Basementdweller Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 What are your thoughts about Parents or Scouters having either their own ISA accounts or using their sons to pay for scouting activities......Now I am talking specifically about unit fundraising dollars being placed in them.....Not deposits they have made by them or on their behalf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twocubdad Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 Knowing a little about your troop's economic situation, I suppose if parents need help with the cost of volunteering, I would be okay with it. But I wouldn't want the adults to compete with the Scouts for sales or take a share of the money the troop earns as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old_Guy Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 My sons troop has ISA account for the Scouts, while its difficult to know your balance at a moments notice. The account gives my son the chance to pay for targets and ammunition at Scout Camp this year. And of course, other Scout related expenses. Yes, the Scouts parent(s) has an account as well. There again, money is used for their Scout or a Scouting activity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted June 12, 2013 Author Share Posted June 12, 2013 Knowing a little about your troop's economic situation, I suppose if parents need help with the cost of volunteering, I would be okay with it. But I wouldn't want the adults to compete with the Scouts for sales or take a share of the money the troop earns as a whole.How about parents who just want to attend the premium events.....such as canoeing, spelunking.........The parent did not help in the sale beyond dropping the scout off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwazse Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 Knowing a little about your troop's economic situation, I suppose if parents need help with the cost of volunteering, I would be okay with it. But I wouldn't want the adults to compete with the Scouts for sales or take a share of the money the troop earns as a whole.BD, in your position, I'd have the CC or treasurer ask the boy if he's okay with paying for his mom/dad out of his account. Make sure the boy knows how much will be left over in the account for his other activities. One time we had a Seabase trip with limited spots and too many parents wanting to fill them. We required all parents who wanted to participate to take IOLS. That thinned the herd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted June 12, 2013 Author Share Posted June 12, 2013 Knowing a little about your troop's economic situation, I suppose if parents need help with the cost of volunteering, I would be okay with it. But I wouldn't want the adults to compete with the Scouts for sales or take a share of the money the troop earns as a whole.I am not out to thin the herd. But it just doesn't seem proper to me for the parents to use a scouts fundraising money to attend scout events...... My example....Webelos resident camp the Scout has $500 in his account initially only he was going. Dad asks how much is in his account.....Now mom and dad are both going on the boys fundraising efforts. ......the only reason the sibs weren't going was they are not permited by the camp..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScouterWamp Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 Personally, I like the ISA in a Troop. As for Scouter Accounts, this is the first I have heard of this theory. I would have to support accounts for any person who participates in Troop activities, especially for the SM/ ASMs (but we also have all of our SM/ ASMs wear a patrol patch and use the same exact equipment as the Scouts and camp and interact as a Patrol, to set the example). I do not believe a parent should use a Scout's account for participation in activities (the Scout earned the money, let the Scout reap the benefits ... allowing parents to use the account, even with Scout permission, doesn't set a good example for the Scouts that you have to earn your own way). Along the same line, I do like qwazse's solution of having every participant attend IOLS. For now, I tried to require every participant to attend position specific training prior to participating in Troop activities (didn't work ... overruled by the TCC). It would be good to set standards, and set the example for the Scouts ... our most important role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred johnson Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 I don't think this is as clear cut. Ultimately, the parents pay either way. Ya pay for this event or for the next event. In my experience, the parents are often the driving force in fundraisers. Plus if there is no money in the scout account, the parent pays. I just don't see the big deal and I definitely do not see it as my place to step into family politics. All scout accounts within the same family IMHO can be used by any family member. I'll leave it up to the family to fight their own battles internally. Now what I've seen that I really don't like it is when troop $$$ are used to reduce the cost of adult camping. SM? Not preferred, but okay. One or two other leaders. Maybe. Pay for gas for the pulling the trailer, debatable. Ya need two leaders on a camp out and most leaders I know are willing to pay to camp. My clear line of wrong is any $$$ in troop account (not scout account) going to pay for parent camping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twocubdad Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 I could be convinced it's okay in fairly narrow circumstances, but this is getting outside those circumstances. First of all, why the heck are mom and dad both going to WRC? Are they den leaders? One of the purposes of WRC is for the boys to go to camp with their den and leaders (as they will in Boy Scouts next year), NOT cub family camping. Secondly, I find it distasteful at minimum for the parents to spend money on themselves out of their son's account. But it would be difficult to say no without knowing all the policies you have for the accounts. Knowing a little about the family's financial situation may make a difference, too. That said, I can also imagine a circumstance where the a crew raises money to send the entire crew to Philmont. Leaders pay the same airfare and fees as the boys, and God knows they put in the same (or more) hours