BSA Swimmer Test (ERROR IN REQUIREMENTS!)

[GaHillBilly]

Hi All;

 

I'd appreciate informed comments on one aspect of the BSA Swimmer test, specifically, the bit that goes "after completing the swim, rest by floating".

 

This element is interpreted by these comments (http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/gss02.html): "This critically important part of the test evaluates the swimmer's ability to maintain himself in the water indefinitely even though exhausted or otherwise unable to continue swimming. Treading water or swimming in place will further tire the swimmer and therefore is unacceptable. The duration of the float test is not significant, except that it must be long enough for the test administrator to determine that the swimmer is resting and likely could continue to do so for a prolonged period. Drownproofing may be sufficient if clearly restful, but it is not preferred. If the test is completed except for the floating requirement, the swimmer may be retested on the floating only (after instruction) provided that the test administrator is confident that the swimmer can initiate the float when exhausted."

 

This is an issue for me, since I'm going to be running a sort of a combination Scout swim test and clinic in about a month, and would appreciate learning how others in Scouting have dealt with this requirement. In general, the test is fine. The problem, of course, is that many fit swimmers cannot pass floating portion of the test, at least in fresh water*

 

My son and I are new to Scouting (9 months), but not to swimming. I'm an ARC Lifeguard Instructor, a PADI Scuba diver, an NSPF Certified Pool Operator Instructor, etc. My wife is also an ARC lifeguard, and worked until recently as a certified (AEA) water aerobics instructor. We both have been fitness swimmers for years. My older son is a former USS distance swimmer, with AAA+ times in the 400 IM, and the 1000 and 1650 Free. In college now, he is an ARC lifeguard, but works as a swim instructor under a very successful USS coach, and trains as a Masters open water swimmer. This past summer he was the assistant aquatics director in a well known regional sports camp. My younger son (the Scout) already has his Mile Swim (27 minutes), but has not yet officially passed the Swimmer test. As a family, we have a comparatively strong swimming background, and we have discussed the BSA swimming requirements at some length.

 

This is not a new problem to me -- I've saw it first when a swim instructor at a camp nearly drowned me 40 years ago, trying to make me float! Fortunately for us both, he finally gave up and passed me anyhow. At that time, with fully inflated lungs, I could stay at the surface, but I could not float prone, no matter what instructions he gave me. Later, after I took up rock climbing, and dropped body fat while adding muscle, I became non-buoyant in fresh water, no matter how fully inflated my lungs were. Now, at 53 I can float, but only because I'm fat. Recently, due to increasing fitness and decreasing weight, I've found my buoyancy diminishing again.

 

My 20 year old can currently float with eyes and nose out of the water ONLY by hyper-inflating his lungs, and then hanging motionless with his head tilted back. In order to maintain his float, he can exhale no more than 50%, and then must very quickly re-inflate his lungs. This maneuver obviously requires a high degree of coordination, and is workable only for a skilled and relaxed individual. It is also obviously useless as a resting position, except in totally calm water. There is absolutely nothing he can do that will result in a prone float with his legs horizontal.

 

My 12 year old (the Scout) is only in the early stages of puberty, and so does not yet have the musculature typical of highly fit older swimmers. As a result, he has slightly more buoyancy than his older brother. But, due to less coordination, he has difficulty floating at all. We'll work on it, and he'll learn to exhale partially, and then re-inflate very quickly, and he'll be able to do an eyes and nose float. But that's all: he already has the heavy thigh muscles of a swimmer, and his legs sink rapidly.

 

The reality is neither of them could float unassisted in fresh water if exhausted. The coordination required to do the extremely quick exhale/inhale is not practical if truly exhausted. 'Drownproofing' is not really a option either, since for both of them, as is the case with other low body fat muscular males, their lungs must maintain more than 50% inflation in order to achieve even neutral buoyancy in fresh water.

 

What many swim instructors who lack a true swimming background do not realize is that highly trained swimmers can rest more easily -- even if exhausted -- with a slow freestyle crawl, by treading water easily, or by laying back and sculling gently than they can by floating. If I asked my 12 year old to tread water for an hour, his only difficulty would be boredom. But if required to 'float' for an hour, he'd drown.

 

Several of the youth in my son's troop are pudgy enough so that I expect no difficult with floating, unless they panic. However, there are a couple who are swimmers, and can pass all the other requirements, but are thin enough so that they may have great difficulty floating.

