packsaddle

Sagerscout, I would give the boy every opportunity to explore his own feelings through reading and discussion with other people who have struggled with this question. I agree that this boy needs a non-judgemental environment. Merlyn is right that there is an eventual risk but isn't that risk there anyway? Our last batch of Eagle applicants merely submitted the application with no supporting materials (at the request of the council). I believe that few persons actually saw the supporting letters and other materials. If this is common practice, it shouldn't be a problem. Swordse, I have arr

mk9750, Years ago while I was trying to grasp the rift between the UUA and BSA it became clear that while each organization agreed to disagree, the UUA, near the end, tried to accommodate BSA as part of an agreement to get the religious award back on the uniform. The UUA changed the wording of their pamphlet to conform to the stated demands of BSA. BSA reneged. Bob White is correct in his statements that BSA needs no justification for its actions...or any justification they wish. BSA is free to act arbitrarily and with prejudice and they owe no explanation as a result. My question is: "a

Eisely, I am somewhat sympathetic to your idea. While my boys understand that their patches can be placed on their swim trunks, they are completely opposed to such. Each year the new crop of snorkelers and mile-swimmers file their patches away. It would be good to see some other approved form of display. They still go for the achievements year after year, but refuse to display the patch in the official manner.

Fat Old Guy, I'm not sure how to respond to your quip. So I defer to your superior knowledge of bedroom exile. Marty, I gleefully add that one to my life's collection of delicious ironies.

Just a note in case someone has some misconception about lemmings. If you were to stand in the tundra during a lemming population boom, you would be lucky to actually see a lemming or two within your search radius. The image of lemmings lunging en masse over a cliff into the sea was popularized by a Disney movie 'White Wilderness'. That image as well as other scenes depicting the results of overpopulation by lemmings were contrived by the film crew. See the link: http://www.snopes.com/disney/films/lemmings.htm The film crew purchased lemmings from Inuit children elsewhere and imported them

btps, Thread evolution in progress. Anyway, something you wrote struck home with me. Many years ago as cubmaster, I made the mistake of allowing our local DE to speak at the Blue and Gold banquet. I winced as he presented a shrill diatribe on homosexuals and atheists and how BSA was confronting this menace (I am not exaggerating). While it was comforting to know his days as DE were numbered, that made little difference to several families who summarily left scouts as a result. I think you are correct. Most families are in for the positive things about the program, the things that are direct

OneHour, I would like to encourage you to stick with scouts. I have a coffee mug that beseeches me, "Don't let the turkeys get you down." I offer that message to you because we need people who care. Specifically, we need people who care about the boys...and if we give up we leave the boys to the turkeys. Try to take Bob White's message to heart. There is a example who is as rigid and by-the-book as I can envision and I can only imagine the frustration that he experiences because of that. But he seems to thrive. I also have to hold my nose on some occasions in this organization and sometim

LauraT7, I agree with your concerns about MBs at summer camp. My pet example is Env. Sci. where the boys finish this in 5 effective days of camp. I suppose this is possible if they do little else but I doubt such camps meet the full requirements for that badge. I have similar concerns about several other knowledge-based badges given at summer camp. I am still looking for the way to communicate such concerns effectively to our council. They haven't listened in the past. However, if enough of us make noise I think we will eventually be heard. The issue with the individual boy is related but it

NJCubScouter, I hope he arrived too tired to tell you all the fun he had. But you are correct in your anxiety. Eventually, he may encounter a situation, perhaps hazing, that will make him question things. It happened to my son and many of my other recent Eagles. In each case, either with me or with their parents, they reached a decision point: leave scouts or stay and confront the situation and see the completion of their goal. This usually occurs just before or just after First Class. If they decide to make the commitment, some time later while they are well on their way they discover that

kwc57, I think that Fat Old Guy was responding to one of my posts when he was originally signed on as Al Lundy and then switched. I can only surmise that when the forum switched his moniker it changed all occurrences of Al Lundy except those in the message texts. But I clearly remember username Al Lundy, and later my confusion at responses from Fat Old Guy. Anyway, I guess I don't have very strong feelings one way or another as to identity switches, etc. Maybe I just haven't thought about it enough. littlebillie, I agree. Although I've been hard on a few posters from time to time, I haven't

There is little I can add to the excellent responses I have read. So I join by saying this is the 'character' part where the boy must decide what the 'spirit' means to him. The parent is crucial in providing support and guidance. The exercise is one that he will have an opportunity to repeat for the rest of his life. Good luck.