of prep and fundraising time. In that case it seems reasonable that the crew money goes toward paying for the entire crew's expenses, adults included. But that's very specific, limited circumstance. Yours, BD, is more of an open-ended opportunity for the parents to raid the cookie jar. This why I don't like scout accounts. Seems like there is always one more way folks want to spend the money. By the way, I also have an issue with parents who want to go on the "fun" trips but are too busy to help with routine campouts. But I'm not sure you can fix that via the use of SA money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwazse Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 Knowing a little about your troop's economic situation, I suppose if parents need help with the cost of volunteering, I would be okay with it. But I wouldn't want the adults to compete with the Scouts for sales or take a share of the money the troop earns as a whole.So this is a pack event? I'd be more inclined to accept the family pooling all resources together to go. I would try to get into their heads that you find this unusual and that those ISA funds now won't be available for other things they boy may want (e.g., new uniform, gear after crossover, etc ...), but leave it as their call. (Again, if the CC or Treasure should take this communication on for you. You have bigger fish to fry with camp coming up.) It would be nice if these are the kinds of parents who are there for the entire pack when they are there, but sometimes you don't know that until you have boots on the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScouterWamp Posted June 12, 2013 Share Posted June 12, 2013 The WRC does bring a new light to the situation. I'm not sure about ISA for Cub Scouts. More times than not, Cub Scouts cannot really earn the money themselves, as Fred mentioned, it is usually the parents. Fundraising should go to the entire Pack (offset the cost of activities for all involved???). Our Pack has a pay-as-you-go program, subsidized by the different fund-raisers. 2Cub is right .... parents should start cutting the cord with parents at this point ... before they become too much of helicopter parents which cause nightmares for SMs. However, Bottom Line, if the money has been provided to the Scout, for his Scouting "career," then that is where the money should go (uniform, gear, cross-over, etc). Provide you opinion/ input to the Committee, and let them address the issue with the parents. Especially with such a young Scout, he needs to see the money he has "earned" goes to benefit him (not "taken" by his parents). A Webelos is too young to fully comprehend the idea of "transferring" money to someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted June 13, 2013 Author Share Posted June 13, 2013 Knowing a little about your troop's economic situation, I suppose if parents need help with the cost of volunteering, I would be okay with it. But I wouldn't want the adults to compete with the Scouts for sales or take a share of the money the troop earns as a whole.cough cough..... The parents are looking for a free vacation.... My beef is that the webelo wants to go to Philmont and the Jamboree when he crosses over.... mom and dad removing $300 to take a vacation just rubs me wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted June 13, 2013 Author Share Posted June 13, 2013 I could be convinced it's okay in fairly narrow circumstances, but this is getting outside those circumstances. First of all, why the heck are mom and dad both going to WRC? Are they den leaders? One of the purposes of WRC is for the boys to go to camp with their den and leaders (as they will in Boy Scouts next year), NOT cub family camping. Secondly, I find it distasteful at minimum for the parents to spend money on themselves out of their son's account. But it would be difficult to say no without knowing all the policies you have for the accounts. Knowing a little about the family's financial situation may make a difference, too. That said, I can also imagine a circumstance where the a crew raises money to send the entire crew to Philmont. Leaders pay the same airfare and fees as the boys, and God knows they put in the same (or more) hours of prep and fundraising time. In that case it seems reasonable that the crew money goes toward paying for the entire crew's expenses, adults included. But that's very specific, limited circumstance. Yours, BD, is more of an open-ended opportunity for the parents to raid the cookie jar. This why I don't like scout accounts. Seems like there is always one more way folks want to spend the money. By the way, I also have an issue with parents who want to go on the "fun" trips but are too busy to help with routine campouts. But I'm not sure you can fix that via the use of SA money. They are not den leaders or even leaders in the Pack.....What happened they saw the camp flyer that invited parents along too.... It rubs me wrong......I work to hard on the fundraisers so the boys can have a program and be able to attend camps... Then Mom and Dad are blowing this boys money so they can have a free vacation..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted June 13, 2013 Share Posted June 13, 2013 I have always been one that believes people donate money to a scout troop to support the scout troop, not individuals within it. I find the individual accounts unethical, but that's my personal opinion. An organization that takes in money for the "cause" only to spend it on individual interests just doesn't sit well with me. So then, when I see posts like these, it only goes to show how far such abuses can be carried. A Little White Lie is to a lessor extent the same as perjury. They are both lies wearing different hats. So if one looks at it from that perspective, if people give money to a troop that turns around and gives it to an individual scout, how is that any different than the scout turning it around and giving it to his parents? I'm thinking the case could then be made that the money should go to a new fishing boat for dad so he can take his scout son and his buddies out fishing every now and then. Stosh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted June 13, 2013 Author Share Posted June 13, 2013 Stosh..... We use the send me to camp message.........No lie no deception When we were buying tents.....We say exactly that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now