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BPwannabe@137

Homosexuals in Scouting

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JohnDaigler writes: >>Morally Pure" is pretty high standard!

Do we uninvite "cohabiting" Scout Leaders?? > I see no reason to think that any particular gay man is more likely to molest my son than to think that any particular heterosexual man is likely to molest my daughter.>Your sexual orientation is an incredibly huge deciding factor in how 'moral' you are. Could someone show me any evidence, outside the Bible, Koran, or any other religous text, that proves that homosexuals are more likely to commit acts of molestation and/or other acts of crime?

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Z writes:

>>However, one argument I have never accepted is that gays place the youth in any sort of risk.

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A perversion? Maybe. But regardless the group as a whole are still human and should be afforded equal treatment. They are tax-paying, working, red-bloded Americans. The fact that they may love a person of the same sex doesn't invalidate the aforementioned facts.

 

And yes, I know about the work. Just because it's pure doesn't mean it comes without some effort. :)

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>>But regardless the group as a whole are still human and should be afforded equal treatment.

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Absolutely! In the United States, a private organization has the right to determine qualifications for its members and it may legally exclude any group of people whom the majority of its membership find sufficiently different or just plain creepy including schizophrenics, left-handers, those with Downs Syndrome, Achrondroplastic Dwarves, homosexuals, Klinefelters, those with neurofibromatosis, females, AB negatives, autistics, or redheads. In fact it's 100% legal for that private organization to discriminate against just about any genetic minority who look or act different from the majority.

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"...and it may legally exclude any group of people whom the majority of its membership find sufficiently different or just plain creepy..."

 

Sufficiently different? That statement made me just hang my head.

 

Yet is it morally straight to kick out a boy whose been in scouting for some time on the basis that he is gay? Even if at no time he acted on it? What does that teach the other boys? I know a private organization can exclue whoever they want for whatever reason they see fit, no matter how frivilous. I'm just worried about the example they're putting forth in front of these boys.

 

And none of this excluding redheads. My Eagle Scout happens to be a redhead. :p

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Strawberry,

 

That's the point of course. It may be legal, but that doesn't make it right.

 

And all those groups mentioned have been unfairly treated at one time or another (well, maybe not the AB negatives), including redheads.

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Strawberry Switchblade

You wrote

Yet is it morally straight to kick out a boy whose been in scouting for some time on the basis that he is gay? Even if at no time he acted on it?

 

Has this ever happened? I do not think it has. Do you?

Do you think the BSA would remove a scout, who tells them that he may have different feelings?

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Fair! Treated unfairly! Who determines what is fair? Is it fair that I pay less for gasoline than someone who lives in California? Is it fair that a member of the Armed Forces can purchase items at a steep discount when I can't?

 

We as Americans are all afforded the same rights. That's fair.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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OK, I used the wrong word. Delete "unfairly". How about this: "And all those groups mentioned have, at one time or another, been hated, feared, misunderstood, or ill-treated".

 

And, there has never been a time when all Americans have been "afforded the same rights". That is a myth. Race, religion, nationality, gender, age, have all been cause for denial of "the same rights", sometimes overtly, often insidiously. Even today. It is a worthy goal for us work towards, but we are not there yet.

 

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"Has this ever happened? I do not think it has. Do you?

Do you think the BSA would remove a scout, who tells them that he may have different feelings?"

 

Has a non-adult scout been expelled from scouting because he revealed he was gay? Is that your question? (I didn't find it quite clear)

 

If so, yes. There have been many boys expelled from the BSA upon making such a truth known. There are some cases in here about boys being taken out of the scouts for either being gay or atheist. Some are nineteen, though.

 

http://www.inclusivescouting.net/bsa/cases/

 

These cases are among those brought to the spotlight. I can almost guarentee there is more.(This message has been edited by Strawberry Switchblade)

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Trevorum,

We as Americans are all afforded the same rights! Whether or not a person or organization has tried to take those rights away isn't the same.

 

Have I (white guy) been treated fairly or hated or anything else in your list? Probably! But do I have the same rights regardless? Yes I do!

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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Strawberry Switchblade

From that link that you provided, it shows 2 scouts removed from the BSA for being gay.

I am just trying to see what you meant when you wrote.

"Even if at no time he acted on it?"

Of the 2 scouts kicked out, there really is only information on one of the scouts. It said that he helped start a gay alliance at his school.

My question to you is, do you think that starting a gay alliance in not acting on it?

Not looking for a debate, just trying to understand your beliefs.

I did not include the scouts removed for being atheists, this thread was about the gay issue.

 

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Hmm. I shall rephrase then.

 

Gregory Lattera, Life Scout

www.philly.com/mld/philly/6067592.htm

 

Matt Hill, 14

http://vernonrobinson.com/cgi-data/news/files/104.shtml

 

Roughly three scouts

http://www.bsa-discrimination.org/html/boy_scout_closet_.html

 

 

And when I say acted on it, I mean bringing it into the fire circle and hitting on other scouts, being inappropriate, etc.

 

What strikes me is the scouts demand a policy of honesty. But the only gay scout or scoutmaster allowed in the scouts are the ones who lie.

 

 

 

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