Mike Long

Hi eisely. Debate and discussion with the intent to solve a problem or make things better than they are is always welcome. Arguement for the sake of arguement usually proves to do nothing more than increase the concentation of greenhouse gasses in the immediate atmosphere. Especially methane.

Where is one I really want to do but haven't done yet. 1910 weekend. Essentially the boys research what scouting was like in 1910 (or thereabouts) and build gear to do a weekend camp using the gear and techniques used at that time (including food.) All the modern stuff would be off limits. My guys are all gearheads, drooling over the latest high tech camping gear. Why not test their skills by taking all that stuff away. Scouting fundamentals work quite well without goretex, nynol and titanium.

OGE that is one cool tradition.

The Scout Law is our moral code. Morally straight means living your life according to the Scout Law. Eleven year olds grasp this concept at their first Scout meeting yet we Adults argue the point ad nauseum. (as FScouter pointed out in the first response to the origional question) YOUR TASK FOR THE EVENING- 1. Ask your children what it means and listen to them. 2. Report it here.

Paul try https://www.rei.com. REI brand sahara convertable pants in olive. Call them and tell them what you want them for and they may discount them.

A bunch of the ultralighters use it. Search almost any backpacking site forum and you will find people who love it. One of the gang on www.thebackpacker.com/trailtalk posted this source awhile back. "Try Quest Outfitters in Sarasota, Fl Ph # 1-800-359-6931. They sell it by the yard, around 50-60" wide and about 4-5 dollars a yard. I haven't used any for a ground cloth but have used haz mat suits made from it and it's tough. Quest sells outdoor fabrics. I have bought goretex and heavy coated oxford nylon for a bivy sack I made, and I am very happy with their service. So not only is this a source for tyvek but a great source if you want to make your own quality gear." stalker 06:40:23 PM 02/27/01 My best suggestion is to ask any contractors you might know for some or vist home construction sites and ask about getting leftovers. There is usually pieces big enough for our purposes lying around.

Never heard of the rules being waived (or broken) for this and I would not do it or be party to it. There is a physical aspect to this too folks. Waiving the requirement is one thing but Boy Scouts willingly breaking the rules and lying about it? I think not.

Right on with your logic Rooster. When I was a scout we had a family with four boys active in the troop. The Father was as active as he could financially be but it was next to impossible for him to join his boys at camp without assistance on an enlisted sailors pay. We do as much as we can to cover summer camp fees for our adults.

I was very suprised when the SPL asked to address the Committee and out popped the smoking issue. I had always thought that all of our smokers handled themselves quite well and didn't think we had an issue to address. We do make it a point to tell new folks about it in order to aviod any possible problems later.

Our SPL and PLC approached the Troop Committee a few years ago and TOLD (not asked or consulted with) the Troop Committee that our troop is a non smoking troop and that the boys would not tolerate adults smoking or using tobacco products around them. They also stated that they know that smoking is not illegal and that smokers aren't bad people but the boys don't want to be smoked around. They stated that they would not have a problem though if the adults smoked discretely and at a distance from the rest of the troop. Been working fine for about 5 years now with no complaints or hard feelings and the smoking adults are still active with us. Heck, most of them were amused at how it all came down.

Very true Robin, very true. There's an old scout tale about a boy caught vigourously rubbing his bar of soap against a camp building wall on the last day of a week of summer camp. When asked what he was doing he replied, "If my mom sees that the letters are still on the soap when I get home she will know I haven't had a shower all week!" I thought it quite funny until I caught a boy doing the same thing last year.

Ivory soap.

Moms, Dads and Legal Guardians are always welcome to attend any of our events. Siblings are welcome but are the sole responsibility of the parent not the troop or any the troops members or officers. The trips are the boys trips and not those of the parents or siblings. If you are not a boy scout you are along for the ride. If someone tries to "take over" the trip from the boys or registered adult leaders then they are asked to leave. Adults that wish to attend our high adventure trips must meet the same physical requirements as the boys and siblings are not allowed to go.

