Now I'm the Troop's Treasurer

[blw2 433]

I agree with the statements around getting an audit. Have that done BEFORE you take control.

 

I would add another idea: Make a policy that ALL monies/paperwork are given directly to you. Scouters and other people do NOT handle any money or forms. It is a recipe for disaster. Set up a time that you will be at meetings to collect dues, paperwork, etc. Also let people know when they can expect reimbursements or refunds to their scout accounts if you have them.

 

I don't take ANY paperwork. Applications go to membership. Money/checks go to treasurer. My job is to manage the boys not the back office operations.

more great points!

 

so really, @@Krampus'  directive to

Set up a time that you will be at meetings to collect dues, paperwork, etc. 

might really be more like, "Set up a time that you will be at meetings to collect dues, paperwork, etc. FROM THE SCRIBES"

Would you say that's fair?  I like it....

 

@@Krampus, question.... you mentioned that all monies/paperwork should come to me only... but then go on to exclude paperwork.  Is there any forms or paperwork you can think of, that the Treasurer should be collecting besides money and receipts?

 

We're using troopwebhost, and it looks like they have a lot of built in account and paypal functionality

So I'm thinking at this point to really stress making all payments using that.

 

then

having the scribes involved to follow up with late payments and so on.  Do I have that right?

IF someone brings cash or check, I'll give receipt, then deposit the money and record it properly in troopwebhost

 

& when folks need to be reimbursed I can do that one of three ways a) paypal transfer, b) mail check using ebanking, c) write an old fashioned check

 

seem about right?

[Krampus 696]

so really, @@Krampus'  directive to

Set up a time that you will be at meetings to collect dues, paperwork, etc. 

might really be more like, "Set up a time that you will be at meetings to collect dues, paperwork, etc. FROM THE SCRIBES"

Would you say that's fair?  I like it....

Yes, of course. However, make sure that the Instructors, Guides and PLs know how to teach the PL Scribes how to do all of that. Nothing like getting lost paperwork and having get a kid to remember what happened.

 

 

@@Krampus, question.... you mentioned that all monies/paperwork should come to me only... but then go on to exclude paperwork.  Is there any forms or paperwork you can think of, that the Treasurer should be collecting besides money and receipts?

Depends on your unit. In our unit it works like this:

 

- Camp out forms (not collected online) go to scribe who gives to event coordinator.

- Checks and money (not collected online) go to scribe who gives them to treasurer.

- Membership forms go from scribe to membership coordinator.

- Blue cards are the responsibility of the scout. They must arrive early to give/get blue cards from the MB coordinator.

 

We're using troopwebhost, and it looks like they have a lot of built in account and paypal functionality

So I'm thinking at this point to really stress making all payments using that.

Great feature. We use that on MyTroop and makes it SOOOO easy to register and pay for things like camp outs, hoodies, etc. Even have an online Troop Store.

 

having the scribes involved to follow up with late payments and so on.  Do I have that right?

IF someone brings cash or check, I'll give receipt, then deposit the money and record it properly in troopwebhost

We don't have "late payments". You pay on time or you are dropped from the event. Once people learn that they need to pay on time they start doing it.

 

& when folks need to be reimbursed I can do that one of three ways a) paypal transfer, b) mail check using ebanking, c) write an old fashioned check

We simply credit their scout account. Account updates are given monthly. If someone truly wants a direct (check) reimbursement they fill out the form, otherwise default is account credit. Seems to work find for us.

[blw2 433]

oh, this treasurer thing might actually to turn out to be kindof a good thing.

It never dawned on me that it will be a great avenue for encouraging boy lead and so on.

maybe just a bit fun even....

I can picture a scout, or worse a parent, bringing me payment for something, then I say, "no thank you. why don't you give it to your scout to give to his scribe"?

 

So In a sense the patrol scribes might be like the retail clerks in a department store

while the troop scribe is like the store manager, in that he tallies the stuff and sends up up to corporate accounting (ie the committee treasurer)

 

do most troop and patrol scribes issue receipts for payments received?

[Krampus 696]

do most troop and patrol scribes issue receipts for payments received?

 

We don't. The Scribe collect forms, take attendance, keep patrol records, etc. But that doesn't mean it is not a good idea. We just have too much going on to add that to their duties.

[Stosh 3452]

oh, this treasurer thing might actually to turn out to be kindof a good thing.

It never dawned on me that it will be a great avenue for encouraging boy lead and so on.

maybe just a bit fun even....

I can picture a scout, or worse a parent, bringing me payment for something, then I say, "no thank you. why don't you give it to your scout to give to his scribe"?

