insanescouter

LisaBob ... thanks thats said what I was shooting for in a much better way. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

I am glad some one enjoys my babble I use to get so pissed when I was Webelos den leader. I would have parents come up to me and say "Johnny is ADHD, you need to treat him special" needless to say it took a lot of self control to smack the parent silly. Instead I would go, let me tell you about myself. I always got the kid to join the den, and the parents were always surprised at how when not treated special or looked upon differently how "normal" they could be. This is not to mean they did not need special help, now and then, but overall they could do anything the others could do as long as you were patient and would tell them how to do the same thing 10 different ways until they understood it. I have that problem I do not think or remember things the same others seem to. They way I store that data in my head and the way i retrieve is a bit different. When I was in my senior year of High School I made the decision to stop using my problems as an excuses and learn to live with and lead a normal life. About 5 years later I was no longer on medication. Two years as a devil 18-19 year old because I did not know how to interact with others or control myself (because the meds were doing it for me). Now I have been off the meds for like 10 years. People go you do have those problems, you most have out grown them. No! I still have them, I still fight internally with them everyday. I still to this day really enjoy mentoring the pre-teens that have the array of learning disabilities. I have even done it a few times for kids I never meet, just knew online. I am going on and on again ... so I will end here, with an open invitation to pick my brain or to ask for help with a lad in your group. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

It sounds like to me maybe its time to have a heart to heart with the parents... for example at a Court of Honor have a 10 min presentation ready to go... here is the idea... Open it up with the Scoutmaster talking about the importance of camping, how safety is ensured, the guide to safe scouting, etc. You may want so general camping pic running on a projector or tv at the same time. Then have some scouts talk about a fun or challenging, or learning experience they had. Wake the parents up a bit with a scout made up in makeup with a nasty wound, and they explain how we are trained and train the scouts to handle these situations. Also make sure you pick out a few times when something did go wrong, especially if you have a picture to go with it. Explain what went wrong, how it was dealt with, etc... Anyway thats a fast idea from top of my head. The idea is to show them quickly the importance of camping, how safety is enforced, and how you react to problems. We put the Scouts into challenging situations all the time, but because of the way we plan, implement and control it, nothing bad happens. Do we let them shot that gun at summer camp? So we let them repeal down that rock? Do we go on a 80 mile backpacking trip? Do we go rafting? Do we cook over an open fire? Do we let them us an ax? Do we let them get in the car for a left to school to be hit by a drunk driver? Every day they are faced with risk. It is a matter of how we prepare them to face it and if we are prepared and knowledgeable enough to face it ourselves. I do believe that education is a big key to many problems. Anyway thats my 2 cents or maybe that was 25 cents ... lol Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

I totally agree Boy Ran will not happen over night, nor will getting the adults to back off. Eagledad said it best: >>It is my experience that the adults have to learn there part in a boy run program just as much as the scouts learn theirs because the limits we adults put on the scouts are mostly based from our fears. We can only tame those fears by teaching, learning and striving to do it better next time. That is why I say boy run is the freedom adults give the scouts. As we become better adult leaders, we give the scouts more freedom to choice and learn. I wish there was a way we could send that comment to every adult leader working with a Troop... Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

What I am referring to are resources such as websites. Here is a sample list from top of my head I like to pass on: http://insanescouter.org'>http://insanescouter.org http://scoutlink.net http://scouter.com http://usscouts.org http://macscouter.org I also point out the local council website and boyscoutmuseum.com (the local scout museum). I also include digital resources like: Troopmaster / Packmaster / Scoutmate / etc The Usscouts.org CD-rom Topo Map computer programs CD Clip Art Collection CDs BSA Cds like ScoutZone Anyway you get the idea... what else would you include? Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

I was wondering how many trainers out there tell those they are training about virtual and digital resources available to them. I have a whole list I like to review, and it takes less then 2 minutes to do it. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