You might want to inform these parents that vengeful and slanderous are not traits of a good scout or scouter. When children go astray we correct them and we all move on. We don't toss them out. What an ignorant idea, throwing a kid out of the single most positive outside influence they may ever know. These kids are in learning mode, they are supposed to do things wrong so we can correct them. I'm suprised when I get a boy who doesn't do things like what you described. Removing a boy from a unit should only happen, as the rules say, after PERSISTENT behaviour that is unable to be corrected. I would also add unrepentant to the description too. To me removal would only be an option if these two were constantly razzing this boy over a long period of time. Frankly it seems that the parents have already solved this symptom by choosing to change troops, but they certainly haven't solved the problem. Kids don't drop kids in the dumpster for no reason. What was the reason? Was he annoying, rude or simply didn't know when to quit "having fun." You mentioned that they were all willing participants. I'm guessing since everyone was having a good time the dumpers thought that the dumpee (I won't call him a victim cause he's not) was ok with being dumped. The dumpee got upset because he didn't think that the two would actually do it. Sound about right bigbeard? This is not hazing. Hazing is malicious physical and mental abuse dealt out (usually) arbitrarily. This is three kids screwing around and taking a fun time for all too far and someone got their pride hurt.

If you have someone musicly inclined a bugler does wonders at 7:30 am. I do believe that if the boys are up real late at night it's because we didn't keep them busy enough during the day. Oh yeah, the garbage man thing applies to the adults too.

Are you kidding me? My scouts wake me up in the morning at first light. On backpacking trips the last one up is the garbage man. Garbage man carries ALL garbage for the troop. It becomes quite a show on a week long hike.

I'm being dragged down a road I don't belong on and some are reading what they want to into my post and not what I actually said and then clarified further. I personally don't approve and don't find the situation appropriate for someone who is supposed to be an example to youth. I also stated quite clearly that I do not make the rules regarding this situation and the BSA only gets involved when the situation occurs on a BSA activity. Will I tear up the application? No. I'm too busy to worry about what the parents are doing when I'm herding the boys.

True, but I would hope that if you were so interested in becoming a professional scouter that you would already own a uniform or two.

This sounds like a kid who really needs the attention and help but the problem is that it sounds as if the parents are working at odds to you. It is very difficult to help a child when you only get an hour or two a week and the rest of the week the parents subvert the agreed upon plan. Are the parents active in troop meetings and activities or are they just "droppers?" If they are not then I think it is necessary for them get active to help manage the boy. If they are... You have talked to the parents, you have gotten the parents active you have developed a action plan with the parents, you have explained to the boy and parents what he needs to do to improve and have given him attention, patience and time. It sounds as if you are doing everything right on your end. Remember, you are only a scout leader not a doctor or a behavioural psychologist. If the boy needs that level of help then it is up to the parents to get it for him and not to expect a part-time scout volunteer to provide it. BUT As for advancing you can't hold a child back especially if the child has a bona fide medical condition. He can't be thought of in the same vien as a fully capable boy who is merely lazy. The BSA make allowances for this and allows scoutmasters to substitute or modify requirements. Look at Star: While a First Class Scout, serve actively for four months in one or more of the following troop positions of responsibility (or carry out a Scoutmaster-assigned leadership project to help the troop) See that last sentence? That right there is your way to accomodate that boy. When he is ready, assign him a leadership project and let him run.

Night hiking under a full moon is the best. I once backpacked an open streach of the AT under moonlight. It was incredible.

That's interesting. Those who are paid to be in scouting get a price break.

I wear my Eagle 24/7. Not the badge or medal, the real eagle, and that's what matters. I would hope that it would be obvious to everyone what I am through my words and actions. Proud? Guilty as charged

I did give a straight answer. No. But I am not making the rules.

What an incredibly inappropriate and unscoutlike username for someone who is supposed to be an example to kids. A scout is courteous. I don't think cheap insults qualify.

Eisely pegged my initial thoughts exactly. I was thinking something eaten on the trail not in camp-world of difference and most backpaskers don't do hot lunches. It means you have to carry more weight in fuel. heavy bad light good