sedan chairs and races. Spend a Saturday afternoon with the PLC practicing this sort of stuff. Have each Patrol cook a different dehydrated meal and then bring the troop together to taste test it. There must be 20 different Kim's Games out there. Have a round robin. Each PL prepares it in advance (Smell, taste, sounds, and vision.) The thing most SM's seem to forget is that they get a Scoutmasters minute. If things are going as they should that's all they need!! Eamonn.

Serendipity I think. Eamonn

Do the adults who don't pay declare the cost of the trip when they file their taxes? Doesn't this free trip amount to a payment in kind? A Scout is thrifty. The cost of the whatever is just that. - The cost. Of course it's unfair that the adult is out of pocket, but it's just as unfair for the Scouts to have to pay the adults way. There is no free lunch and no free ride. Eamonn