I will give it a shot... In its most basic level it means: you let the boys plan and run their program (under the Scoutmasters guidance). In detail: The older Scouts who hold a leadership position should meet on a regular bases(usually monthly) to hold a Patrol Leader Council (PLC) this is the time when the Older Scouts plan out the next months meetings and campout. They plan out the program. The committee generally will handle transportation, reserving the campsite, etc. Also once a year they should meet, usually works best as part of a special event just for the PLC members, to plan out the themes and general overview calender for the year. I heard this once ... The job of the Scoutmaster is to set back in his rocking chair and observe what is going on. If he has to get up then the youth leaders are not doing their job. Ok now we all know that will never happen, but if you replace "Scoutmaster" with "adults" you get the idealistic way it should be. Again, that will never happen completely. Our Scoutmaster tells the youth leaders "if you ever feel that I or any of the other adults are stepping on your toes, taking over your program, tell them nicely to back off". It is their program to run, we have to let them run it. The way they learn is by falling down and getting back up to try again. There is one big exception to this and that is in case of safety. The favorite example is a Scout running around wilding an AX. But it could be hazing or anything else... I also suggest you look at the "poor program" thread. It may help too. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

If you were to ask me which Scout Leader I was most influenced by as a lad. I would say my Dad, with a tear in my eye and a heart full of pride. I have to give you a bit of background to understand why... I was a difficult child with so many problems that they couldn't even be counted, I had a medical record a mile thick. I have since learned to live with my problems, and lead a some what normal life. Here is a short idea of what my problems are: ADHD, Dyslexia, short / long term memory problems, coordination problems, speech impairments, bit of hearing lose, among other problems. As a result of some weird things I would do either for "fun" or to get "attention" my dad had to tackle me a few time. Keep in mind my dad is not a big guy, or a fast guy, he did what he had to do - do for his son. In more recent years I have leanrned how many times the Troop tried to kick me out (the Troop I made Eagle in), yet each time my dad fought for me. Please don't get me wrong, I was not a bully, violent or even the type to try and harm myself. In real life I was timid chicken, and even still I am in some ways. I am not really sure how to explain how I would act out, most of it I don't remember anymore. The main problem was I had no social skills, and today still have trouble in that area. It is still amazing what I have accomplished: I graduated High School with a 3.43 gpa and College with two AA degrees in computers with a 3.56 gpa which means I graduated honor roll and on the deans list. I earned Eagle, I am a Brotherhood in the OA, Woodbadge trained, I even run my own business on the side, and so much more. Ok my dad alone did not do all of that. The Scouting program, the other leaders, and even many of the Scouts resulted in a much better me. It also probably resulted in a better them. What did Scouting or a special leader do for you? Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

Yes, link a Troop to at least one pack is important. As long as that Troop will provide Den Chiefs, actively work with the pack, set up special events with the pack, invite Webelos on occasional campouts, etc. There are many reasons I believe that fewer Webelos are crossing over into Boy Scouts, but that is probably a topic for another thread (which has been on this forum a few times already). Jambo, I have been told more then a few times that you have to be a little bit insane to be a Scout Leader. I think at least to a point that is true, but you have to also have a good heart and a strong back. No matter how many times one has been around the block there is always a place for them in Scouting. It may not be Scoutmaster, it may be on the committee or as a counselors, but there is always something. I am sure I speak on behalf of all Scouters when I say we hate to lose you. My dad has tried to retire several times, and some how is still the Scoutmaster. I can of think he is a lot like Lynn Simons (what ever his name was) the Scoutmaster from Follow me Boys movie ... he will still be Scouting in his final days. My dad is in it not for the BS in Boy Scouts, but for the Scouts, the future, the adventure, and even that occasional hug. If you were to ask me which of the Scout Leaders I was most influenced by as a lad, taught me the most, and helped me the most I would say my Dad with a tear in my eye and a heart full of pride. I have to give a bit of background... I was a difficult child with so many problems that they couldn't be counted. Most of which I have now learned to live with but here is a short idea: ADHD, Dyslexia, short / long term memory problems, coordination problems, speech impairments, among other problems. My dad had to tackle me twice for will we will refer to it as discipline problems. I have found out long after this the committee tried to kick me out a few times, and each time my dad fought for me. I was not really a bad kid, a bully, really I was the opposite very timid and really a chicken. My problem was I had no social skills, and still have trouble in that area. Another reason I tend to do better behind a computer then on the phone or even in person. Over the years I have gotten much better, but still deal with the problems. Give you an idea what one can do I graduated High School with a 3.43 gpa and College with two AA degrees in computers with a 3.56 gpa which put means I graduated honor roll and on the deans list. You will see me often stand up for that trouble scout saying the worst thing we can do is kick them out. Scouting is a powerful tool and does create miracles. I am walking proof. After all look at my gpa's, consider I earned Eagle, I am a Brotherhood in the OA, I am Woodbadge trainined, and I even run my own business on the side. Ok my babble is over, I think I will start a new thread: "What has Scouting done for you" Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

