shortridge

"how careful should scouters and scoutmasters have to be about what they talk about as adults online in a political forum where scouts are not present? This person did not have scouts as facebook friends, and his page is not public, scouts do not have access. DC asked to be his friend on facebook a long time ago, and when the choice of scoutmaster didn't go the way he wanted, only after it was announced to the boys and adults did he go search out things he thought was not ok for a scoutmaster to say and copy and pasted the items out of context." The simplest rule is usually the best: Don't say anything online that you wouldn't say in a public square, to your religious leader or in front of your mother. Follow that and you won't go wrong. ======== "Maybe council is worried that this smooth talking guy is really going to try to take it to the media--not that it's newsworthy in any way--except as an op ed piece about should scoutmasters be able to be politically opinionated? ... Note the discussions centered around building the muslim center at ground zero ... " Depending on what was said, it certainly could be newsworthy. JUST AS A HYPOTHETICAL - if the man wrote "All Muslims should rot in hell," or a similar inflammatory/ bigoted/ racist/ whatever statement, and if the complaining DC was willing to put his name to the complaint, it could easily result in a story that looked something like this: "A local Boy Scout leader has stepped into the debate over the Ground Zero mosque by stating that 'All Muslims should rot in hell,' raising what some say are questions about religious tolerance in Scouting. "John Smith, Scoutmaster of Troop 24 of Smithville, Calif., made the comment and others in a Facebook posting last month. "The posts were brought to light by Joe Clark, a district commissioner for the Scouts, who said such attitudes have no place in the Scouting movement. " 'Bigotry and hatred should be rooted out wherever they are,' Clark said. 'Scouting accepts people of all faiths.' "A spokesman for the Greater Smithville Council of the Boy Scouts declined to comment on the controversy, saying only that local chartered organizations choose their Scouting leaders and have final say in the appointments. "A representative of Troop 24's chartering group, the Smithville Widget Co., would not comment Tuesday. "The Boy Scouts have been embroiled in controversy over religion in recent years ..." As a member of the Fourth Estate - trust me, it could see print.

Knots Ropemaking Outdoor cooking - foil popcorn, pita pizzas, hobo dinner Flags Monkey bridge Bicycle safety Readyman

Instructions? What are those? You won't get any sleep because your son is going to be cold and wet? Pshaw. If he's a good Scout, you'll be warm and dry at home, and he'll be warm and dry in the woods. No worries.

Really does depend on the camp. Around here, it's shorts & t-shirts during the day (any sort, within reason, but a Scouting t-shirt is not required), with green & khaki worn for flags and dinner. Campers involved in waterfront or pool programs often wear swim trunks and t-shirts during the day without bothering to change. Staff wears blue camp shirts, usually polos, and khaki shorts, changing into green & khaki for flags and dinner, often staying in it for evening program.

Stosh wrote: "The staff time, energy, storage arguments don't really carry any weight. When my boys show up for camp they get a long ridge pole with holes, two poles with spikes, a tent, 2 floors and a 30 gal bucket of wooden stakes. ... The staff only delivered and picked up the tents at the beginning and end of the week. I can't see how this is such a drain on staff time and energy because they have to do check in/check out inspections anyway. ... Camps with a ton of specially built platforms in neatly arranged layouts and tents that stay up all summer long, then at the beginning and end of the season it's going to be a big job setting them up and taking it down. But if the campers put up and take down tents, then staff may in fact have to take down maybe a dozen tents all summer long. Like I said I don't see how this constitutes a major drain on the time and energy of camp staff if done right." I'd wager your experience is atypical. I've never encountered the type of tent which you describe except in books. Every summer camp I've visited used canvas wall tents with heavy wood elements - platforms, outriggers and 4x4s to sit the platforms on. Add two upright poles, one ridgepole, the canvas and two cots, and you're talking a lot of gear that has to be transported to each site and set up by the staff. A troop of 11- and 12-year-old boys can't do that on their own. The camp you attend sounds great. But trust me - a camp that uses platform tents requires a lot of time and energy on the part of the staff. It's at least two days during staff week that is not spent on training or program prep. And not just time-consuming at setup or takedown, but during check-in times, too. As troop numbers adjust and you come up a tent short in one campsite, you've got to either dismantle another tent, toss it and the wooden parts into a truck and haul it over to the new site, or - if you're lucky - get four sturdy staffers to pick up the entire thing, lift it onto the flatbed and drive it over, settling it down intact. (A huge time-saver.)

Under the current National leadership and mindset, I think girls would be allowed in before gays. There's the whole "morally straight" argument against homosexuality - but nothing that folks can point to in the Oath and Law that's incompatible with being female.

If the school doesn't want to partner with a Scout on an Eagle project, it can still direct Scouts in carrying out regular ordinary non-Eagle service projects. I know they're not as exciting, but just as important. And shouldn't the Life Scout be the one talking with the school about its needs and what he can do for them?

