SR540Beaver

Our council has been coming up short on FOS this year. Direct effect, the loss of two DE's.....one of who also serves as the summer camp director and two program office assistants. Further cuts may be coming.

Frank, Again, I became an Arrowman as an adult and after I moved from scouting in your district to another district. Each district/chapter is responsible for handling the elections in their chapter. We have some chapters that are not active or have recently been attempting to get reorganized. Your chapter and it's leadership "should" contact the SM of each troop in your district and attempt to schedule an election. Once it is scheduled, an election team would come to one of your meetings and explain the election process and oversee it. If your chapter leadership (boys) do not do their part, then elections might not be held which further causes decline in the chapter. All that being said, I know from experience in working with election teams in my chapter that there are SM's out there who do not support OA and will not allow elections in their troop. First, they usually do not understand OA or choose not to and second, they falsely see it as competing with their troop program. The name of your chapter adviser (adult) is readily available in one of the links I posted. I'd have a discussion with your SM and see if he has been contacted about elections and if not, suggest he contact the chapter adviser. In our district, we have a Webelos recruitment night called Octoberfest. It is next Monday night. All the district troops who want to participate set up an area to showcase their troop. The Cubs and Webleos come out to make the rounds and visit the troops. Our OA Chapter takes advantage of this night to send the youth leadership around to each troop to talk to the SM and SPL and schedule their unit elections. We then do the OA Call Out for those elected at the following spring District Camporee.

Frank, Many of your questions can be answered here http://www.manu133.org/unitelect.htm#unitelect and here http://www.manu133.org/aboutmanu6so.htm#chapterinfo

Would I do it without the third bead. Sure! Staffing a course is an absolute blast. That being said, we are a uniformed movement with various patches that serve to identify certain aspects of our scouting. We all wear a CSP to identify what council we are from. Adult and boy leadership wear patches for their position. Boys wear patrol patches to identify the patrol they belong to. Members of the OA wear flaps. People who have hiked over the Tooth of Time at Philmont can wear the bull on their shirtjac. A uniform shirt reflects who and what you do in scouting. It isn't.....or shouldn't be.....for ego or bragging purposes, but a means of quick and easy identification. Would we think a boy is bragging for wearing an NYLT belt buckle or his Eagle rank patch? No one is forced to wear any patch or scout bling on their uniform, but why wouldn't they? If you're a minimalist, more power to you. No one should belittle you for being too lazy to sew bling on your uniform. If you like bling, no one should belittle you as a egotistical banana republic general. Scouting provides for recognition. Always has, probably always will.

Frank, We are in the same council. I live in your district, but scout in a different district. Our Lodge's website is http://www.manu133.org. You will find contacts there for the Sooner District's OA Chapter Adviser as well as the Lodge Adviser. They would be happy to answer any questions you have as would I as an active Arrowman.

I know one guy in our council who has EGLDAD on his plate. I believe his name is Barry.

This is something that has always bugged me about national. We've had members here who have had involvement at the regional and national level who know people by virtue of their position who act like the average volunteer has equal access to the pros. If there is a public org chart that shows the national organization and the person in eac position and an email address or phone number for them, I have never been able to find it.......and I'm fsirly profeceint in ferreting out things on the interwebs. I realize that it might not be desirable to have the whole world able to contact you, but there needs to be a mechanism to eventaully get a message thru. Within my company, anyone can find my number and address and contact me, but there are managers who restrict there staff from contacting me and have them come thru themselves first so they can decide what really needs to go to me. Heck, create a page that lists the different divisions so you can submit a question, concern or suggestion with a promise that you will receive a response.

God bless him and God bless the good people that saved him from the hell he existed in.

Not to hijack the thread......but mentioning longer school day.....who would be willing to work four 10 hour days in return for a three day weekend? I would.

Well, you are the backup for the Jambo SM. If he gets hit by a bus, you are the man. At least that is what the SM told me my job as 1st ASM was. That being said, I went as 2nd ASM in 2005 and he has never been, so he is depending on me as the one with the knowledge and experience of how things are done.