Welcome to the list! I am from Las Vegas NV USA. If you like to chat I also recommend you check out ScoutLink a nice web based chat is available at: http://insanescouter.org/chat'>http://insanescouter.org/chat (it is java based). Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

As an internet professionals I can tell you I will never go back to IE and anyone who makes there site so parts or all of it only works on IE ... will lose alot of potential business. I am not the only one that will go to a properly made site, if the one I am looking at wont work in firefox. Also IE does not support near what it should when it comes to CSS and other client side technology. Why can't all browsers be WC3 compliant? (yes I know not even FF is fully compliant) Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

We do it at the court of honor. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

A lot of the problems you are having I have heard or seen similar problems personally or in other posts, other boards, etc ... All I can say is you seem to know the way it should be. Stand up and be heard, but do it in a gentle, well planned, well organized, with lots of information and documentation to back you up. You may want to get a few guests maybe leaders from other troops, the district, unit commissioner, district executive, etc to come talk to your committee to. Just make sure its easy and gentle so you don't lose anyone. As far as training goes here are a few ideas (I have served on the training team). Talk to your training team, if there are enough people or a big enough problem at least one member of the team may come put on a special training (even if unofficial) for you. Two, make sure they do at least youth protection and fast start (both of these can be done online). Three, put on the Troop level committee training course (I am sure you can get your district and the training team to help you if needed). I will not try to pass on more wisdom, where I have none, but look forward to seeing more of what others have to say... Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

Yeah im in Las Vegas ... 24 hour because of the casinos...

Our Troop has formal bylaws, and a section in there says families can not bring pets on campouts. I will admit do to certain reasons I have had to take my dog on a few campouts, the kids love her, but still as a general rule I wouldn't bring her if I could help it. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

My concern here is that means if a parent can't help, say they have an insane job where they often work 60 plus hours a week or something. Or do to a disability. They just cant help. That means the boy, who could use scouting can't join???? That is wrong. As the saying goes the biggest dis-service we can do to a boy is not invite them into scouting. Every boy should have the opportunity. If you turn kids away just because their parents cant or wont help, then how can we mold and shape and turn them into the futures leaders? Ok sorry, my rant is over... Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

The troop I am with does both one nighters and two nighters. It greatly depends what else is going on and how far away it is. Also if it is a district / council event we don't have control over. Another big factor for us is adult support. We are in a 24 hour town and many parents / leaders work weird shifts making it hard. As much as possible to keep the program active, fun, challenging and different. Try to keep changing places you camp, how long you spend there, what you do there, etc. A great advantage of the two nights is the extra time to do things, regardless if advancement, or other things the location offers or you have planned. Just make sure you follow the guide to safe scouting. I do recommend two nighters as much as possible. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

I have a little bit of a problem with older Scoumasters and main leaders on the program side only because I have seen on the occasion that they are less enthusiastic and less likely to lead a more adventurous program. I do want to note there are many older Scout Leaders out there doing a great job and even actively doing some of the more adventurous activities. How many of you know what happens when you take "Outing" out of Scouting? All you have left is "Sc" which in a Friends of Scouting pitch becomes dollars and cents by drawing a line through each of the two letters. Let me ask this question when you think of an adventurous program what do you think of? (I will post my thoughts later)... Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

