sherminator505

I have stated in other threads, I am not completely enamored with the BSA's current use of the Wood Badge for the 21st. Century (WB21C) course. Now I'm not saying that it's not a useful course or that the course content isn't valuable to Scouters. But I do feel that this course should be placed in its proper perspective. WB21C is an encapsulated course in leadership skills. It is not a true capstone course for Cub Scout leaders, nor is it a capstone course for Boy Scout leaders or Venturing leaders, as it does not attempt to serve as a continuation of the previous courses that these Scout

I realize that WB21C is not an outdoor skills course. It is what it is. It is an encapsulated course in leadership skills. It is not a true capstone course for Cub Scout leaders, nor is it a capstone course for Boy Scout leaders or Venturing leaders. Yet that is exactly what the BSA is promoting it as, to the detriment of Cub Scout leaders, Boy Scout leaders and Venturing leaders. That is the biggest problem with the current BSA training regime as I see it.

"Eagle92 - Why do they think that outdoors experience is critical for a Cubmaster? It's not like he or she is going to be leading monthly pack campouts or anything. Just seems odd." I'm guessing they don't. That is the greatest fallacy of WB21 - Cub Leaders and Boy Scout Leaders and Venturing leaders each have unique training requirements that the BSA is attempting to meet with a single capstone course. And that is WRONG!

I also agree with BadenP, and at the risk of going out on a thin limb, I would not want to see an Eagle as either PL or SPL. An Eagle would make an excellent Den Chief or even a JASM (if you believe in JASMs), but I would rather see an Eagle take on the POR of INSTRUCTOR who could help put on Troop Leader Training with the Star/Life SPL for the 2nd/1st PLs. My $.02.

"The public thinks that scouting is about creating a wilderness survivalist with First Aid, Firebuilding, and Knot tying skills. BSA thinks scouting is about developing personal self worth, confidence, and leadership that just happens to take place outdoors." How did this get turned around on us? The training does not "happen to take place outdoors." To say that obscures the method being employed, namely the outdoors. Scouts don't "happen to be" outdoors. We get the boys out, away from TV, video games, modern conveniences and support systems, so that they can see for themselves what

Venividi, I follow your argument to the extent that National probably can't concern itself with whether or not every Tommy Tenderfoot has done everything he needed to to earn Second Class. But National does have some vested interest as they set the requirements for Second Class. Here we see a linkage between what National has prescribed and what happens at the unit level. Compare that to National's approach to, say, training. Rather than maintaining a distinct training continuum for each program, everything funnels into a common W21C course. Now the question in my mind is "Does this

"Yes, of course National cares. The real question is not whether they care, but whether they care about the same things that you care about and whether they have the same priorities that you have." If this is even an issue, if this question can be seriouly entertained, and if there is enough separation between goals and priorities of National and those at the unit level, then our organization has BIG problems to address.

My advice: bang your head on your keyboard. It will probably be less painful, and you will at least achieve a measurable result.

ROTFLOL! I guess some graphics artist wannabe at National had a fun afternoon... at least I hope they didn't pay an outside vendor for that.

I still question the value of this requirement!

Welcome to I/P, RANBOW. Things tend to get a bit wooly in here - thus the disclaimer. Believe me, things could be a lot worse, say, if our resident non-Scouter decided to chime in...

Historically, a lot of the schisms the Church has experienced have been accompanied by political forays (for example, the Church's closeness to the Holy Roman Empire made it easier for the Reformationists and the Church of England to separate). More recently and locally, I've seen direct lobbying against gay marriage and petitions on local measures, just to name a few. Now don't get me wrong. I'm OK with a religious leader commenting on morality as it relates to current political issues in church. Nothing wrong with that. But when church officials lobby legislators and push positions as a

I have read the changes to the Mass, and they do not concern me. I have also seen the Church's recent forays into governmental issues, and those do concern me. It seems that the Church has had its greatest difficulties when it has inserted itself into politics (rendering onto Caesar what is God's, IMHO), and I don't see much good coming from these present efforts either.

Perhaps a Toyota would be a good choice. I hear they're unstoppable!

"...the Scout has not demonstrated sufficient mastery of Scout skills to represent the troop to a group of Cub Scouts." This wording seems oddly specific, yet does not appear in the job descriptions or requirements for den chief that have been previously cited. Where did it come from? "I wonder how the Scout would feel if he was assigned to a Den which wasn't led by his parent?" I felt OK with it... "older Boy Scout" As has been previously stated, this is highly subjective. I would intrerpret this as being mature enough so as not to be lumped in with the Cubs by the de

"No parent goes to the head shrinker wanting to hear that their little Johnny is just not as smart, or isn't as strong etc... if they are spending their hard earned $ (or at least hard earned copay) on an office visit, they EXPECT a REASON (i.e. diagnosis) for WHY their child is the way they are." I pay thousands on my health plan each year, and my employer kicks in thousands more. I realize that I've paid much more than the copay, and I'm surprised more health plan members don't realize that they do as well. Probably a good spinoff thread...(This message has been edited by sherminator505

I'm not sure why ANY SM would be cool to the idea of having more den chiefs. Den chiefs are invaluable to a troop's recruiting efforts, as it helps build relationships between troops and packs. If any of my Scouts indicated an interest in working as den chief, I would find a pack for him to work with and get him trained ASAP.

I don't see a problem, so long as there's nothing garish on the sleeves.

I've often wondered about the whole Latin thing. If the Holy Spirit came down upon the disciples and allowed them to speak in tongues, did they interpret that as a sign to go to Rome and learn Latin, or was there perhaps a different purpose behind those events? Just askin'...

"...my interest is piqued by seeing so many Asian/Oriental nations having large scouting programs. . . when one initially believes such nations might be poorer, or their peoples wouldn't be able to afford scouting." Values are not hard to afford (they're free). Neither is the game of Scouting as it was meant to be played (that's cheap). Now it is hard to imagine people in these countries being able to afford the heavily marketed and merchandised Scouting that we do here in the States today (that's nuts!).(This message has been edited by sherminator505)

I'm not sure where all this is going...

Somehow this strikes me as a particularly American issue. Have any of you international Scouters encountered this question?

My deacon tells me that the changes entail a newer, presumably more accurate translation from the Latin, but it will still be in the vernacular.

SHHHHHH! You're giving people ideas!

In some of these threads, I've noticed a lot of talk about Eagle Scout. How hard should a parent push? How hard should a Scouter push? How disappointed should I be if my Scout/son doesn't make Eagle? I've also seen a lot of emphasis on Eagle among some of the Scouters I deal with in real life. I know one Scouter who has me scratching my head every now and again. Really nice guy, loves working with the boys, but he introduces himself by telling you how many Eagles his troop has produced. Is that really the be-all and end-all for him? I doubt it, but it sure seems that way sometimes. A