 

So In a sense the patrol scribes might be like the retail clerks in a department store

while the troop scribe is like the store manager, in that he tallies the stuff and sends up up to corporate accounting (ie the committee treasurer)

 

do most troop and patrol scribes issue receipts for payments received?

 

OMG!  He drank the Koolaid!  He's taken on a job and he thinks it's gonna be fun!  Whoda thunk that the adults could have a good time.  They're supposed to burn out, not have fun!  Where's the bugler?  Time for Taps!

 

Seriously! ain't it great to look forward to a job instead of dread doing it?

[blw2 433]

oh yes! 

but sadly... I said "just a bit of fun"

it is treasurer after all.  

I have ASM on the brain, since I'm drawn to the program side more I think.... i like doing the things that scouts do, camping, hiking, and all of that... and I enjoy getting to know and helping the scouts.  I really don't enjoy dealing with the adult drama.

[blw2 433]

I don't know if I mentioned earlier... my troop has been using troopwebhost, but they haven't really been using the accounting functions nearly to potential.

So

I've been reading up on what I can do with it.

Ended up having a conversation today with the developer, John.  Super nice guy and very responsive and helpful.... so thumbs up for his product for customer service!  Anyway, he was treasurer for his troop, and that was really the basis for the service.

 

Anyway, we discussed a few things, but I asked him ways that he or other users of his service have involved the scribes (patrol and/or troop).  Apparently this isn't very common since he'd never had the question before.

so we knocked around a few ideas

from having the scouts do the entry

to letting them log in to see the data but not edit, just so they can keep after late payments, negative balances, and so on

to my printing periodic reports for the same purpose

 

But John brought up what I thought might be a good point.... that there may be a privacy concern where a family or boy might might not want other boys to see their financial situation.

 

In the end, I'm not certain how I'll play this out.

I think for now my focus is getting up to speed with the current situation and the current troop practices

and learning the software service myself

and just think about the scribe component on the back burner.

 

oh, I did find out that we use scout "accounts", and that a fractional portion of fund raising efforts go into these virtual accounts.... and that they have allowed scouts to buy things such as uniform shirts.  mostly I think the money is used to pay for upcoming camp fees or dues.

Regardless... all of that seems like a personal benefit to me, and I'm investigating best ways to deal with this.

[Stosh 3452]

What's the privacy issue if the money all belongs to the CO?  If there seems to be a "privacy" issue involved here, then I would be calling for an audit and honesty check all the way around on how the books are cooked in that unit. 

 

If the scouts are to be given the responsibility (POR) to do a job, they should also be given the authority to do it.  Otherwise, just wear the patch for six months and don't worry about it.

 

This is the #1 reason why I NEVER take on the responsibility of being a treasurer for any organization.   I have been asked many times and I 100% decline.

[Eagledad 2795]

What's the privacy issue if the money all belongs to the CO?  If there seems to be a "privacy" issue involved here, then I would be calling for an audit and honesty check all the way around on how the books are cooked in that unit. 

 

If the scouts are to be given the responsibility (POR) to do a job, they should also be given the authority to do it.  Otherwise, just wear the patch for six months and don't worry about it.

 

This is the #1 reason why I NEVER take on the responsibility of being a treasurer for any organization.   I have been asked many times and I 100% decline.

Units can be as creative as they need to encourage scout growth within reason for POR expectations, but the BSA gives the scribes more responsibilities that just taking care of scout funds.

 

Barry

[Stosh 3452]

The topic of this thread is troop treasurer and the contact person for the boys would be the Scribe because part of that POR is handling of the troop money.  I'm sure the year end reports to the committee would be handled by the scribe as well as would any correspondence and administrative tasks such as lining up O/A elections, summer camp registration, cabin reservations, and such but those duties wouldn't fall under the conversation of the thread.

[Eagledad 2795]

If that is what the troop chooses, I'm with you. But the BSA handbooks don't mention a scribe/treasure relationship, so we have to be careful defining and/or adding to the scribes responsibilities for meeting expectations. Really the same goes for the treasure, some adults may not want the added responsibility of working with scouts.

 

Barry

[blw2 433]

What's the privacy issue if the money all belongs to the CO?  If there seems to be a "privacy" issue involved here, then I would be calling for an audit and honesty check all the way around on how the books are cooked in that unit. 

 

If the scouts are to be given the responsibility (POR) to do a job, they should also be given the authority to do it.  Otherwise, just wear the patch for six months and don't worry about it.

 

This is the #1 reason why I NEVER take on the responsibility of being a treasurer for any organization.   I have been asked many times and I 100% decline.

my take on the privacy thing is only awareness

let's say little Jimmy's dad just got laid off and the money is tight.  They seem to always be running a negative balance.  They might not want other kids to know that things are tight

Or worse yet, Jimmy's family works out a scholarship program with the committee.  Jimmy probably wouldn't want his buddies to know about it.

