Hedgehog

Jeff: As long as popcorn is in line with the guidelines I posted above (only a portion to the scout -- some to the unit and some to council/national) , it should be OK because the benefit is arguably insubstantial. I think you idea of a campership fund is good... unless the only people who get camperships are those that did the fundraising -- then it just looks like a subterfuge (or as the IRS sas, form over substance). The private benefit is still there is the "account" is a spreadsheet divying up the amounts in the Troop's account (see above posts for secondary analysis on substantialit

I'm in complete agreement. One of my favorite Baden-Powel' attributed quotes is “Scouting is a game for boys under the leadership of boys under the direction of a man.†Thank you for the ideas and encouragement. I like the idea of a campout that weekend -- I'm pretty sure some ribs and corn bread done in a Dutch Oven with some cole slaw and apple sauce on the side would be a good draw -- with Dutch Oven apple pie and brownies for dessert. I like the idea of doing it outdoors. When I did UofS two years ago, I enjoyed the activities that you could actually do something r

It is ironic that the biggest advocate of boy-led doesn't believe it can retain scouts. Nonetheless, thank you for insinuating that our troop isn't boy-led as it should be. We do encourage the boy leaders to check up on the new guys and keep them engaged at the weekly meetings. Gosh, maybe we should just ignore our boy leaders and see if they figure it out. I do give a talk on backpacking gear and how to make good decisions in buying gear. Maybe I should let the 11 year olds figure that out the hard way. I do provide a list of things to bring on camp outs and to pack for summer c

Been there, done that. On our 50 miler this summer, each of us (except maybe our SPL) hit our own walls. Blisters on day one from shoes not tied tightly enough, blisters on day two from having done 15 miles in 2 days, sore legs, 1,000s of feet of pointless ups and downs, an adult (me) who packed too much in his pack (fear is heavy), long days on the trail, a scout on day three who says he didn't want to go in the first place, two adults who pushed their limits of endurance to the point where they were moving only through sheer determination, one scout who lost it on the last day because he c

I haven't seen a significant drop off by crossing over scouts in our unit. Over the last three years, there were 1 scout out of around 28. He joined on crossing over because his parents wanted him to, never went on a campout and didn't return the following September. Any boy joining our Troop KNOWS it is boy-led. Our guys are proud of it and tell the Webelos when they visit. I've heard the kids tell their parents after the visit about how cool that is. We have found that the new guys love it when they are stuck in a patrol at our weekly meetings from day one (the PLs -- not so much be

So, I"m now thinking along the lines of having a "track" at University of Scouting for "Adventure" for both adults and scouts: Backpacking Gear (1.5 hours) Backcountry Cooking (.5 hours) Backpacking Trek Planning and Adventures (1.0) Canoeing / Kayaking / Rafting (1.0 hour) 100 Hikes and Adventures (1.0 hour) The last three classes would include ideas of where to go and what to do -- even having the participants make suggestions. My goal is to give adults the basics and get them excited about doing some of these things. Heck, I can even work in discussions of how this works in

@@Stosh, what was the most exciting thing your troop did in their outdoor program last year? Ours was the 25 mile bike ride to a scout camp, camping overnight and then riding 25 miles back. No, maybe it was the day at the COPE course followed by a day rock climbing on a real rock wall. Hang on... I forgot about the canoeing, camping on an island, canoing some more and then backpacking. Oh, what about the campout on the beach with the bonfire. Now, its got to be the 50 mile backpacking trek in the mountains of New Hampshire. Or was it the sea kayaking trip? Some were scout's idea

There is a difference between theory and practice. Boys can only handle that onus if they have been trained. They can only be trained by older scouts if the older scouts have experienced it. If there is no experience in using your imagination to determine what is possible, you will be stuck with the same as last year. So my first step would be to get adults interested and to develop skills. If an adult isn't interested and doesn't have the skills, there is no way the Troop is going canoing, kayaking, snowshoeing, backpacking, rock climbing, etc. The adult's inability kills boy led.

@@Stosh -- I agree. The necessary leadership for more adventurous outings includes what I'd call technical competence and adult leadership skills (what you call understanding boys). The second part can only be learned by experience working with the boys I started as a Boy Scout leader with not much more experience than hiking and boating (row and sail boats) around our summer home when I was a kid, a handful of camp outs as a kid (maybe three not in a back yard), two car camping trips a year as a Cub Scout leader (if it didn't get rained out) and an interest in learning more. Heck, I th

Living in New Jersey, I'm used to bugs, but I don't use a bug net in either my tarp or hammock. Why? Because I"m so covered with DEET that bugs don't come near me. If he bug spray works during the day, it will work at night. Troop is lookng at these tents for lightweight: http://www.tarptent.com/double-rainbow.html For backpacking, I have this: http://www.rei.com/product/865393/big-agnes-fly-creek-ul-2-tent It works well for my son and me, but you really have to like the person you are with. I used a hammock on our 50 mile. I have the ENO Double Nest. It is amazi

I'm not delusional in that a weekend will get them fully trained... just get them interested enough to go and learn more. As for handbooks, the BSA handbook is worthless. The Fieldbook is a lot better, but I'm go toward specific books on topics like backpacking and survival. I think most adults would have a hard time ego-wise learning from a 13 to 16 year old. I agree that in-depth training is dictated by what the boys want but we all have to start somewhere. What you call generic training, I call providing the basic building blocks. As for understanding boys, I'm not sure that c