 

I'd like to know how other deal with this requirement, expecially given the obviously incorrect embedded assumption that 'everyone' can learn to float.

 

Sincerely,

 

GaHillBilly

 

 

* Buoyancy is much less an issue in salt water. I don't know if there are individuals who cannot float in salt water. However I do know that I could float in the ocean throughout my life, even when I was at my maximal musculature and minimal body fat.

[Beavah]

Yah, it's occasionally difficult for those lean, fit lads. Not quite as hard as yeh suggest for most, if they're technique is good (submerge as much of body as possible, especially head). But killer for someone like a distance runner or swimmer.

 

Our aquatics folks will give it a thumbs up for gentle prone sculling or a gentle relaxed slow-forward elementary backstroke. Anything that allows good aerobic recovery while still afloat.

 

Practically speakin', the point is to make sure the lads are strong swimmers and comfortable in the water. If they can easily sprint 75 yards, rest afloat to recover, and then continue swimmin'/sprinting strongly without panicking, I'd say they're done. All your fit swim team guys should get the signoff as a matter of course.

 

Beavah

[LongHaul]

GaHillBilly,

I too WAS:) a competitive swimmer with very little body fat. I learned a useful technique; extend the arms straight back over the head while floating on the back. This causes the back to arch and whileI still could only face float I could continue this for 30 minutes, the requirement back in the 60's for some level of aquatic instructor. While you may be body fat poor the vast majority of your scouts will not be. They lack the ability to relax and focus while in the water. As a Swimming and Lifesaving merit badge counselor I suggest you refrain from viewing the floating requirement lightly. Another technique in teaching a person to float is to take the troubled boy into water about 18 to 24 inches deep. Have them lay on their back, bend the leg at the knee and with the foot flat on the ground arms extended back over the head try and get the upper body to float. Because they do not fear drowning in 18 inches of water and the feet keep the legs from pulling the body down they should be able to relax andkeep the upper torso afloat. This will determine if a float is possible in deeper water if relaxed. If they sink with the feet on the ground AND their physical appearance suggests very low body fat then I'd accept a deed man float(drown proofing) PROVIDED THEIR SWIMMING PORTION DEMONSTRATED STRONG PURPOSEFUL TECHNIQUE. LongHaul(This message has been edited by LongHaul)

[GaHillBilly]

OK, I hadn't thought about it, but over the past 20 years, most of the kids and teens I've seen in the water have probably been a-typically fit. So I guess I can buy the idea that the problem is less common than I might have imagined.

 

I don't yet have enough experience with Scouts generally to have any idea where the lean/fat average is among Scouts, but it is true that a number of boys in my son's troop are either obese, or approaching it. (See the related post.)

 

GaHillBilly

[Scouter&mom]

Welcome to another Georgian.. At our council camp, they allowed the boys their hands slightly.. I understand the issue.. A good friend of mine who was a football player, weight lifter and Marine, battled to pass the Marine Corps basic swim qualifications, because of floating.. he had no fat and was very dense. He finally managed to pass it, and then the next level of qualification (which didn't require floating).. he now maintains that level.. says he won't let it drop cause they almost drowned him getting him to float. I float well, but being female and not as fit as I once was, both help..

[Trevorum]

GaHillBilly, welcome to the forums!

I've never been much of a water person, and this is the first time I've ever had my inability to float validated by an expert swimmer such as yourself. Thank you! I still remember the trauma of my swim test at summer camp when I was a youth. I'd take a FULL lungful of air, attempt to rest on my back, and sink straight to the bottom. I was convinced it was something I was doing wrong - turns out I just had no body fat. It took me three years to earn my swimmer badge at summer camp (how embarrassing was that!)

 

[epalmer84]

As a Scout, I was skinny as a rail (how different now). I could not float until until a YMCA instructor taught me. I learned to float on my back and my front (drownproofing). As noted, a big part of the problem is the fear of going under while floating.

 

LongHaul is exactly correct. Teach them in shallow water. The trick is to use the chest as a fulcrum, counterbalancing with the feet and the arms. Simply extend the arms full back and arch the back, pushing the chest up. I have had many new Scouts who could swim well but could not float. I have had every one pass properly after this simple instruction.

