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duckfoot

'Under the auspices of BSA'

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What is the definition of this phrase? National doesn't seem to have one. Is it only BSA sponsored events? Only troop events? Only patrol events? Individual scout achievements working towards a goal with a Scoutmaster's approval?

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As far as I'm concerned it would be pack (if you were a den chief or when you were a cub if it's a cub award), troop, crew, ship, team, post, any unit function. Any district event, any council event or council sponsored event, national jamboree, OA. In certain circumstances, perhaps something with family, church, community etc with Scoutmaster's approval but shouldn't be the default that anything goes. So like a community bike ride with a LOT of scout presence, advertised at the troop mtgs, then if SM is ok with it, I'm ok with it.

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Individual achievement working towards a goal with a Scout Master approval?

 

I am going to say no out of the blocks.......But a lad with a very compelling argument or reason why might sway my decision....As SM I would turn it around on the lad....so you want to earn the riding award.....why don't you organize a Patrol ride to bob's park and back.....or why not organize a ride to Eagle districts camporee......Promote riding in the patrol and troop......

 

Isn't that the point of the award?????

 

Very Clearly Patrol, Troop, OA, District, Council and National BSA events are an absolute yes. BSA camp staff, life guard, ect yes.

 

Earning a hiking, backpacking or cycling merit badge with your patrol mate yes........

 

Riding back and forth to school on your bike no.......Hanging at the swimming pool with your buddies no......water skiing or canoing with your family no.

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Individual achievement working towards a goal with a Scout Master approval?

 

I am going to say no out of the blocks.......But a lad with a very compelling argument or reason why might sway my decision....As SM I would turn it around on the lad....so you want to earn the riding award.....why don't you organize a Patrol ride to bob's park and back.....or why not organize a ride to Eagle districts camporee......Promote riding in the patrol and troop......

 

Isn't that the point of the award?????

 

Very Clearly Patrol, Troop, OA, District, Council and National BSA events are an absolute yes. BSA camp staff, life guard, ect yes.

 

Earning a hiking, backpacking or cycling merit badge with your patrol mate yes........

 

Riding back and forth to school on your bike no.......Hanging at the swimming pool with your buddies no......water skiing or canoing with your family no.

Basement, this has got to be one of the best answers I've seen on this entire forum...

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Individual achievement working towards a goal with a Scout Master approval?

 

I am going to say no out of the blocks.......But a lad with a very compelling argument or reason why might sway my decision....As SM I would turn it around on the lad....so you want to earn the riding award.....why don't you organize a Patrol ride to bob's park and back.....or why not organize a ride to Eagle districts camporee......Promote riding in the patrol and troop......

 

Isn't that the point of the award?????

 

Very Clearly Patrol, Troop, OA, District, Council and National BSA events are an absolute yes. BSA camp staff, life guard, ect yes.

 

Earning a hiking, backpacking or cycling merit badge with your patrol mate yes........

 

Riding back and forth to school on your bike no.......Hanging at the swimming pool with your buddies no......water skiing or canoing with your family no.

And yet he and I are getting panned for saying just that.

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The national Advancement Team has defined "at designated Scouting activities or events" from Camping MB as "experiences[that] are held under the auspices of some level of the BSA, and that “Scouting†happens on them." (bold theirs, not mine).

 

So, anyone that's not already trying to fudge things can reasonably deduce that the phrases are interchangeable.

 

The Advancement team goes on to specifically note that family outings and individual pursuits are not a "scouting activity" and therefore are not "under the auspices": they say, "For example, an individual family or a couple of Scouts and their parents heading off into the woods doesn’t count."

 

From "Ask the Expert"

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Individual achievement working towards a goal with a Scout Master approval?

 

I am going to say no out of the blocks.......But a lad with a very compelling argument or reason why might sway my decision....As SM I would turn it around on the lad....so you want to earn the riding award.....why don't you organize a Patrol ride to bob's park and back.....or why not organize a ride to Eagle districts camporee......Promote riding in the patrol and troop......

 

Isn't that the point of the award?????

 

Very Clearly Patrol, Troop, OA, District, Council and National BSA events are an absolute yes. BSA camp staff, life guard, ect yes.

 

Earning a hiking, backpacking or cycling merit badge with your patrol mate yes........

 

Riding back and forth to school on your bike no.......Hanging at the swimming pool with your buddies no......water skiing or canoing with your family no.

Every SM get's panned for saying just that. Comes with the patch.

 

Apply this simple test: Are you inviting every member of your patrol, troop, crew, etc ... ?

 

Note that the question is in present tense. The working assumption is that the scout is getting approval IN ADVANCE. As in "what's the writing on the little scroll in the shape of a smile?"

 

If you feel like you need to make up for lost time, here's a retrospective test: was there an invitation on the patrol/troop/crew mailing list or calendar?

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The national Advancement Team has defined "at designated Scouting activities or events" from Camping MB as "experiences[that] are held under the auspices of some level of the BSA, and that “Scouting†happens on them." (bold theirs, not mine).