Those unscrupulous individuals wouldn't be sneaking & selling this stuff if there weren't a market for it. My apologies if I offend any collectors - but why do you need a whole set of badges that you didn't earn? Why do you pay beaucoup bucks for patches that you can't even wear?

Interesting thread revival ... A sad commentary indeed when the organization that issues the Eagle doesn't have faith in the recipients. It's a sad commentary that some people think having earned Eagle gives you more privileges, or makes you "better," or puts you a step ahead of someone who "just" earned Life. Or Tenderfoot. Or First Class. All Eagle means is that you fulfilled a certain set of requirements as a boy, not that you're some sort of superhuman as an adult. Is it impressive and worthy of recognition? Certainly. But an Eagle card or knot or badge doesn't open doors to you that are closed to someone else. I have very little patience with obsessive collector types. No individual Scouter truly needs a second or third collection of all the rank badges. Scouts get one badge; that's all any Scouter should have. If a unit wants to get an extra badge to make a special plaque or presentation to a recipient, as Eagle92 described, I'm sure that a letter from the SM, CC or COR to the shop manager would suffice. That's not what's being talked about here.(This message has been edited by shortridge)

A few ideas for aiding memorization ... 1. Make it tactile. Writing down the words - by hand - helps me memorize tons of material. Typing it out doesn't do the same thing, for whatever reason. 2. Make it interactive. Write out the words on pieces of paper or cardboard and have the Scout rearrange them, putting them in the right order, reverse order, etc. 3. Make it verbal. Do a group chant, song or round-robin shouting contest - saying the words out loud helps, too.

Lots of other examples, by industry ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snipe_hunt I rather like the dehydrated water, myself.

Yeah, I'm guessing that's why the B&G has evolved into a "graduation" - troops want a few months to work with the new Scouts and get them worked into patrols, learning some skills, etc., before sending them off to their first summer camp. It just falls at the right time.

I have also asked that the den provide me with a troop they plan to cross over into, as they do not want to crossover into the troop associated with our pack (a different story altogether). I have provided a list of troops for their review, offered to schedule meetings with the troops and offered to attend the meetings with the den and the leaders/parents. I have gotten no response, other than "we're looking into it." You do realize that's perfectly fine, right? They don't have to cross over into anything. There's no requirement to become Boy Scouts. Nor is there a requirement that the entire den cross over into the same troop together. If the boys and the den leader (is that the ex-Cubmaster?) don't take you up on the information you provided, that's their choice. Sounds like you've done everything you can do. Let them enjoy their remaining time as Webelos and don't make a big fuss out of it. If they decide to get in gear and finish the AOL later, or decide after the B&G to join a troop, present the AOL and hold a crossover ceremony at a regular pack meeting. No skin off your back, or theirs.

Tastes like chicken. Yum.

First camping trip as a Boy Scout, on a cold blustery spring weekend at Assateague Island, Md. Wind blowing over the dunes off the ocean and freezing everyone. The Rattlesnake Patrol, all of us freshly-graduated Webelos, are huddled around our campfire cooking lunch. The Scoutmaster wonders what's taking us so long - we're just boiling hot dogs, after all. He wanders over, to find us indeed boiling the dogs in the giant patrol cook kit pot ... ... one hot dog at a time. Our cooking skills could only improve from there.

We can't remove ourselves, as if we back out, we lose our number and veteran status... Is this really a huge concern? Keeping the same number and a little veteran strip patch is worth all this headache? The CO clearly does not understand its role. As others have stated, the DE needs to sit down and have a come-to-Jesus meeting with the CO and the pack leadership. That's his/her job. If it's not happening, leave a detailed phone message with the SE or field director about your attempts to contact your DE and the lack of response.

Just my opinion: - Summer camp staffers shouldn't be signing off on T-2-1 requirements. They should be running a program aimed at teaching certain topics, and then provide a list of those topics to the troop and patrol leadership at the end of the week. The troop and patrol are then responsible for checking and signing off. - I worked with an understaffed, overwhelmed FYC program for several years. We had between 2-3 staffers for 40-50 kids each week - just way too much. The solution was to enlist ASMs - usually ex-Webelos den leaders who'd just come up - as instructors and assistants. It was a stopgap solution - I wouldn't encourage it as a permament plan, but it worked in a pinch. - The age and experience levels of instructors is indeed an issue. When I went through an FYC program at my first year of summer camp, the instructors were these grizzled old guys who'd BTDT and had the scars to show it - they were great.

Some items from a past thread on non-traditional offerings included Golf and Auto Mechanics ... http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=198429#id_198538

Basementdweller - Not a single person that I could find suggested that the Cubmaster take WFA.

