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Could you tell me more about the district-level youth patrol leader training?   Is the syllabus available on line?  Around here, that training disappeared by 2001 except to the extent that my former troop ran it several years and invited other troops send participants.

It was probably very much like your course with a few modifications here and there. But I'm not sure the use it anymore since I was on the district committee. An old Brownsea syllabus is a good start if you can find one.



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Wood  Badge may do many things, depending on the quality of the Staff.     It teaches the Patrol Method hardly at all and emphasizes the "troop method."   Let's bounce Wood Badge III against BSA's

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We were using the Junior Leader Orientation Workshop syllabus with the now heretical 11 Leadership Skills.  "Welcome to Scouting's toughest job."

Our troop used that course as a guide because it is a true leadership skills course. But we found it to be too much content without a lot of exercise or practice. Kind of a shotgun approach to throwing a lot of information at the participants and hoping they catch 15% of it. So we scaled it way way down and the Scouts got a lot more out of it. Better to use three skills well than to forget all eleven. And we added other subjects important for our program like testing and signing off rank requirements. Yes, that subject was added as a reaction. We had a communication class but not like the 11 skills communication. This was much more basic like phone etiquette.


This goes back to what I was saying that course leaders need plan what they really want the participants to take back with them. Then build some meaningful activities for practice. Also maturity needs to be considered. I think the guide was designed for 14 and older Scouts. The average age of patrol leaders today is probably closer to 12. Big difference.


The frustration for me about training courses is that they should only be used to teach a needed skill that is not getting developed in the natural environment. But the BSA has pushed them to be a fix for all things whether or not anything in the course content needs fixing.


I grew to measure the performance of our patrol method program by the skills Scouts were lacking to perform their duties with confidence. I viewed any outside lessons needed for the Scouts to function with confidence in our program as a failure to our patrol method. Training is just a bandaid to bring skills to an acceptable level. So while we used training to build skills, I was always looking how to Build more practice of the skill in the natural patrol environment.


There is very little a senior scout could take from a council level junior leadership course that shouldn't already be practiced at a patrol level. The syllabus we developed for our Council Course intended for Scouts 14 and older came from the Patrol Leaders Handbook and SPL Handbook. You don't have to guess what two resources the Scouts were issued and expected to have with them in their classes.


I have harped on this forum many times that if the adults would just give their Scouts the PLHB and SPLHB and let them go, they would have a jump start on a patrol method program. I even required Scoutmasters bring those handbooks to my Scoutmasters Fundamental course so they could see just how much of the SM fundamental course material was in scouts' leadership Handbooks. Why lecture to Scouts what their books already say.


Anyway, I've gone to long.


Happy Fargers Day



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  • 11 months later...
On 6/17/2017 at 3:18 PM, TAHAWK said:

We were using the Junior Leader Orientation Workshop syllabus with the now heretical 11 Leadership Skills.  "Welcome to Scouting's toughest job."

The ideas of the 11 Leadership Skills still exist in the NYLT syllabus, it is worded and presented differently. And I will admit that it is not as in-depth in some areas but expands others. I still use the 11 Leadership Skills as supplemental material. 

Back on the original topic: My council has 7 NYLT troops this year, 2 of the SPLs are female.  We usually have 1 or 2 each year for At least the last 5 years or so. It may help that some of the first were daughters of NYLT Scoutmasters. That tends to help break the glass ceiling. On the other hand we have never had a female SM for NYLT.

Anyway, congratulations on your daughters accomplishment.

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