 

Ed

[GaHillBilly]

If:

1. The test swimmer is not afraid of submerging, or of the water.

2. The test swimmer can and will follow instructions.

3. For a given inhalation (air) volume, swimmer's buoyancy is a fixed physical constant.

 

Then:

1. The only way your method can INCREASE buoyancy, is to INCREASE lung expansion (air volume).

 

Been there, tried that method, sat on the bottom after.

 

I *did* sink more slowly than with other positions. I suspect that that position helps maximize lung inflation. And, thus, as a method of helping kids meet the requirements, it's a worthwhile attempt. However, it didn't help sufficiently to make me buoyant, and my swim instructor -- all those years ago -- didn't understand physics well enough to realize that if someone had negative buoyancy in fresh water with maximally inflated lungs, NOTHING is going to change that, short of adding flotation or allowing hand sculling. That instructor believed that everyone can float, and was determined to prove it over my strangled body. It was a miserable experience.

 

However, the arms back - chest arched position is (in my opinion) relatively useless, for very simple reasons. The avowed BSA rationale for teaching (and requiring) floating is to provide a self-rescue rest position.

 

Unfortunately, a Scout who needs to float for an extended period will hardly ever be in a glassy calm pool or pond. If they were, they'd be far better off to simply swim slowly to shore or pool edge. Rather, someone who must wait hours for rescue is almost certainly in open water some considerable distance from shore. The recommended position essentially guarantees that even the tiniest wave will wash over, and into, the swimmer's nose. For precisely this reason, even many experienced swimmers cannot swim backstroke in the ocean or on a lake with light chop.

 

There are ONLY three methods for keeping water out of a swimmer's nose: 1) maintain a face down position, or 2) exhale continuously through the nose (what competitive swimmers do while performing a flip turn!) or 3) wear a nose clip. None of these are an option for our Scout in need of rescue.

 

I accept the prudence of regulatory compliance in general, and of using this method to improve kid's 'pass' rate on this requirement. However, I suspect the requirement is pretty useless, in real emergencies.

 

GaHillBilly

 

 

[Beavah]

Yah, HillBilly, I think you're overthinkin' this because you've got such a strong swim background.

 

A heck of a lot of kids are able to complete the BSA 100 yards, but exhausted. They really don't catch up doin' a rest stroke because they're not comfortable in the water and are strugglin' to do that.

 

The float bit isn't a suggestion for restin' in 3-foot swells. It's just a quick measure of a boy's comfort level in the water. If the boy finishes 100 yards and is able to rest/be relaxed afloat, then that establishes a high level of water comfort with lots of available "reserves". Yah, in contrast, a boy who thrashes forward through 100 yards and then continues to thrash treadin' water for a bit really doesn't have the same level of water comfort, eh?

 

Since safety on the water really depends on bein' comfortable, not panicking, and being able to conserve energy, it's an OK test. Don't get too caught up in da details, keep your eyes on the goals. If a boy demonstrates 75 yards of continuous strong swimming, 25 yards of relaxed "rest" stroke, and can then "hang out" in the water resting by floatin' or sculling gently, he's passed. He's demonstrated swimming ability, comfort in the water, and the ability to conserve energy.

 

Beavah

 

[LongHaul]

GaHillBilly, >>However, the arms back - chest arched position is (in my opinion) relatively useless, for very simple reasons. The avowed BSA rationale for teaching (and requiring) floating is to provide a self-rescue rest position.<< Could you expound a bit on the very simple reasons? Having used this technique since 1967 when it was reveled to me at National Camp School I've had great success personally and with the boys I've counseled. As for not being able to swim on one's back in open water I wonder why you limit your dissatisfaction to floating. Ever try and do the elementary back stroke in the ocean? Breast stroke doesn't work very well either unless you can time the swells. Should we just revamp the entire swimmers test? I'm serious, do you think we should revamp the swimmers test to eliminate floating or the rest strokes?

LongHaul

[Oak Tree]

I too had very low body fat when a Scout. I was completely unable to float in any position. They were all just different ways to sit/lie on the bottom of the pool/lake. There was literally no way to actually float.

 

Gentle sculling seems to be the order of the day around here. This seems to be one of those cases where we go with the spirit of the rule.

[OldGrayOwl]

Just this past summer, at a big summer camp in MD, the instructor was failing Scouts and Scouters for their swim test if they were NOT gliding for at least 4 seconds for the restful back stroke. No matter that I showed him in the Handbook, Swimming merit badge book, nor the G2SS did it state a glide of at least 4 seconds. Some of the scouts that are very lean, would sink if they tried to glide for 4 seconds, but that did not matter to him.