 

If that is what the troop chooses, I'm with you. But the BSA handbooks don't mention a scribe/treasure relationship, so we have to be careful defining and/or adding to the scribes responsibilities for meeting expectations. Really the same goes for the treasure, some adults may not want the added responsibility of working with scouts.

 

Barry

Somewhere I think it does mention a treasurer relationship.  If memory serves, doesn't it say something about the scribe dealing with the financial member of the committee.  I don't know, maybe I read that in the troop's POR election forms and it wasn't official.

I'm still in the learning stage here with this job, but even if it doesn't it would make sense I think that they would need to.  If they are collecting dues they would need to hand them off to the treasurer somehow.

But maybe you're onto something that it's only a very limited relationship at the most.

I guess I've got another bullet point to dig deeper into here...

[Stosh 3452]

I would think that it is important that if Little Johnny is having financial difficulty in the troop, can't afford summer camp, doesn't go on activities for lack of funds, etc. and the PL doesn't know about it because of privacy issues, how can he take care of his boys?  Or is this a case where the adults jump in and take over the options for Little Johnny?

 

I guess it all depends on how much trust one puts in their youth leadership.  My PL's are fully aware of what boys are on meds, which ones wet the bed, and which ones have medical allergies.  These boys when they take on POR's in my troop are real leaders, not paper, in-theory, leaders.  My boys learn discretion and confidentiality as part of their leadership training.  If a boy is having financial difficulty, no big deal, some have it tougher than the rest, but that must means everyone might need to pull more than just their weight so that their buddies get to go along on these trips.

 

I've never had a problem with this, the boys tend to step up and are less concerned about these things than the knee-jerk adults.  After all what's the sense in a boy carrying an epi pen and HIPAA rules won't allow anyone else to know?  I want my PL's to know this because the odds of the PL being with the boy is better than me being with him.

 

Confidentiality is just a cover-up for adult control.  After all if the boys are responsible (POR) for running the patrols, they had better know what's going on with their boys.  Otherwise, if they can't take care of them, I'd say just go back to adult-led troop-method and keep all the boys in the dark and don't worry about excuses.

Edited February 7, 2016 by Stosh

[blw2 433]

yeah, I suppose so Stosh....As always old wise one

Really, I can picture this from both perspectives.  Probably true that often the embarrassment is more in the adult side, but that is still a valid concern I think.

My gut tells me that generally your view points about this are spot on, but at the same time there will probably be a case by case consideration to make too.

 

OK, here's another line of open questions to the group here, that came to mind:

1) how many different folks in your troop have check books and write checks?

2) do you bother with petty cash accounts, or do you just rely on reimbursements?

3) do you use one or more debit cards tied to your troop checking account?

      ....and if so, who has them?

 

 

Here's my line of thinking:

In my research, I'm finding lots of references to "petty cash".  To me this seems a bit old school.  Putting myself into the shoes of another leader... say and ASM that is supervising a grocery shopping trip before or during a camp out.  Instead of chasing down the treasurer to sign out some cash, I would much rather just spend my own money (or credit card) and then submit the receipt for reimbursement.... assuming of course that I could count on a timely check from the treasurer.

Then taking this a step further, I can see some appeal to letting some key folks hold a debit card for convenience sake....

I can also imagine other folks wanting to hold a checkbook.  I know that it's common and wise practice to have several signers on the bank account, for backup purposes

it seems like any of these ideas increase the likelihood for errors and problems, such as lost receipts, or situations where they  forge t to tell me as treasurer to balance it out..... but it's of course necessary and easy enough to deal with so this isn't a concern at all, only an observation.

SO, these questions are only curiosity about how other units are doing it, not so much born out of concern.

[qwazse 4367]

Our most recent configuration:

1) one checkbook, one person can issue them. (We do have the requisite back-up signers. But they don't carry a checkbook.)

2) No petty cash unless it's relevant to the activity. (E.g., patrols get some cash because their hike takes them by a general store, where they will reprovision.)

3) no debit cards. Everyone is fine putting stuff on their personal charge and turning in receipts for reimbursement.

 

This demands that the treasurer be available for folks on a regular basis. Monthly reports of receipts, expenditures, are critical for committee minutes. And motions for expenditures should be easily identifyable in the minutes for good auditing. (e.g., a good ledger entry would be: 2/15/'16 $200 to XYZ Council, per January meeting, see minutes, motion #3.) Actual audits are extremely rare, our treasurer audited herself better than we ever would, but she insisted having related documentation and clear motions befor she drafted a check.