Troop Elections

[pargolf44067]

We had troop elections last night for the first time since I have come back as SM.  The current SPL was not running again, so I let him handle the elections last night, and he did a pretty good job. Those running for SPL had to give a brief speech explaining why they wanted to be SPL and what things they would do as SPL and answer any questions that the boys had.  Just to be clear, I did not talk to any of the boys beforehand about where I thought the program could be improved or how we might do it as a group.

 

As each of the boys came up, they all noted that the boy leaders needed to have better planning meetings without the whole troop present. They talked about how they wanted to go to different campgrounds instead of going to the same ones over and over again.  They talked about how they were going to make sure all the people in positions of responsibility were going to be held accountable unlike they currently are.  One boy even noted that he had been in the troop to see what it was like before (when he was a young scout) and saw what it had become and that he could use his NYLT training to help with that. He even used the "Start, Stop, Continue" method in his speech.  They talked about how they were going to use patrols like we used to.  All of these are things that I have noticed and felt like we needed to do.  

 

The point is the boys themselves noticed the issues with the troop and want to resolve them.  I am really looking forward to working with this group of boy leaders.  I think that we are headed on the right track for the troop, and it isn't me telling or suggesting how we move forward, it is the boys.

 

Should be a fun year!

 

 

[Eagledad]

Yah, that is pretty impressive. I look forward to future post.

 

Barry

[RememberSchiff]

...

They talked about how they were going to make sure all the people in positions of responsibility were going to be held accountable unlike they currently are.

 

The point is the boys themselves noticed the issues with the troop and want to resolve them.  I am really looking forward to working with this group of boy leaders.  I think that we are headed on the right track for the troop, and it isn't me telling or suggesting how we move forward, it is the boys.

 

Should be a fun year!

 

Lets hope they resolve issues fairly when holding their fellow scouts accountable.

[blw2]

"Start, Stop, Continue" method?

[blw2]

I'm curious... is there a set frequency to how often the boys hold their elections?

[Gone]

"Start, Stop, Continue" method?

 

Method they teach at NYLT.

 

I'm curious... is there a set frequency to how often the boys hold their elections?

 

Depends on your unit. I have seen small units do it annually or semi-annually, larger units do it quarterly. 

[pargolf44067]

Method they teach at NYLT.

 

 

Depends on your unit. I have seen small units do it annually or semi-annually, larger units do it quarterly. 

Thanks @ for clarifying the method.  I should have explained it in my OP.  We have held ours either annually or semi-annually depending on the size of the troop at the time.

 

 

 

Lets hope they resolve issues fairly when holding their fellow scouts accountable.

 

Right now, the boys haven't been held accountable at all for their responsibilities.  I don't think that they are looking to start firing people.  Before we held the elections, we let the boys know what the duties for all the positions were and that we (both the SPL/ASPLs with my assistance) were definitely going to be holding them accountable.

[Stosh]

My elections are on an as needed basis.  PL leaves, new PL is elected.  PL isn't doing the job, a new PL is elected.  SPL steps into a different role, a new SPL is elected.  etc.

 

PL can serve as long as they wish and are doing the job.  Someone needs a POR for advancement?  Challenge a PL to an election or pick a POR that no one is currently serving in.

 

Boy led means I as SM can't tell a PL he can't be a PL.  If the boys want him as a PL, he stays a PL as long as he wishes.

 

One caveat, when I had an SPL (I only have one patrol of boys now), he was elected by the PL's.  If he's going to be their support person, they better have the say so in who that is.  An SPL elected by everyone in the troop elects them for a far different reason than support of the PL's and when things go awry, then they dump on the SPL.... Kind of a no win for SPL's.  When we went to a 4th patrol in my former unit, the PL's didn't want to step into that position so they elected one of the APL's, the one that was working the hardest for his PL.  After all, if he could do well with one PL, then working hard for 4 PL's wasn't going to be a stretch.  The PL's were please in that process..

Edited June 11, 2015 by Stosh

[blw2]

that seems logical to me @@Stosh... let the boys drive it

I was talking to our CO's SM a while back about collecting dues and such.  I really have no idea how it came up, but it was something about how the adult committee was involved.

He said something about the fact that the boys were in their POR for such a short time due to the set election frequency, that the collections cycle wouldn't work....

struck me a odd on several levels, 

    adult involvement where a boy would do....

    got the feeling that adults set the election frequency, but i could have been wrong on that

but I let it go at the time and didn't ask further....

[blw2]

@@pargolf44067, thanks for the clarification!

[qwazse]

...

