Immature Scouts or parents who wont let go?

[gwd-scouter]

I've been doing the Scouting thing for a while and have seen all levels of maturity among the 11 year old new Scouts. I've seen the go getters, the lazy toads, the shy, the whiners. I've had my share of boys that have parents smooth the path ahead of them so they don't have to overcome any obstacles.

 

This year, we have two new Scouts that are not going to summer camp with us. Why? Because their parents don't want them away for a WHOLE WEEK! Yes, that's right. The parents will miss them. I've never dealt with this before. Sure, I've had the homesick guys that get all weepy when Mom comes up on Wednesday family night. Only once did we have a guy that actually went home on Wednesday. He would have been OK after Mom left, but Mom just couldn't take it and off they went.

 

I've been trying to help these new parents and let them know how much fun their boys will have at camp and how much they would miss out on if they don't go. The boys just joined our troop last month and have camped with us for one weekend so far - didn't seem at all concerned that their parents weren't there.

 

Is it getting more common that children never spend any time away from their parents?

 

 

[SMT224]

gwd-scouter --

 

Are these kids from one-child families? Over the years, I have had the most difficulties with homesickness from kids that do not have siblings. It seem like (and of course there are exceptions the rule) the bigger the family, the happier the kids is to get away from everyone and go camping or spend a week at summer camp. If these parents have no others kids at home to take care of, it may be they have no life other than taking care of their one kid. Or maybe not.

 

At any rate, I'd sit down with each parent individually and talk about how great an opportunity summer camp is to start developing an independent and self reliant young man. Not to mention, all their friends from Webelos will be there, and by not going they will miss out on all those fun times. Plus, by not going to summer camp, he will be way behind in terms of advancement. Perhaps if they can see it from their kids point of view - that summer camp is not just a week away from home, but an important time in his Scouting life - they will be able to let go.

 

I've found that the first summer camp is really important to bond the new Scouts to the Troop and get them going on advancement. We had five Webelos Crossover last night, and all appear to be going to summer camp. However, some parents approached me after the ceremony to say they were not sure if they could afford camp. Luckily, we do have some $$ put aside for a campership, so I think all should be going. Could that be the problem with the new parents in your Troop - they can't afford it, but are too embarrassed to say?

 

Good Luck!

 

[Lisabob]

I have seen this every year since my son joined the troop. Most of the time, those boys do not stay with scouts for more than a year, although there have been some exceptions. Luckily for us, most of the public schools in our area have run a half-week outdoor education camp for fifth graders in the spring, so parents like this have a chance to "try out" letting their child go away for a few days before scout camp rolls around. Sadly, the schools are probably going to cut that program due to budget issues.

 

A few things that seem to help (for some folks):

1) Some will let their kid go if they can go too, that first year. Consider asking if they'd like to register as adult leaders and participate. This will mean you'll have other things to juggle like making sure parent doesn't follow the kid around all day at camp, but it can work in some cases.

2) Some are simply not comfortable with the troop's adult leadership yet. Do what you can to help them get to know/trust you. Maybe get them to either camp a couple of weekends with the troop or at least visit during the day on Saturday, if they're not the camping types.

3) Some will cave to pressure from their child. That is, if the child really, really wants to go and isn't taking their cues from the parent on this.

4) Some are ok if they have a ton of information about exactly who/what/when/where. I dunno, maybe it makes them feel in control.

 

I think as your troop expands and you get more young scouts whose parents do not know you or the scouting program as well, you are likely to see more of this sort of thing.

[Nike]

I've encountered these parents and believe they are suffering from as narcissism and extreme shallowness. Their children are no more than mirrors for themselves and are never meant to grow up, though inevitably they do. When you bring up that camp may be in thier children's best interests, they completely deny that anyone can have any more valid opinion than their own. These people have no concept that the world doesn't revolve around them.

 

And yes, you will be seeing more of these families as the uber-narcissists we've raised the past 20 years finally get around to having kids and pay too much attention to how they are perceived as parents rather than how they are succeeding as parents. They simply don't buy in to planned obsolescence.

 

(Can you tell some have really ticked me off?)

 

 

[Mafaking]

 

I have seen scouts be prohibited from a weekend campout cause mom can't go. When a little pressure is applied the results are mixed. A few have given just a little but more often the parents sees this as being judgemental of their parenting skills and just ignore you. They know what's best for their son. And they do.

 

We now recruit. The unit now provides a lengthy "this is our scouting program objectives" to new prospects and cross overs. This document emphasizes among, others things Personal Growth and independence as a unit strength.

 

However, because scouting is set up with simultaneous Webelos cross overs and New Scout Patrols the unit selection process is more of a group decision. Hence a scout family who is not prepared to go to summer camp can get swept up in a unit that goes to summer camp. Summer camp is scary enough for some parents, an out of council summer camp just ratchets up the fear. Go out of state and its an OMG phenonamon.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[skeptic]

It is not just new boys unfortunately. Sometimes, it is just crazy, the thinking of a parent. We have a 15 yo who is one of the best prepared and capable campers I have ever had, even at 11. He has been backpacking, hiking, and camping since he was about 5 (with his single mom) and can walk you into the ground. She often works out of the area, and has left him with other families, and even by himself over a couple of nights. Yet, she wrote me concerned he was too young for the OA Ordeal (the overnight by himself). I think I have gotten her through it; and he has no concern at all. Go figure.

[GoldFox]

I don't think it is the scout as much as the parents that can't let go. I have seen this with single children and children from large families. We had a boy who really wanted to be a scout but mom could not let go and he wasn't allowed to do a lot of the overnight events and finally quit. It was a shame. Dad was on work travel a lot and couldn't defend his son as much.

