Hedgehog

Do parents sign their kids up for baseball camp, take them to the batting cages, go out and run with them to get them in shape? Do parents go out an buy sleeping bags, tents and hiking boots for their kids? Do parents look at their kids homework to make sure it looks right? Do parents see their kids grades and ask their child about them? Do parents look over cover letters and resumes and make suggestions? Do parents tell their children to forward a resume to one of their friends who may know someone? I wonder if the different responses in this thread reflect which of us are pa

It is worth spending whatever time necessary with a parent to get them to understand and buy into what a boy-led advancement process means and how it operates. For new crossovers, what is happening in Scouts is happening in school. What parent wouldn't want their son to be responsible for understanding, tracking and completing their own homework? I've never had any push back from parents when I explain how scouting is about learning responsibility -- first for the scout themselves and then for others. Explaining to them that I'd be glad to sit down with their son and their patrol leader

I think they are right there in front of us. On campouts, I take the time to talk to the new parents and find out what their interests are. I've found that anyone who has interests in the outdoors or exercise -- from hiking, to skiing, to biking, to running -- are always up for the challenge of learning new skills. We often get the idea that we have a lock on knowing the skills. Why not ask some of the parents to learn the knots and then teach them to the boys - splitting the boys into two groups with each group learning a different knot and then having each group of boys teach the other g

Let's see... SM and 3 ASMs are Eagles, another 3 ASMs have hiked, backpacked and camped extensively on their own, 2 ASM are former Navy guys that love the outdoors (and they know knots!). We've got one ASM who is an engineer and who loves bicycling and is getting into backpacking (even taking his daughter on a 15 mile trip on his own). Yeah, our scouters probably would (and some have) go camping even if heir sons aren't on the trip. When you get that core of excited adults, it draws in other adults and their kids to the troop. Our troop has a reputation for doing fun activities and for

We did the Monadnock Sunapee Greenway Trail in New Hampshire: http://www.msgtc.org It was very challenging for everyone involved. It was the longest trek in days and distance than any of us had ever done. We all hit a wall at some point on the trek but managed to dig deep and push on. At the finish, there was a sense of tremendous accomplishment and we had fun along the way. I'll probably post a more detailed description and some lessons learned in a separate topic.

Based on my experience, I'd say eight months. My son crossed over at the end of March two years ago. I was the Cubmaster for the Pack. First Troop meeting I attended, I was asked to be an ASM and encouraged by my son. Took Outdoor Leadership training over a weekend. A couple of weeks later, the Troop was going to cancel the May campout (which would be the first for the new scouts) because of lack of interest by older scouts and the current leaders. I stepped up and worked with the incoming SPL to run a mini-skills campout -- Toten Chit, Fireman Chip and making first aid kits. Attende

On backpacking trips and cold weather campouts, cotton is prohibited except for your bandana. On the trail, X-Officio underwear. A pair will last a week, but I bring a second pair so I can feel fresh and clean mid-week. It is easy to find synthetic t-shirts in both long and short sleeve. Working on having our Troop switch to synthetic for our Class B. REI or Smartwool wool hiking socks with silk liner socks. Again, two pairs for a week. Use, rinse, repeat. If we are talking cold weather, either Capilene or Smartwool as the base layer. If it is extreme cold, then UnderArmou

I don't think we are mocking those programs, just the idea that scouting should be more like those programs. I think that Scouting should be, well, more like scouting. When I was Cubmaster we tried to make the den and pack meetings less like school and more like adventure. We focused on the doing rather than the learning. In Boy Scouts, the boys get to decide what they do. I see the excitement on the faces of new scouts when a 15 year old patrol leader tells them they have a good idea for what to do or what to teach. Wow. If that is how we view the program, we are destined to f

Campsites come out to $10 a scout (around $250 for a group of 25). Breakfast is $3, Lunch is $3, Dinner is $5 and Breakfast is $3. That totals $14. The additional $1 per scout -- or $25 per campout goes to propane and paper towels (the majority of the consumables we use). We also ask the adults to pay the same amount as the boys for the site and food. We don't get any complaints because the adults eat better for that $25 than they would at a restaurant spending four times that amount (we've had strip steaks, baby back ribs, chili for dinner, eggs with canadian bacon on croissants or bl

We can always find something to complain about. Our troop is in suburbia in the middle of the most densly populated state in the country, but we find a way to do it. Cost of 5 day backpacking trip = $30 ($25 to cover gas for driving 300 miles and $5 to cover maps and guidebooks) plus your own food (but heck, you have to eat anyway). The drive is 6 hours but the experience is priceless. Cost of weekend sea kayaking trip = $40 ($10 for state park campsite for two nights $15 for 2 hour kayak rental; $15 for food). The drive is 2 hours but the fun lasts all weekend. Adults make the res

It is hard for me to belive that the program is failing. Our Troop is over 50 boys. We are boy-led and that is the main selling point for both the boys who join our Troop and their parents. The parents recognize that this is the safest environment to let go and give the boys independence and the boys love being responsible. I'm going on a six day 50 mile backpacking trek with 5 boys and one other adult next week. The boys are aged 12, 13, 13,15 and 17. Although I suggested the trail, the boys maped out the how far we are going each day, where we are camping and got directions for the a

In our Troop, the SPLs start off the meeting, have the Webelos come up and introduce themselves, go through our Troop portion of the meeting and then send the Webelos off with the patrols. The PLs answer the Webelos' questions. The SPL then takes the parents aside and talks to them. The SM is there, but remains silent except to answer questons that the SPL can't answer (which are very few). Thus, the adults are out of the patrol meetings and the boys get to experience what really happens. There is nothing that explains boy-led better than having a boy demonstrate what it means to the pare