Wow. With all the talk in other threads about a lack of adults with experience in the outdoors, I didn't expect such negative reactions. My understanding is that Wood Badge is more management training than outdoor adventure. I agree as to the linked program for scouts. I told my son about it when I first heard of it at my IOLS training. We were both excited. Fast forward two and a half years -- my son is 13 and Star. I asked him if he wanted to go and his response was "I could teach all that stuf." He's right on that. He also said that it should be for Second Class sco

For an individual activity, I would have a portion (we do 15%) of the receipts (which is around 25% of the profit) go to Scout Accounts. By my estimate 25% of the profit goes to the unit and the remaining 50% goes to National/Council. One of the problems in the Capital Gymnastics Tax Court case was that the benefit was dollar for dollar and no money whet to the general organization. We also have a threshold that you have to sell a certain amount ($100) before you get a percentage. If you do that, I think (for what my opinion is worth) you can apply the amount credited to the scout (the 15%

Under IRS rules, the structure you had would be a private benefit because the ISA offsets personal expenses of the scout that otherwise would be paid by the parent. The question then becomes whether the benefit is "iinsubstantial" I can' give an opinion on that because I don't have enough facts about your troop. Look at my prior posts to see my thoughts on what my troop is doing and why I think that is not substantial. The obedience issue is related to federal laws... not just some random rule. I"m not saying what you are doing will cause your charted organization to lose its tax exemp

In a lot of recent threads, folks have been bemoaning the lack of outdoor skills in adults. To me the answer it to develop a training program for adults and scouts - run the right way. My inspiration is here: http://training.ppbsa.org/woodsman/WOODSMAN'S%20THONG%20Flyer%202015.pdf I think that is a great program, but it seems more like classroom learning in an outdoor setting. My sense would be to do a 3 hour gear and food lecture a couple of weeks before the weekend. Allow the adults and scouts time to get gear. Then take a three day backpacking trek. There is no better teacher than

Check out Bear Paw Wilderness Designs. I have one of the flat silnylon tarps with "wings" that act as doors - http://bearpawwd.com/tarps/flat_tarps.php I've been thinking of getting a Bug Bivy - http://bearpawwd.com/net_tents/bug_bivy.php There are a lot of other tarp like tents that can hold a net insert. Also check out Hexamid from ZPacks - http://www.zpacks.com/shelters.shtml and Tarptent - http://www.tarptent.com/index.html

That is what I keep telling my wife when I buy more gear... you need the appropriate gear for the adventure. And that scene in Harry Potter with Dobby and the cast iron skillet. When I mention that, it takes a minute for the boys to remember. Now I'm hungry thinking about what we cooked in cast iron this weekend: Eggs and Canadian bacon, italian sausages with sauteed onions, Italian style short-ribs (in a Dutch Oven), apple pie (DO) and French Toast (Cast Iron Skillet) with sausages.

I agree on the difference in youth leadership styles. Planning is lacking in boys, but I've seen them perform under pressure and demonstrate the skills they've learned. I'll have to trust you on the rest of it. I told the boys that if they planned it, I'm make the call. They are thinking AT from Delaware Water Gap to Backpacker's site / Sunfish Pond -- about 5 miles in and can reverse and take a different trail out. I like your take on the differences in how boys and girl's leadership develops. My son sees the girls he is friends as just another friend -- they all sha

Q: How many adults does is requried to take a group of scouts on an overnight trip? A: Two. One to advise the boys and one to keep the other adults out of the way. When I took my IOLS training, the Council where I took it advertised this: http://www.nnjbsa.org/document/woodsmans-thong-training-by-patriots-path/115623 I think that is along the lines of what you had in mind. My then 11 year old son was very excited at taking the class in two years. My now 13 year old son and I talked about it at the end of the summer and his response (after camping 55 nights, back

So here is my $.02. Up until around 7th grade, boys want nothing to do with girls. My 13 year old son and his best friend now have two girls they hang out with (the ones who complain that the Girl Scouts don't do anything fun). On the way home from our 50 mile backpacking trek, the boys were texting the girls debating whether the girls could have made the trip. Although I have to agree with the boys (we all struggled at times on the trek and the girls have never been backpacking before), the talk soon turned to doing a backpacking trip with the four of them (and one of the girls dads). Wh

After 22 years of practicing as a tax litigation attorney, I've learned never to think I know everything.

Wow. It's 6:00 am and 39 degrees outside. I'm snug inside my down sleeping bag in a tent. 19 Boys in tents around me all sleeping soundly after a spending yesterday at a Camporee they decided they wanted to go to - seriously, who wouldn't want to this tomahawks? There are four other ASMs with me. We had a blast hanging out in the campsite while the patrols did their thing and then having short ribs and polenta for dinner with apple pie for dessert. At our meeting next week the SPL starts the meeting with calling up the boys who went and asking what the best part of the trip was. More late

The error in the thinking is that the expansion of members means the expansion of the program. As a lawyer, I've found I"ve been more successful in "marketing" my practice by focusing on what I do best, rather than trying to do anything for anyone. It is better for Scouting have fewer members if it is focused on building character throught the outdoors than having more members by trying to expand the program into STEM. I'm all for science and math, especially with a son who is interested in engineering. But this summer he will go to a two week long robotics camp at the local college

I tossed three Teflon griddles that were chipping and flaking after my first campout with the troop. Gave the boys a choice of replacing them with the same or getting cast iron griddles. They went cast iron and never went back. We still have the Teflon frying pans which they only use for eggs and bacon and don't get too hot. I'm still lobbying to replace them with cast iron. Open mouth, insert foot.

We have something that looks very much like the first set I linked to. They are beat up but still work for boiling water and we have no problem throwing them over a grate over a fire. The others are what I"m looking at to get to replace the Adult Patrol's gear. I haven't tested them but will probably get them at REI since you can return it within a year for any reason at all.