Call out is the one ceremony that the Lodge/Chapters has leeway to make their own within certain restrictions and guidelines. Our Chapter has done call out at Camporee for a long time and it is dry, boring and unimpressive. It amounted to the Chapter Chief in regalia standing in front of everyone and calling out names while other ceremonialists in regalia would escort them away. Zzzzzzzz. This year at the Camporee, we actually did an old school ceremony with a script and some mystery and suspense. It wowed the whole district and built some new interest. I would urge troops to do call out as part of a Chapter event if at all possible. Depending on how it is done makes all the difference in the world.

Federal money and standardized EOI tests have a lot to do with the state of education in America today. You could probably get by with less days in class and get a better quality education if school systems were allowed to set their own standards and actualy teach to those standards. Instead, teachers are forced to teach to the standardized tests in order to get the best scores possible so the schools can meet the standards to get their piece of the federal dollars pie. This point was driven home to me by an out od school example. The schools around here quit teaching drivers ed some years back. As a result, a cottage industry of driving schools popped up and you have to pay $350+ for your kid to get drivers ed. You want to do this for a number of reasons, mainly because the insurance lobby has gotten the legislature to pass laws that give preferential insuance treatment to people with the ed, but I digress. The school my son went to claimed a 98% drivers test pass rate. The reason for this became apparant during the first day of classroom instruction. The instrutor told them to toss the state issued driving manual. He would teach them to drive by teaching to the test they would be taking to maximize their success. For the school, the success rate was a selling point to get new customers. When teachers are required to teach to pass a standardized government test in order for their school to get dollars to operate, then your child will only get the education needed to pass the test. That my friends is why other nations are surpassing us in their education quality with less actual days in class. Throwing more days at school is like throwing money down a wishing well.

BP, I understand what you are saying and agree up to a point. We have 60 boys on our roster. Our troop has a uniform culture. We have kids who have fully embraced the program. We have several who staff summer camp and live a month or more in a uniform. Heck they even individually decided to adopt wearing the knee socks because they thought the old school look was too cool. These are the kids who have accepted and embraced the uniform, are not ashamed to be seen in it in any store or place of business and even post pictures on their facebook and myspace pages. Knowing each of these boys, I've watched them in action at camp, within the troop, out in the community, etc. and can tell you that each one of them shows scout spirit (living the oath and law) in their daily lives. I also see the boys who show up when they feel like it, won't get involved in anything outside the troop and hide their uniform shirt (wearing no other pieces ofthe uniform) under a zipped hoodie even in a meeting full of fully uniformed people in a basement with no windows. These guys are embaressed enough about scouting that they won't even be open about it amongst their scouting peers. I don't see them in action at camp or the community because they won't participate for fear of someone recognizing them and tying them to scouting. I'm not nearly as convinced that they have scout spirit. Just my personal take on it.

Hmmmmm? Wearing a uniform has nothing to do with Scout Spirit? Perhaps not. But I can tell you this......those kids who refuse to wear anything but a shirt and put it on after walking into the troop meeting and take it off before leaving or wear a zipped up jacket over it even in the summer.....have poor Scout Spirit. If they are that embarrased or ashamed to be recognized as a Scout, it makes one wonder if they feel the same way about that dumb old Oath and Law as well.

My best words of wisdom for staffing........if you are not having fun, you are doing it wrong. I was QM last fall and worked my butt off while having an absolute blast. This coming spring, I am ASM-Program and back-up CD. I can guarantee you that I will be watching the QM's with a longing in my eye like a kid in a candy store.

Hal, After taking a look at the link you posted, I'm interested in what specifically you take issue with?

Hal, don't confuse small "l" libertarian for the big "L" Libertarian Party. That being said, libertarianism is the ultimate in true liberty and freedom of the individual and puts the responsibility squarely on the shoulders of the indvidual and we live with the consequences of our actions. Make bad choices and you suffer. Make good choices and you prosper. The government does not exist to play parent and save us from ourselves or pick us up, dust us off and provide for us.(This message has been edited by sr540beaver)

Sherm, I left out a thought. Many Americans and the politicians they elect feel an obligation to protect the US by "looking out for our interests". They do this by manipulating events in other nations. Things like covert over throws of one dictator to replace him with a dictator on the CIA's dole and "friendly" to us today....but who knows what tomorrow will bring?. Ron Paul understood that actions have consequences and they are not always the consequences we intend thru our manipulation. Saddam and bin Laden are two prime examples. Many folks jumped on him as a "blame America firster". In truth, do we not sow what we reap? Our Constitution does not provide for involving ourselves in other nation's affairs or bringing democracy and liberty to the world. Even George Washingtom counciled against entanglements with other nations.