 

I also think that parents are say things to their kids that we as leaders are not aware of. Last year a kid was told by his parents that they would come and get him if he wanted to come home. We never knew about this until he wanted to go home on the second day. The SM let him. I though this was a bad decision but not mine to make.

[beardad]

This is a good subject. my son is not yet in Boy scouts, but will be crossing over next year.

 

my main concern won't be for my kid, but what if he throws such a fit about being homesick, that he basically ruins it for everybody else. I know I am not the only parent that thinks this way.

 

that being said if they want him to go, he can by all means go.

[nldscout]

Could it be that these 2 parents are using this excuse as a smoke screen for other reasons, like $$, or internal problems in the family?

[resqman]

"my main concern won't be for my kid, but what if he throws such a fit about being homesick, that he basically ruins it for everybody else. I know I am not the only parent that thinks this way."

 

During a typical weekend campout, there is little time to be homesick. Between, food prep, eating, cleanup, tent pitching and taking down, campfire, and all the planned activities, there is very little time to spend worrying about what Mom & Dad are doing. After the campfire, they go to their tents and whisper silly jokes to each other and generally are too excited about everything to be homesick.

 

Those that do get homesick tend to wander over to the adults a little weepy and sniffly. Usually some encouragement to hang in there thorough the night and we will be happy to take them home. Occasionally we give them a chemical light stick to place in their tent as a nightlight. Sometimes patrol mates spend some time with them keeping them entertained.

 

At summer camp, it is usally not until Tuesday evening after dinner that most get homesick. The hustle and bustle of arriving, getting setup in the tent, find their way around camp, meeting all the new people, going to the various classes and activities finally settles down but Tuesday evening. That time after the evening meal but before lights out that they have a moment to begin to wonder what their family is doing seems to hit. Usually a weepy eye and a sniffle helps us to pick out those who need some attention.

 

We had a new crossover explain to us during this past weekends campout that he is not convinced he wants to go to summer camp because he does not want to be away from his family for more than 3 days. Mom asked last week if there was still time to get him registered. Hopefully Mom will force the issue and send him to camp.

 

[substring]

In addition to what's being said, I always recommend the Webelos scouts to attend the week-long Webelos Resident Camp. It will prepare them for the camping in Boy Scouts.

 

After the Crossover, it is good to encourage the new scouts to attend as many campouts as possible, before the Summer Camp. It helps the new scouts to get used to campouts. And it also helps the new scouts to get to know the existing scouts and the adult leaders. Having friends around will overcome homesickness.

 

In our troop, the monthly campout is from Friday evening to Sunday afternoon. So basically, the scouts will not see their parents (and vice versa) for almost the entire weekend. Usually, the scouts and their parents will get used to that after a few months.(This message has been edited by substring)

[Knot Head]

We seem to hit this problem each year with 1 or 2 guys. I provide lots of information about summer camp and show them the prior years daily schedule. I also tell them that the boys in our troop that have gone on to make eagle have all gone to summer camp their first three years - some four or five years. I tell them if they do not go they will be behind the rest of their patrol in terms of merit badges and advancement. I offer to let them sign up as an adult leader and stay for some or all of summer camp. Some actually do this and have a good time.

 

I have yet to NOT convince one to let their kid go, but it may happen eventually.

 

We have a blast at summer camp, it is only 190 miles away and the boys are so positive about how much fun it is that we usually don't have too much trouble with this.

 

Also we camp 3 times after cross over before summer camp (March, April, May) and this probably helps alot.

 

Homesickness... we always have trouble with that every year. Sometimes you can guess who it will be, othertimes you get a surprise.

 

(This message has been edited by knot head)

[gwd-scouter]

I've received a bit more background info on these two new Scouts.

 

One is very eager to go to summer camp, his mother is not. Dad is somewhere in the middle. The Scout has been on his first campout with us last month and Dad came along. Dad had a broken foot. We suggested he'd be much more comfortable at home, but he insisted he had to go because his son simply would not stay if he wasn't there. Dad was in a good deal of pain later Friday evening and went home. Son was fine. Dad came back Saturday morning, stayed for a few hours and, again, went home. Son was fine.

 

So Dad is OK, still have to work on Mom.

 

The other Scout - turns out he rarely went on outings during his Webelos years. Didn't do any camping (no, he did not earn the AOL). He didn't go on the first campout with us last month. In fact, he only started showing up for meetings a few weeks ago. He is enjoying himself but is extremely shy. He is going on May's campout, without his Mom. Mom and I talked quit a lot at last night's meeting about summer camp, how much fun her son would have, and how important the week is as a new Scout for him to make friends and to feel he's a part of the Troop.

 

Talking with the Scout, he is not sure he wants to go to camp. I think he's a little bit afraid. Told the Scout and Mom both about the new Scout program at our camp and how he would be with his patrol the whole week, never on his own. That eased their minds a great deal.

 

Last night, he and the other new guys worked on knots. He was very proud when he successfully tied them. Another month and a half of Scout meetings, a weekend campout in May. Maybe after that, his shyness will diminish and he will WANT to go to summer camp. Then, maybe, Mom will let him go.

[Eagledad]

>>I don't think it is the scout as much as the parents that can't let go.

 

I also think that parents are say things to their kids that we as leaders are not aware of. Last year a kid was told by his parents that they would come and get him if he wanted to come home.

[Eagle1982]

One point I like to make is that Scouting is not for everyone. Scouting is a program which stresses outdoor activities, with indoor activities that often are in support (training of) the outdoor activities. If a kid really is not into that, there are a ton of other activities that are a better fit for them.

 

If it's the parent holding them back, than shame on the parent. However, one must explain to get the best out of the Scouting program, they have to allow the Scout attend the outdoor Scouting activities. THey do want their child to get the best and most out of their Scouting experience don't they?