 

So, anyone that's not already trying to fudge things can reasonably deduce that the phrases are interchangeable.

 

The Advancement team goes on to specifically note that family outings and individual pursuits are not a "scouting activity" and therefore are not "under the auspices": they say, "For example, an individual family or a couple of Scouts and their parents heading off into the woods doesn’t count."

 

From "Ask the Expert"

so then, a couple of very active scout buddies are family friends, and they do a lot of say, water skiing or canoeing, because they happen to have active families that own boats and therefore have lots of ample opportunity and really become "expert", may not be eligible for some award because there's not room in their parents canoe for the whole troop or their parents don't want to lend out their boats to the whole troop?

.... or some boy that happens to have a really great $2,000 bike because he rides distance races as a hobby, but yet belongs to a troop where the other boys don't have bikes and aren't riders...... then that boy with the bike would never have a chance to be eligible for some bicycling distance award?

 

I understand the spirit of what you guys are writing, and basement's post is clear... & I have to say the ideal he professes is grand, about inclusion of the other boys, fostering leadership, etc.... Really grand indeed.

I have no idea what the book says, just common sense.... but it seems like an angle is being missed though. Some boys have opportunities in life that other boys do not. Simple fact of life.

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The national Advancement Team has defined "at designated Scouting activities or events" from Camping MB as "experiences[that] are held under the auspices of some level of the BSA, and that “Scouting†happens on them." (bold theirs, not mine).

 

So, anyone that's not already trying to fudge things can reasonably deduce that the phrases are interchangeable.

 

The Advancement team goes on to specifically note that family outings and individual pursuits are not a "scouting activity" and therefore are not "under the auspices": they say, "For example, an individual family or a couple of Scouts and their parents heading off into the woods doesn’t count."

 

From "Ask the Expert"

And we're talking about a Boy Scout award, not a life opportunities award. So you understand, you just choose to ignore.

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Now you see scouter99, that's where you're wrong. I'm not the one ignoring. I'm trying to participate in a brainstorming session "around the campfire", to help others think and at the same time learn something about the program and life in general in return.... But thank you for the education.

 

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The national Advancement Team has defined "at designated Scouting activities or events" from Camping MB as "experiences[that] are held under the auspices of some level of the BSA, and that “Scouting†happens on them." (bold theirs, not mine).

 

So, anyone that's not already trying to fudge things can reasonably deduce that the phrases are interchangeable.

 

The Advancement team goes on to specifically note that family outings and individual pursuits are not a "scouting activity" and therefore are not "under the auspices": they say, "For example, an individual family or a couple of Scouts and their parents heading off into the woods doesn’t count."

 

From "Ask the Expert"

In the Bryan on Scouting post, The Advancement Team was only commenting on the camping requirement for the rocker, not the gold and silver devises. As I stated in the other thread, an very active and former district EBOR Chairman stated to me you must read every BSA requirement as a strict constructionist. The requirements for the gold and silver devices do not state the camping, riding, hiking, aquatics activities need to be under the auspices, so they don't. The adventure requirements devices do state under the auspices, so they do.

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All I see are excuses........

 

You bunch of lazy scouters, fix your fricken programs............Guide your scouts, PLC and committe so your guys can earn it legitimately.....

 

My boys will earn it under the Auspices.....Regardless how KDD is going to lawyer it so his scout can earn it, He will always know that at least One scouter in the country knows his boy did not earn it legitimately....

 

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The national Advancement Team has defined "at designated Scouting activities or events" from Camping MB as "experiences[that] are held under the auspices of some level of the BSA, and that “Scouting†happens on them." (bold theirs, not mine).

 

So, anyone that's not already trying to fudge things can reasonably deduce that the phrases are interchangeable.

 

The Advancement team goes on to specifically note that family outings and individual pursuits are not a "scouting activity" and therefore are not "under the auspices": they say, "For example, an individual family or a couple of Scouts and their parents heading off into the woods doesn’t count."

 

From "Ask the Expert"

the problem with your argument KDD.....

 

This is an award and has nothing to do with advancement.

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If a scout has notified his SM or merit badge counselor that he wants to take a merit badge and work toward that merit badge and the approval is given i would think that is the Auspice of the BSA. Am I wrong?

 

Other wise how cana scout do the individual requirement that are needed for merit badges. For example physical fitness.

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If a scout has notified his SM or merit badge counselor that he wants to take a merit badge and work toward that merit badge and the approval is given i would think that is the Auspice of the BSA. Am I wrong?

 

Other wise how cana scout do the individual requirement that are needed for merit badges. For example physical fitness.

Apples and oranges. The "personal" badges can be knocked of in 3 months, and "designated scouting activities" are not mentioned in the requirements. Most boys take a couple of years to rack up camping nights, so troop records are generally used so the boy can set reasonable goals toward completing the badge once he decides to do so.

 

The counselor does not declare designated scouting activities for Camping MB any more than s/he determines which constellation is The Big Dipper for Astronomy MB The requirement is quite objective and not one night should require contortions of the English language to justify counting it.

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