Let's talk tents

[scoutldr]

Coleman advertises the "Weathertec" system "guaranteed to keep you dry". Anyone have any experience with these? I find the hardest thing to do is convince kids not to let anything touch the inside of the tent, or the water will wick right through. We can't afford $200-400 each for the high-end stuff.

[SR540Beaver]

scoutldr,

 

My leaky tent was a new Coleman Outdoorsman tent. Similar in design to the Eureka Timberline. The tent itself held up great in a couple of pretty rugged rain storms. We are talking rain blowing sideways. As stated before, the leak was where the stake tabs were sewn to the bathtub floor. If I'd followed Coleman's instructions and actually sealed those seams, I believe I would have stayed high and dry. Fortunately I was using a Coleman inflatible mattress that is 4 inches thick due to a bad back. I still stayed dry since the top side of the tent didn't leak. Everything on the floor got soaked though.

 

[LauraT7]

I was taught to ALWAYS use a groundcloth or 'footprint' which is the newer term tent manufacturer's are using for a groundcloth cut to fit the tents exactly.

 

The expensive backpacking tents sell a 'footprint' seperately so that you can pitch the fly and the footprint, or the whole two-layer system. the footprints they sell for specific tents are nicely trimmed and stitched around the edges to be 1" smaller than the tent floor - some have grommets or tabs so you can stake them down with the tent.

 

the easy way is to buy the biggest plastic rip-stop tarp from K-mart or farm and fleet and cut your own. the rip-stop will not ravel - but you can stitch the edges if you really want.

 

i do feel, in addition to extra waterproofing, they protect the tent floor from some wear, sticks, sharp stones, etc. - and I'd rather scrub mud and moldy leaves off a tarp, than off the tent floor or fold the mess up in the tent and clean it up later. for that reason, on my personal tent - i always fold up the footprint separate from the tent itself.

 

Our troop has a method of folding the tents up IN the groundcloths - which makes sense to keep them dry in a canoe - but which gets mess all over the tent walls when they are folded up wet. More to clean up when we get home.

 

I agree with Mark - the boys can and do learn to take care of equipment - including tents. But it does take some time for it to sink in - mistakes are made, & not everyone goes on every campout - there is a learning curve. which is why our boys decided that IF they get the new, fancy backpacking tents - only the venture patrol will use them on regular campouts, if needed. Because they HAVE already shown they know how to treat tents well. also - kind of an incentive for the new boys to learn and GO on the trips that utilize the newer tents.

 

It has also been suggested that we buy enough tents for MOST of the troop, and allow the older boys to bring and use their own. I can see good reasons for this from a number of angles. A boy who has his own tent is understandably proud of it and WILL do his best to take care of it. Bringing their own tents gives everyone a chance to see and experience different types of tents and get exposure to what they like and how they work. Using privately owned tents lets us use troop money for other equipment.

 

One tip on 'sealing' the seams - use the spray on can of waterproofing spray for single-layers of tent fabric - but for floor seams or stressed seams (corners, ridges) use the heavier stick waterproofing. it looks like an elmer's glue stick (like used in school) and is a waxy-type substance you rub in. it may be a little sticky at first, but it will dry, and will do a better job of sealing those needle holes than the spray in a thick seam.

 

 

 

[eisely]

Some of my post has been said before, but those points are worth repeating.

 

The first consideration in selecting tentage is the anticipated use and the environment in which you anticipate operating.

 

My personal preference would be for a two person, three season, dome style tent, such as the REI Half Dome which I use.

 

One consideration in the size of the tent that was not mentioned is that large tents often limit your selection of tent sites, even in an improved campground. Even if your unit is not into serious backpacking right now, sticking with two person tents gives you more flexibility, and it is easier to place tents among trees and large rocks.

 

Tall tents that people can stand up in are also more vulnerable to the wind. I prefer a lower profile tent, although my Half Dome is not a low profile tent. I would not consider standing room to be a valid criterion for selection.

 

Getting a heavier tent with more and stronger poles, suitable for winter camping in tough conditions, means you will be carrying more weight than you need most of the time.

 

As noted, dome tents tend to do better in the wind, but there is nothing wrong with A frame tents. I also have a "tunnel" style tent that, in the long run, has proven less than satisfactory.

 

Tub construction and a good rain fly, as mentioned are also important.

 

The most effective ground cloth is to get some relatively thick plastic and cut your own to fit the footprint of your ten. Minimizes weight and cost.

[silver-shark]

kwc57

 

The key to the groundcloth system that I mentioned is in the rolling under of it. When you do this you have created a lip with the groundcloth roughly 3 inches tall. When I spoke of just barely exposed, the tent wall actually comes down and overlaps this lip.

 

With this system, all water moving toward the tent is forced to go under the groundcloth. It cannot go over the groundcloth (unless you have a small stream moving toward you), which tends to happen when water runs under the tent that has a flat groundcloth cut to the footprint of the tent or just smaller. In that case the water can go over or under it.

[dan]

Another thing to consider is to keep buying the same kind of tent year after year, this way when you "retire a tent" you can save the good parts poles, rain flys and so on. These can be used to fix other tents needing replacment parts.

