Religion-Atheism?

[Rooster7 11]

Merlyn,

 

Actually, the thought occurred to me before I made that post that you might agree with it. Im not saying this to be derisive, but whether or not an atheist is precluded depends on an important qualifier (in my statement) that you should not over look.

 

A Scout pledges that he will continually search for the truths behind his own existence and his purpose for being. Furthermore, he understands and respects others who are attempting to do likewise.

 

In my view, if a Scout says, Im an atheist and I see no need to search for the truths behind my existence or a purpose for being. There is no god and there is no purpose for being then he is disqualifying himself. On the other hand, if a Scout says, Im an atheist, but I will continue to search for the truth behind my existence and a purpose for my being then I could live with that, especially if he wasnt trying to undermine or hinder the faith of other Scouts.

 

The point of this pledge wasnt to be all inclusive. It was to recognize that not everyone is on the same path at the same time. I dont want to tell a kid who isnt sure of what he believes (or even the kid who doesnt believe in anything) that he cannot be around those kids that do.

 

To be clear, I dont see atheism as being a protected belief system. Its the absence of a faith in God. But ultimately, I want every kid to be able to enjoy Scouting and everything else in life I just dont want that kids lack of faith to be celebrated or viewed as a protected right within an organization that purposely seeks to recognize God, if not celebrate Him.

 

Now, I suspect that Merlyn and I are no longer on the same page. But Merlyn, I hope you realize that if you had a kid in Scouting, I would hope the best for him. And it would be my hope that he would find God. But I couldnt accept him in Scouting if he was intent on removing any signs of faith that accompanied those who do believe in God.

[NJCubScouter 1389]

I like Rooster's second option as well, although I don't think the BSA would go for either option. The first would be seen (by the BSA and by me) as too restrictive, as it would exclude some who do believe in a "higher power" (even without considering the silly "a rock" or "a tree" or "sugar-laden breakfast cereal" theology.) The second would be seen (but not by me) as too inclusive, see the 2002 resolution by the BSA executive board (or whoever) in which they said the "belief" requirement is "not merely aspirational" or something like that. It also seems to me that if the word "behind" were replaced with "beyond" it might come closer to acceptance by the BSA (as it would exclude those who say "There definitely is no higher power.") With either of those words, option 2 literally invites agnostics into the tent, whereas their status is somewhat vague at the moment. Even the "beyond" version might allow some varieties of "atheist", that is, those who have an open mind on the subject. I'd vote for it.

 

Added note: I just saw Rooster's latest message and it confirms what I have said above about the word "behind." I think the meaning of that word in Rooster's option 2 is the key to whether Rooster and Merlyn agree (to use a shorthand that will have meaning to readers of this forum.)(This message has been edited by njcubscouter)

[Merlyn_LeRoy 72]

But Rooster7, don't you also realize that your statement, the way it's phrased, would ALSO exclude someone who is certain that their god exists, and they are no longer searching?

[Rooster7 11]

Merlyn,

 

I suppose that's a way it could be interpretted - perhaps rightly so as worded. That wasn't my intent. Although, even with the current wording, I think an argument could be made like the following:

 

A Scout can believe God exists with certainty, but as a believer, he should always be searching to understand who God is more clearly and to better understand one's purpose in life.

[Merlyn_LeRoy 72]

Well, that sort of thing I wouldn't agree with at all, of course. It's like saying "You can make up your mind on religious question X, but if you get the wrong answer, you're out."

[SSScout 1616]

The word is "discernment"

One should always seek to discern God's will in one's life.

Whether from prayer, or the counsel of a trusted advisor or reading (Bible, Koran, Torah, Lotus Sutra, etc.), or "looking for a SIGN" (?)

 

Deciding (admitting? accepting?) God EXISTS is not the end of it. That is only a step up, not the platform where one sits, satisfied. Don't ever be totally satisfied. Keep looking. It ain't only the destination, it's also the trip.

 

Thank you, Merlyn, for reminding us of that. Complacency is not sufficiency.