He said something about the fact that the boys were in their POR for such a short time due to the set election frequency, that the collections cycle wouldn't work....

struck me a odd on several levels, 

....

Things often don't make sense looking in from the outside. Chances are there was a decision to adjust things for a particular problem at the time. Personally, I don't see how "collections" and "elections" are linked at all. But this downstream effect was probably one the adults or boys (there's really no telling who) were willing to put up with.

 

Our troop was down to one patrol and the boys insisted on having Son #2 as SPL, their persistent logic, "He's leading, he's a senior, and we're a patrol." Nothing I said could disavow them of that notion.

 

The PLC should be free to eventually ask the question "Should do things differently?"

[blw2]

Things often don't make sense looking in from the outside. Chances are there was a decision to adjust things for a particular problem at the time. Personally, I don't see how "collections" and "elections" are linked at all. But this downstream effect was probably one the adults or boys (there's really no telling who) were willing to put up with.

 

.....

that's exactly why I didn't really pursue it.....

I realize that there's a bigger picture, and it makes sense from some perspective.... even if it's historic..... and that it must be working, so it just becomes an observation....nothing more.

 

But my bigger picture reason to even notice the comment was that I'm always just trying to get a read.... from the outside.... of how well they are progressing through their desired transition to boy led.

[Eagledad]

Right now, the boys haven't been held accountable at all for their responsibilities.  I don't think that they are looking to start firing people.  Before we held the elections, we let the boys know what the duties for all the positions were and that we (both the SPL/ASPLs with my assistance) were definitely going to be holding them accountable.

This takes a little time because it works best when the scouts hold each other accountable. And while they are talking a big story now, they will find that holding their best friend accountable isn't always as easy as that sounds. I was just saying another thread that one reason scouting units struggle at the adult level is because adults don't hold each other accountable. They don't want to be a that confrontational bad guy. 

 

So encourage all the scouts to hold everyone accountable. For example, I remember a scout who cut his foot pretty bad because he ran through camp barefooted, which is against troop policy. This happened right in front of the SPL, but when I asked who else saw him run through camp and didn't say anything, half the troop raise their hand. So I held all those scouts accountable and gave them a harsher SM conference because they didn't stop their fellow scout from breaking policy and having to go to the emergency room as a result.

 

I worked with every PLC to support each other and work as a team as they worked with the scouts. If a senior leader is having difficulty with an unruly scout, another scout nearby should quietly walk over to help the first scout instead of waiting until the situation escalates to yelling. I wanted the PLC to set an example of everyone taking responsibility for each others behavior and not be afraid to say something. 

 

And it works, in a couple years the troop will have very few misbehaviors because the scouts have learned how to nip them in the bud. They don't even realize they are doing it. "Hey Bob, quit running and get some shoes on before you get hurt". 

 

As an adult, you will find that boys this age actually hate chaos and lazyness of others, but they don't feel they have permission to hold those scouts accountable. Up to this point in their lives, they have been taught to hand these matters to adults. Now you have to give those scouts permission to act adult and hold their fellow scouts up to the expectations of the patrol or troop. They want that responsibility, they just need to be shown that they have permission.

 

As our troop got bigger, we had less misbehavior and accountability issues because the scouts just got better at doing it themselves.

 

Once you start seeing it come together, you find yourself loving this scouting stuff. It really works.

 

Barry

[Gone]

that seems logical to me @@Stosh... let the boys drive it

 

I agree the boys should drive it, however, in a larger troop it is difficult enough for the big picture to be seen by an adult, let alone the boys.

 

The SM's job is to work with the SPL and PLs to show them that big picture: That the demand for leadership positions for rank advancement might outpace the open positions, thus requiring a more predictable election cycle. 

[Stosh]

I agree the boys should drive it, however, in a larger troop it is difficult enough for the big picture to be seen by an adult, let alone the boys.

 

The SM's job is to work with the SPL and PLs to show them that big picture: That the demand for leadership positions for rank advancement might outpace the open positions, thus requiring a more predictable election cycle. 

 

@, and the demand for POR rank advancement may increase the quality of leadership through competition for those positions.  After all, the really creative scout can learn to play the bugle and solve his problem for POR rank advancement.  

 

One also has to remember that there can be more than one ASPL, more than one Historian, and if one looks closely, POR's rank requirements can be filled in with special projects approved by the SM.  One has to be able to start looking outside the limits of election terms and go with the best regardless of time.

 

By the way, the scouts that do the special projects for POR's have a tendency to do some really great Eagle projects when the time comes along.  They have already done a couple pre-projects before the big show.