My concerns about the list of questions is: 1) that they are directed to the SM not the SPL; 2) most of those questions can be answered by observing a meeting; 3) some of them are answered by our SPLs presentation to the adults; and 4) they did not include the most important question - "do you guys have fun?" Pretty much every Webelo who visits our Troop understands what boy-led means by the time they leave the meeting. The boys start the meeting, run the Troop meeting, run the patrol breakouts, run the Troop activity and run the closing. Adults only speak when asked by a

Our boys typically start cooking at 5:00, eat by 6:00, clean up by 6:30 and have a fire going by 7. The desserts are in the Dutch Oven and the Jiffy Pop comes out. Then desserts and then marshmallows. That is around 8:00. Our guys don't do skits, but they can easily do 3 hours of banter around the fire. Jokes, stories, etc. Me, I just make a cup of coffee and hot coca and sit in my chair. As for the firewood, the boys typically collect it and cut it in the afternoon (if permitted) and have never had a problem running out. Here's my suggestion, ask the boys ahead of time what t

If you sent that list to me, you would get a response like this: You and the other adults can ask all of those questions to our Senior Patrol Leader when you come and visit -- he's in charge. The boys can ask any questions they have to the Patrol Leader of the patrol they are assigned to for the meeting. I think that the decision of what Troop a boy joins should be his decision based on the things that are important to him -- not those things that are important to the adults. Ultimately, the best person to ask questions to is your son and the best question to ask after the meeting is "di

My advice, don't bother asking questions. Just visit and observe what happens. In our Troop we don't do anything different when Webelos visit. That would completely disrupt our schedule because we have scouts from at least four packs that come and visit - usually on different days. The Webelos are assigned by the SPL to one of the three patrols that isn't running the Troop portion of the meeting. The PLs for those patrol answer any questions the scouts have and then run a regular patrol meeting. During the patrol meetings the SPL meets with the parents and tells them about the troop,

Our 6 day backpacking trek in beautiful New Hampshire - total cost to scouts is $30 plus they have to provide their own food. The $25 goes to cover gas for the adults driving (600 miles of gas is expensive) and $5 goes to cover the cost of detailed maps. As they say in the commercials, waking up on a clear morning with a view from a mountain top -- priceless. Most of our backpacking treks don't cost anything (well, except the cost to acquire the right gear). On the flip side, we've done weekend canoe trips that cost $75 per scout (not including food). Our average weekend campout costs

This to me is a big red flag. I can't imagine turning away any Eagle Scout parent who wants to help. Heck, our Troop woud take Girl Scout parents, former Cub Scout parents or even just a scout's parent. Maybe that is because our Troop's leadership changes as boys age out with new parents taking up roles as the parents of scouts aging out become less involved. If a new scout's parent hangs around for more than one meeting, we give them an application. The idea of making a parent feel unwelcome and the idea of "strong personalities" just seems to me to be a sign of a troop being adult-le

Assuming the kids are under 18, you are responsible for their safety and they are required to do what you tell them in that area. Don't ask, tell. Refusing a request, "who want's to put on sunscreen?" is one thing. Refusing an instruction, "Make sure you put on sunscreen" is insubordination. What do you do about life jackets when canoing or kayaking? Ask, "who wants to put on a life jacket?" Of course not. Safety is not optional. A scout is obedient. Make the rule that you must have sunscreen unless their parent provides you a written waiver signed by the parent and the scout ac

@, I don't think we are disagreeing. I think that is the test. If it counts for the merit badge, it counts for the award. For the Hiking merit badge, they need to prepare a hike plan and do the hike for it to count. It doesn't matter who they do it with. For the Backpacking merit badge they have to "participate" in the three 3 day 15 mile treks and write a plan for and then do the 5 day 30 mile hike. Again, it doesn't matter who they do it with. For those badges, I accept hikes and treks done with family or other groups because the requirements don't say it has to be done throug

I love the Platypus. It is lightweight and quick. You fill up the DIRTY bag when you see water and can filter when you get to camp. No effort required. Been using the same filter for around 20 nights with no problems - often for multiple scouts. You don't need the CLEAN bag and the system is less expensive without it. Find a 20% off coupon and it is a great deal. I actually, saw it on sale and bought a second one. Now I bring two DIRTY bags and one set of filters. Can carry twice as much water into camp.

I think there is generally one program. The difference is in how it is implemented. Boy-led is the program. The adult-led troops are not delivering the program. However, even in boy-led troops, there is a wide range of HOW the boys lead. In practice, boy-led means something different in a troop of 8 boys than a troop of 50 boys. Heck, in our troop, the boy-led means something different depending on which boy is leading and even means somthing different with the same boy at the beginning of the year and the end of the year.

@@Stosh - We are in agreement. What you call creating opportunity by discussing what you have done, I call coaching by making suggestions and asking questions. Me: "You guys want to do something involving a float trip... what could we do?" Scouts: "Canoeing or sea kayaking" Me: "Caneing on a river or in a lake?" Scouts: "We like going on the Delaware." Me: "We did that last year, do you think that would affect turn out?" Scouts: "No, we did it last year and want to do it again." Me: "OK, what about sea kayaking?" Scouts: "How about in the fall?" Me: "We can do that. Do you wan

For any of those treks, my son did all the planning and all the navigation -- they count for the badges and therefore they count for the award. Agreed. But, if a scout does a 3 day 15 mile backpacking trip with his family and that counts as a requirement for the Backpacking Merit Badge (which it does, because there is no "under the auspices" requirement for the Backpacking Merit Badge), then it counts for the award. Same for bicycling -- the rides for the Cycling Merit Badge don't have to be done as part of the troop. Being done for a merit badge and being done as a family thing