I believe that it takes both, motivated leaders and a strong program. However when you do not have the motivated leaders, energizing the program and following through with it will bring up their desire to not only participate, but plan out and run a fun adventurous program. Activities are anything you do. They just have to be fun, challenging and active. If all they are is "ok boys, lets set down and talk about this merit badge" well of course everything else is down with it. If you get them out running around and doing things, as it relates to Scouting then everything else will follow. Also keep in mind what you think is a great program, the boys may not agree on. Excitement comes from both the activity and those involved. It has to start some where. Just like we lead by example, we need to also as leaders be their to show our excitement. There are tons of team building activites out there, that are fun and challenging. Here is a good example. Line the boys up against a wall, tell them that only half their hands and half their feet (of the group) can touch the ground. And that the whole group has to be connected. They have to move the group from that wall to that point over there (other side of the room, a rope line, what ever). Their is no wrong way to do this as long as they meet the rules mentioned above. The easiest solution I have seen is wheel barrow with the arms laced through the person next to you. Another good one is say tent pitching ... no excitment right .. well what if some of the scouts were blind folded, another had a broken arm, another a broken leg oh and only one person or maybe no one can talk. There are many such games / actives. There are more ideas at http://insanescouter.com/t276/files/g-team.html. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

Do you believe that a poor program is the result of many of the issues units face today? I believe that a poor program, regardless of the reasons behind it, does cause many of the Problems within Scouting. It doesn't matter if its a result of: lack of parental support lack of leaders cost issues lack of equipment The one thing it isn't is the boys fault. The Scouts follow the example set around them. If campout are being canceled bacuase of lack of transportation, and another time because of weather and yet another time because a special guest failed to full fill a promise... Well guess what happened over that year, the Scouts said why bother its just another empty plan. If it is a Troop then the PLC won't plan it out as well as they may have before and slowly things will just get worse. I guess what I am trying to illustrate in a long winded fashion, is that it all has a ripple effect. Now we know the program has suffered, the Scouts are losing interest, and it now leads to trouble getting new leaders and Scouts. The fix is kind of obvious make the program exciting, challenging and fun. At the Cub level this is easier then at the Scout level. In the Troop I made Eagle in we had a High Adventure Patrol (back then we called it a team). We were highly trained and skilled. We had a Troop campout and a High Adventure outing every month. No we did not always make both. We were expected though to continue to support the normal Troop outings as much as possible, and we did. We did Philmont, Grand Canyon Twice, and many other adventures, this started brining in guys who were not married wanting to help just to be part of our HAT Patrol. They were always told the same thing, that is nice, but you also have to help the Troop too. Some said yes, some we didn't see again. In the end we had 22 eagles in like 3 years, had over 60 active members, and did at least one activity a month and sometimes as many as three. To put all this in perspective this was on a Air Force base 30 miles in middle of no where and had only like 10,000 residents with two troops and two packs. The Jr. / Sr High School I went to there had like 800 students. Now I am living in a big city with like 2million people and we are luck if we can get 15 active Scouts. Any way I will stop my babbling now... not really sure if I am asking anything, but feel free to reply, tell a story, etc. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

Welcome Tommy... Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

I spent months compiling a e-book of sorts full of fund raising ideas. I should note now that it is not Scout specific, it also has stuff that relates to other youth groups and religious institutions. You can find this book at http://insanescouter.org/t276/Fundrasiers.pdf'>http://insanescouter.org/t276/Fundrasiers.pdf ... Feel free to make suggestions... hope it helps... Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

From the experience I have had ... only a skilled wood worker would be able to do it and even they will have nightmares making it right. I like those above me suggest that you either rent one from another local pack (or Troop). Or you hold a fund raiser and buy one of the nice pre-made ones. As a side note I know of a local troop who owns their own track (as I recall they half built and half bought the parts already made) and they rent it out to packs. As I recall there deal is something like $150 dollars per event, but they even supply the man power to assemble, disassemble, and repair the track. As well as several leaders / scouts to help run the derby and judge it. Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org

You can check out ScoutData, they update the site automatically as you manage your records. Check out a sample site at http://troop653.scoutdata.com/ Scott Robertson http://www.InsaneScouter.org

I am a knot geek too, but to be honest its been a while since I really tested my skills so not sure how many I know. I would take a wild guess and say 80+ ... Scott Robertson http://insanescouter.org