I've staffed these types of events before. Always a lot of fun. Staff were mostly recruited from summer camp staff. In the most recent one I did, in the fall, folks were paid $50 for working the weekend. (I didn't take it because it was more like a vacation than anything!) In my neck of the woods, they're usually an open program weekend - the staff is at the program areas from 9 a.m. to noon, and 1 to 5ish, and groups and individuals are free to float and do whatever they wanted. Activity areas included BB, archery, inflatables (several set up on the activity field), a nature hike, knot-tying, fire-building, handicrafts and showmanship (a talented staffer coached the Cubs on campfire skits and performing). The open program schedule has some pluses and minuses. Pluses: There's no pressure on families to dash halfway across camp to be "there" on time; folks could repeat activities if time allowed; they could take a breather in their campsite or go ona hike in the middle of stuff if they needed a break; families new to camp could get lost on the way between program areas without running late for anything. Minuses: Forty people showing up to do firebuilding at one time can be a bit chaotic; ditto for one group arriving five minutes into your already-running program and having to wait. Siblings could generally do the activities along with the Cubs. It was a blast watching the big sisters kick their brothers' butts at firebuilding! Webelos could choose to arrive Friday night and spend the night, cooking breakfast in the morning under the guidance of an experienced staffer. Everyone else arrived Saturday morning and spent the night - going to a campfire after dinner at which they performed their skits & songs - and heading home Sunday. Folks ate in the dining hall - there were two people on kitchen crew, and program staff helped serve and clean up. Two guys - myself included - showed up Friday morning to do the prep work - set up the archery range, gather wood and build the campfire, put out other program equipment, open up the comfort stations, etc. Most everyone else showed up later that evening, so college students could come on down after finishing up classes. Packs camped together, with families responsible for their own tentage. We attracted a lot of brand-new families who had just joined in August or September - it was a great way to introduce them to Cub Scouting and get both kids and parents excited and energized! It also was a way to get people to camp who hadn't attended summer camp before. Really opened a lot of eyes all around. And it was fun! The one challenge that the camp director faced was that Council didn't enforce the registration deadline - meaning people were still signing up on Friday night to arrive Saturday morning. Needless to say, that threw off the food calculations and campsite assignments a wee bit. It was still manageable, but just be sure your registrar sticks to their guns.

Just my opinion - The symbolism of the arrow is so linked to the Arrow of Light award that a display arrow, if your pack chooses to use this, should be given to only those who have earned the AOL. Figure out another gift for those Webelos who haven't earned the AOL. Otherwise, it has the potential to be really confusing. But if your pack is putting hours and hours into making these displays and gifts, I'd advise you to seriously consider a recalibration of your priorities. Keep It Simple isn't just part of KISMIF - it's a good method to make sure you don't burn out. Career arrows or whatnot are just not that important. Put your time and energy into a really good program for the B&G, and don't worry about the symbolism of thread colors. I got an AOL display arrow when I got my AOL, a simple target arrow on a display board. It sat atop my dresser for a few years, then got boxed up in the attic. Today, it's the items I earned from later in my Scouting career that have the place of pride and are most important to me. The arrow was nice, but not all that significant.

I don't have a vote on the committee I am program, they are administrative. Just say that out loud the next time your committee pulls a stunt like this: The committee wanted the pinewood cars routered for the v shaped weights in the bottom before they were given to the boy. So I spent new years day routering 70 pine wood cars. The committee doesn't get to dictate program stuff like that. Give the kids and their parents the kits, instructions and rules and let 'em do it themselves...

Thinking about this in a different way ... During a Cub Scout's career, he can go to day camp or summer camp five years in a row. At camp, he'll do the same old things - swimming, archery, maybe BB, boating, nature programs, handicrafts, etc. But each year, the same-old, same-old camp program becomes transformed (or should be!) into something new and neat and exciting. There will probably be a new theme, new camp staff costumes, new programs, a new trail to hike on, a new craft to make, new meals to cook over a campfire, a new archery lineup, new songs in the dining hall, new skits at the campfire ... We really only have to offer five different years of Cub program, to cover the progression from Tigers through Webelos. So if you can create five different ways of casting or presenting each activity, the kids will never know the difference. Maybe run Bowl-A-Thons at different lanes, or do a glow-in-the-dark bowling shindig; you could also have the Cubs create mini-bowling games as gifts with small wooden pins and balls ordered from a woodworking supply place. Do Pinewood Derbies at the local drag racing track, or visit a nearby NASCAR race first. Work with the camporee planners to present a new Cub program based on something they haven't done before. Instead of touring the local fire department three years in a row, ask the firefighters to put on a demonstration blasting the water hoses at the local park. And never do the same craft activity twice!

There's a lot of repetition in the Cub program as a whole. Example: Knots. They start off learning the basics as Wolves, and are at or near Tenderfoot level by the time they finish with Webelos. The key is changing it up enough each time and making it challenging and age-appropriate so that it's not just "the same old stuff."

I just got a major headache reading this thread. I also became very deliriously happy that I have a daughter. Even as a den chief, I didn't realize what goes into the race planning. Wow.