This line of questioning could be very humorous. When I went to camp as a boy, I was perfect (anyone believe that?). But really, I can't remember anything I forgot that was really needed. My son, on the other hand... Well, OK, one set of underwear (or other clothes) for the entire week is survivable. And you really don't need a flashlight. They don't normally brush their teeth anyway. H'mmm, I join with Ed on the sleeping bag thing. Also, a swim suit is tough to replace. If they are in open dwellings, a mosquito net is also good. If he forgets bug spray, he'll come home looking like smallpox

Twocubdad, Connecticut is prohibited by law from promoting organizations that practice such discrimination, especially self-avowed discriminatory organizations such as BSA. I saw no judgement that BSA discrimination policy was bad or evil. Or did you read something I missed? Connecticut is simply prohibited from promoting an organization with such discrimination policy. There is no judgement necessary, they are just following the law. I suppose there may be a forum somewhere in which similar complaints against Connecticut are made by members of the KKK. Here is the solution I see: The

scoutldr, I suspect that your good questions will not be answered. Or at least not be answered well. I have been asking, in different ways, similar questions that relate to one aspect you mentioned. I doubt that this is related to influence based on wallet size alone but I think your assertion of dominance by one group over everyone else is correct. But isn't that obvious? Isn't this common for any organization? I would like for the decision-making process to be made open to the membership. I would like not to have to speculate on who these influential persons are...or what they have said in t

Twocubdad, I didn't get the part where BSA's discrimination policy is illegal. I think it is legal in all states - that question was settled by the U.S. Supreme Court. Connecticut is not limiting BSA's ability to apply or enforce its policy. Connecticut simply declines to promote fundraising for BSA because BSA does discriminate. It's that simple, no judgement involved...outside that applied by BSA itself.

Acco40, 10-4 on those chips. But the designation of 'pie' I strictly reserve for food items. Let's see, cow-pie, that could be meat loaf? FYI, A couple of my other favorite euphemisms include 'meadow muffin' (another verboten food reference), and 'meadow mound'.

BSA knew the score and we should live with the consequences without whining and wetting our beds. Merlyn is right, a state should not promote as charities, organizations that would place the state in violation of its anti-discrimination statutes. BSA is still completely accessible to the public as a charity - the public merely needs to support BSA directly rather than through United Way or similar vehicles. Connecticut has done nothing to alter that and state's rights advocates should be in agreement. Remember this is BSA's choice, indeed demand, to go it alone as an exclusive, private organiz

We have had a considerable number of boys who (frustrated with other troops) have quit Scouts for a while and joined back again into our troop. It has been my pleasure to inform them that the partials they are carrying may, indeed, be completed at any time until age 18. These guys have become outstanding leaders in our troop, our gain was someone else's loss. Other troops in the area have 6-month or 1-year limits and I try to make it known to everyone that this is not regulation. They don't seem to care. One SM even retests his scouts on each MB and refuses to pass them if they don't meet H

Eaglefoot, This is another example of why I believe a sense of humor always helps. Being one of your neighbors, I too have encountered similar situations, just not in my troop. Thankfully my troop is really good this way. I think there have been good suggestions for troop internal responses. My response to other angry leaders varies but most of the time those guys are frustrated and just blowing off steam. You can usually sense this and they usually don't really want to knock your block off. I calmly ask first, "Is that really what you want to do?" If this throws them for a loop (and it doe

If she doesn't want the Chianti, I'll take it. But, ahem, it is also made in Wisconsin, isn't it? Just trying for consistency.

Rooster, "We are Bob. Resistance is futile." Magnificent! The best thing I've read in a while. ...or like the little dinosaur says, "gotta love him!". My vote: Time to kill this thread. See you folks elsewhere.

Saltheart, You were asked for an email address for notification of postings, etc. when you signed on to the forum. That is your private email. I'm posting this message to yours immediately after this.

Eisely, I guess some of us "shif'less skonks" are a little more "tetched in the haid" than others. The tough part is figuring out who's who sometimes. Dsteele has made a positive contribution and I, for one, am less likely to level a blanket condemnation at the pros as a result. That's progress, isn't it?

Yazr, weuns do! For a 'Snuffy' initiation see: http://www.toonopedia.com/snuffy.htm

The boys in our troop usually discuss this topic during the drive back. In no particular order: Food - ice cream (milkshake is good), pizza, fresh-baked cookies (usually chocolate chip). Hot shower. Television shows or movies or video games. The family dog. Sleep. No offense intended, but mom usually ranks after all that stuff but ahead of siblings and housework. Dad (if not a scout leader) comes in somewhere at about the level of the shrubbery around the house. BTW, they will act as if they don't like it but secretly they really love being smothered in kisses, called 'sweetie', and bei