SM406 10 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Dsteele, Our troop was originally charted in 1915 as Troop1, and with all of the merging of districts and Councils over the years our troop number has been changed to 406. My question is can a troops number be changed at the request of the chartering organization? And can there be a Troop 1 anymore? (Understanding that Woodbadge likes to use troop one in its courses). Of course I welcome anyones input. SM406 Link to post Share on other sites
CubsRgr8 10 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 I've heard that unit numbers are assigned to charter organizations, who may choose to release them if the unit doesn't recharter. How unit numbers are handled when a CO no longer cares or exists is a good trivia question. Link to post Share on other sites
FScouter 24 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Another point about unit numbers: In our council, a pack and a troop in the same geographical area are assigned the same unit number. This causes confusion in figuring out whether Joe Scouter in unit 666 is a Cub leader or a Boy Scout leader. With four digits to work with we have up to 9,999 possible unit numbers. Why duplicate unit numbers in the same council??? Link to post Share on other sites
acco40 95 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 In our District, COs that charter both Packs and Troops usually use the same number (P123, T123). Crews are the exception. Link to post Share on other sites
dsteele 20 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Can a unit number be changed at the request of the chartering organization? It's a good question and I'm still trying to research the answer. I put my copies of the Rules stuff somewhere and can't find it at the moment. Can there be a Troop 1 anymore? The answer to that is yes there can, is and are. I do have an example I personally experienced of a chartered organization requesting the number assigned to their unit changed. It was done successfully. Here's the story. I worked with a Pentecostal Temple to help them start a Troop. When I turned in the paperwork, I assigned them the number 702. When the chartered organization found out about the number 702, they requested it to be changed to just about any other number. It seems there was a bar in town called the 702. The Pentecostal folks wanted no association with that number. So the troop became 705. All this happened quickly and not one uniform had yet been purchased, no troop flag to re-do, no troop trailer to re-stencil, etc. It seems there is a great deal of leeway in assinging unit numbers to chartered organizations. In the council where I grew up, the first number of the three digit system they use is the number of the district. This worked out well for things like phone calls to the office, OA and Council activities, etc. By knowing a unit number, you knew which district the person was from. When you called the office, you were asked your unit number and quickly sent to the right DE. The council where I started the profession took that one a step further. The district number is the second digit in their four-digit system. The first number is the program code. So when someone called the office and said they were from pack 3701, the staff knew it was someone from a Cub Scout Pack in the Chippewa district. If they were from 705, the staff knew it was a troop -- Boy Scout troops there use 3 digits. Then, to confuse me further, I started as Field Director in a council that had no real system of assigning numbers other than to avoid assigning one already in use. I liked the system mentioned above and told the Scout Executive I wanted to work with the council executive committee to change it. He quickly pointed out to me that my idea would require every unit to buy new numbers, change their unit flags, and do things like change the way a unit remembers its history as in SM406's post . . . we used to be Troop 1. I didn't want to be responsible for that much grief to so many people just for a more convenient way to communicate which program and geographic area you're from. I did have to sigh and fondly remember working where unit numbers make sense -- today when I got a popcorn order from 555 and didn't know whether it was pack or troop because both are selling. If the unit number had been 3555 it would have been so clear. Turns out it was pack 555, but the popcorn chair is new to Scouting and to her everything is still a troop. Had to ask several questions when I got her on the phone to clear it up. Sigh . . . DS Link to post Share on other sites
evmori 11 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 I am a leader in Troop 1. There are quite a few Troop 1's throughout the USA. On our Troop's web site, there is a page that lists the Troop 1's on the web. Check it out! http://www.bsa.net/pa/t1 Ed Mori 1 Peter 4:10 Link to post Share on other sites
SMT376Richmond KY 10 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 On our last day at wood badge we were informed we were no longer in Troop 1 (sigh). Then when I recieved my beads and pink (yes it's pink!)neckerchief wihtout the Troop number on it I felt sad. Being in Troop 1 is unique and easy to remember. Also you can say "we're No. 1" and be correct, both actually and politically. Link to post Share on other sites
Fat Old Guy 11 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 "On our last day at wood badge we were informed we were no longer in Troop 1 (sigh)" Many years ago, I ran across a Scouter who was wearing a "1" but the rest of his troop had another number. I asked about it and he said that all Wood Badge graduates could wear "1". Was he giving me bad gouge? Link to post Share on other sites
dsteele 20 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Yes. DS Link to post Share on other sites
dancinfox 10 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 I am in DS's old council that uses the four and three diget numbering system. Twice I've been able to change a pack's unit number to match the troops ie: 3609 and 609, 3631 and 631. We just did it a recharter and the council processed it. dancin Link to post Share on other sites
hops_scout 9 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Our pack used to be totally different than our troop, but they have since split into two packs. The newer one became the same as the troop. Link to post Share on other sites
dsteele 20 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 Thanks for the reminder, Dancin'. I slapped my forhead when I read it. I remember now. DS Link to post Share on other sites
FScouter 24 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 Why would a pack want the same number as a troop? And why would the council allow two units to use the same number? Link to post Share on other sites
Bob White 20 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 It is quite common for units chatered to the same charter organization to have the same number. BW Link to post Share on other sites
dsteele 20 Posted November 7, 2003 Share Posted November 7, 2003 A pack and troop chartered to the same organization may well want the same number for a variety of reasons: They don't have buy new numbers for their uniforms when they transition. It keeps the relationship easy for parents to understand Gives the boys in all programs a sense of unity with each other in spite of age and program differences. It's tough enough to get un-involved parents to remember their son's unit number, why make them try to learn a new one when a boy becomes a Boy Scout or Boy Scout becomes a Venturer. Downside -- confuses the heck out of the office and district people when the numbers are the same. DS Link to post Share on other sites
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