[dan]

Another thing to consider is to keep buying the same kind of tent year after year, this way when you "retire a tent" you can save the good parts poles, rain flys and so on. These can be used to fix other tents needing replacment parts.

[eagle90]

Having just returned from a week at Summer Camp and two horrendous rainstorms, I also swear by the Eureka Timberline Outfitters. I stayed high and dry!

 

[silver-shark]

Great point Dan, but you reminded me of a problem that our troop had with this.

 

A few years ago the tents were coming down in a pretty hard rain and rather than rolling them up tightly and all together, all of the poles were placed into a plastic container, and the tents were loosely rolled and placed in another.

 

Afterwords, they were set up to dry out in the SMs driveway with the rainflys simply laid out in the grass, not attached so that the tents would dry faster.

 

When they dried, various parts were placed together with a tent and rainfly then rolled up as normal.

 

Upon arriving at the next campout and erecting the tents, they found that several of the rainflys didn't fit. They were either way too loose or way too tight. After awhile someone compared the outrigger poles that hold the flys and found that there were 2 different lengths and 2 methods of their attachment. Some of these were tents manufactured in different years and bought as replacements.

 

After this got all straightened out, all pieces were marked with the tent number so that if they ever got mixed up again, they could be put back together correctly.

[acco40]

Somewhat related ...

 

After coming home from a very wet camping trip my wife and boys set up the tents and ground cloth outside in my backyard on the next sunny day (I was at work) to dry. The ground cloth we use is clear plastic sheeting. It only took about one hour on the grass and the sun shone through the clear plastic "cooking" the grass underneath (greenhouse effect). When I got home, I had two 10' x 10' brown patches in my yard. Live and learn.

[BSA470Firstaider]

First, let me just say that between being a den chief for webelos dens and working at camp that coleman tend to leak and are more expensive and lesser quality than a lot of others. I suggest REI (www.rei.com) as someone said earlier, or eureka or llbean.

 

If you have never been to there site www.campmor.com sells all kinds of outdoor gear all brands at lower prices. I suggest you request a catalog and look at it I've bought most of my stuff from them

 

-Jefff

[ozemu]

Fair question and I offer these alternatives. Mind you the choice is dependant on your program aims, environment and funds.

 

Domes are generally simple, quick and remove you from the insects etc effectively.

 

We use in summer big heavy canvass A frame tents with three wooden poles about 5 yards long. It takes some skill and two strong square lashings (?) to get them up and working well. They are then good looking, airy (includes airing the ground when all sides are rolled up and gear stacked to the side), strong when rigged with storm guys and an object of much pride. They also sleep 4-6 Scouts which means one or two fit a Patrol complete. Noise at night is only an issue with the new Scouts. The others are over it after one or two camps. No one is lonely for long in our Patrols. The first few times the Scouts erected them it took at least 45 minutes. Last camp it took 7 minutes to get up and 2 1/2 to pull down.

 

In winter (mild by your standards) we hike and use Durarig tarps that are 8 x 10 I think. Sleeps two or three if needed. Requires 2 trees (or sticks) several strings and 4 pegs (6 is better). It is very open to the elemenmts but with some engineering and testing can be reasonably warm and not having a floor sometimes mine has shrubs and rocks inside (min impact). They are also much lighter and more compact than most domes of the same capacity (especially when we use local poles and pegs - another skill that can be LNT). I would prefer a lighter tarp still but they are too expensive for us at present.

 

Both require insect repellant or mesh and a checking of the gear inside for snakes if we are away for a while. Both need some expertise to get them working well. Both are strong and last well. The first is very expensive and the tarp is cheap.

 

We use them because they are different, they require the exercise (and learning) of skills, they are close to nature and the Scouts love them. They turn their noses up at domes generally unless we expect late camp arrival or very cold weather when the simplicity of domes is important.

 

Our program is designed to create community, initiative, resilience and ecological understanding and this dictates our choice in tents more than other things.

[Eagledad]

>>they require the exercise (and learning) of skills, they are close to nature and the Scouts love them.

[SR540Beaver]

One note on low profile vs tall profile tents. When you are overweight, middle aged and 6'2", getting dressed (or doing just about anything) is a near impossibility in a low profile tent.

[Fat Old Guy]

I'm not much on camping, prefering to stay in a hotel with 24 hr. room service. However, since my son has gotten involved with Scouts, I've bought three tents.

 

We seem to always camp in heavy downpours so I have some experience with my tents and water.

 

The first tent was a $30 dome tent from Wal-Mart and it didn't leak but it didn't have any electrical outlets.

 

The next tent I bought for backpacking at Sports Autority for $20. It is a 6'x6' dome tent (I sleep diagonally). The rain fly was too small so I use disposable drop cloth ($.93) as a rain fly. This one has survived the hardest winds that I've seen outside of a hurricane but it did take on about a quart of water that ran to the lowest corner of the tent.

 

My latest tent is a Coleman Sundome, 9'x9' tent. Like the cheap tents, it hasn't leaked. The big difference is that it is easier to set up and the zippers work better.

 

By the way, I still haven't gotten around to sealing the seams.