Sherm, Ron Paul is a libertarian conservative.....which in my book is what a true conservative is. While there is great wailing and knashing of teeth between Democrat/liberals and Republican/conservatives, the differences are usually only skin deep these days. Both want nanny state social programs, they just differ in what the programs are. Both want to interfere in the business of other nations and nation build, they just differ on how to do it. I could go on, but you get the drift. Ron Paul believes that our government is limited by what the Constitution says it can and can't do. Period. End of story. While many conservatives pay lip service to the constitution, they are just as bad as the liberals in allowing creep for modern society's "needs" or "realities". Ron Paul was constantly mischaracterized as an isolationist, when in reality he is a noninterventionist. His detractors say it is a case of tomat-oh, tamat-ah. It isn't. Isolationism is where we withdraw inside our borders and ignore the rest of the world. Think North Korea. Noninterventionism is where you have open free markets with the world, but you don't stick your nose in other nation's business. Think Switzerland. Liberals like Gore think we need to save other nations because we are the mighty America. Conservatives like Bush think we need to bring democracy to the world because we are the mighty America. Libertarians like Ron Paul believe we should let other nations determine their own destiny and trade with them if and when it benefits both sides. As Ron Paul put it in the Presidential debates he was allowed to participate in......nations that trade with one another do not go to war with one another. We don't want other nations telling us how to conduct our lives and politics, so why do we think we have a right to tell others how to live and govern. Understand, that is a paraphrase and not a quote. The danger of Ron Paul to the Republican party back duing the 2008 Presidential race was that he actually believed and practiced true conseravtive principles and thought and didn't wrap himself in the flag, mom and apple pie and just pay lip service to conservatism. He meant what he said and said what he meant. He was dismissed as a pie in the sky, idealistic crackpot who couldn't recognize the "reality" in today's political environment. Funny that the longer time goes by, people start thinking he is smarter and smarter and less kooky. Ron Paul was the wrong guy with the right message for winning the presidency. If there were a Ronald Reagan or Barrack Obama person to come on the scene with Ron Paul's beliefs and ideas, it would change this nation and our relationship to the world for the better.

Ron Paul looks less kooky and much more wise all the time.

Gern, they don't have much oil......but they are in a strategically geographic location for a long proposed but unbuilt oil pipeline. What is needed is a western friendly stable government in power there. Look it up.

My nephew just deployed a couple of weeks ago, so I have an even more vested interest than when I was merely a concerned citizen. As opposed to Bush's war of choice in Iraq, I fully supported our original efforts in Afghanistan......but I'm not even sure what the "mission" is anymore. For me, the death of Osama bin Laden and his underlings by the hands of American special forces will satisfy me. That being said, a single soldier's death to build a friendly democtratic Afghanistan is one death too many. Get the job done and come home or come home and change tactics to target those responsible for 9/11 and kill them. Love each other or hate each other, we need oil and they need to sell it. We will find a way to get along at arm's length like we always have.

I don't know.....I'm in the Southern Region which is based in Kennesaw, GA and I live in Oklahoma City. Having my regional director in Irving, TX might be beneficial in my particular case.

I would find that hard to believe as a lot of stuff runs thru regional like Wood Badge and Jamboree. That being said, our council just laid off the Venturing DE. Like other places, Venturing just isn't taking off and they made a decision to pull support out fromunder the districts and create a Venturing "District" complete with a DE, Key 3, FOS, etc. FOS has been down across the board and it looks like cuts are being made. The Venturing DE......who happens to have been the summer camp director for the last several years will be history in 30 days. Would closing the regional offices be part of a reorganization effort or because of budget problems like many councils are experiencing?

E92, Depends on what you mean by staffed. In order to staff WB, you have to have attended a WB21C course and earned your beads, asked to be on staff and attended staff development. Venturing Youth can be asked to assist with the Venturing portion of the course, but that isn't official "staff". Whether it makes sense or not, I'm not sure where I fall on that. WB has been adult leader training and while yes, a person 18 or older can register as an adult, a person registered as a youth in Venturing is a different animal. A minor technicality? Possibly, but there is a difference. An adult can bunk with an 18 year old registered as an adult, but can't with an 18 year old OA "youth" or a Venturer.