[CalicoPenn]

It sounds to me that the problem has nothing to do at all with any of the swimmers - the problem is the interpretation of the term floating. Too many instructors seem to believe that floating is an inactive activity - that it is like nothing more than an inanimate object (think fishing bobber) floating on the surface.

 

Whether drownproofing (face first float) or back floating - there is always some level of activity. In drownproofing, the floater has to lift their head up every 45 - 60 seconds or so to exhale any remaining air in their lungs and inhale fresh air.

 

In backfloating (even "restful" backfloating), as the floaters legs sink (and they will sink - every time - I don't care how fat your calves are - there are no expanded lungs in the legs), the floater will need to occasionally gently kick their legs to bring them back to the surface - probably about once every 45-60 seconds. It isn't lack of chest expansion, or lack of body fat that causes a body to sink - its the legs, which will naturally drop (because they don't have the surface area needed to create the surface tension needed to keep them afloat) unless artifically pulled back into place (thus the kicking) and drag the body down with them. Once the legs drop to a certain point (which is that point where gently kicking will no longer bring the legs to the surface) the body is going to follow unless the floater takes action to make sure the body doesn't sink. A person's torso is wide enough to generate all the surface tension it (the torso) needs to stay afloat - no matter what your body weight is.

 

Don't believe this? Next time you're in the water, try sinking head first without doing anything active (like kicking your legs). It can't be done - the only way you can get started head first into water from the surface is to surface dive. Then try to sink the other way - let your legs drop and feel the reaction. Then do a surface dive and if your comfortable holding your breath under water, stop about 6 feet down and rest without fighting your body's movements - you'll find that your legs will start to sink below your head and you will start sinking, feet first. The human body always - always - sinks feet first.

 

Kicking in the restful backfloat - and slight arm movements (which don't help in floating, they help in station keeping)is NOT the same as treading water. When a person is treading water, they are at a near verticle angle to the water horizon - and is continuously kicking and moving their arms to maintain that position, with head fully above water. If you're only kicking once every 45 to 60 seconds while treading water, then you aren't treading water, you're sinking.

 

By the way, arching the back isn't really helpful in most cases either - when you arch your back, you force your legs to drop - once your legs start to drop, you are going to sink, and in fact, they will start to sink faster than if the back isn't arched.

 

 

The technique LongHaul mentions to get a person comfortable and confident enough to float in deeper water is sound. Since a foot on the ground means the legs have already dropped to the deepest point it can get too and has "stopped" the body has nothing to follow. The sinking action has ended. The next step is to convince the student that he can do this in deeper water - and that the secret to keeping the legs up is to occasionally gently kick the legs to bring them back up to the surface. To clarify my statement on arching the back, bringing your arms above your head arches the upper back, where your shoulder blades are, slightly - just enough to bring the shoulder blades, which are normally protusions that help break the surface tension, more in line with the rest of the back - helping to maintain surface tension. This slight arching is ok. Most people try to really arch their back (upper and lower at a low point with the middle up). This is the kind of arching of the back that shouldn't be done.

 

Calico

 

[WVCubDad]

I wish this string had occurred earlier this summer (mid-June) and I knew specifically what the BSA Swimmer Test requirements were before I went to Cub Resident Camp and wiped myself out passing it! For some reason the examiner didn't like my overhand backstroke and made me do it with me moving my hands at my sides.

 

I am out of shape and hadn't swam much this season when we went to camp so I didn't really pace myself in the swimming portion and then I just about killed myself trying to float while I was heaving trying to suck in good air. Fortunately (or not) the examiner had some patience and I did finally pass the test.

 

I'll know better for next year and have practice more as well. Thanks for the tips folks.

 

John

Assistant Cubmaster

Pack 13

Shenandoah Area Council

[ASM915]

Beavah,

Can't you prove your comfort level in the water doing the face down survival float, just as easy as trying to float on your back?

 

The again, howe many 11 y/o's do you know that are comfortable with putting their face in the water for a prolonged period of time.

 

Maybe the BSA Swimmer Test should allow you to float in any position you can, face or down.

 

And a rest stroke? Why does it have to be the Elemtary Backstroke?

Aren't the Breast and Sidestrokes also resting strokes? I like the Breaststroke because I can see where I'm going. I love all the macho guys at the mile swim that tear out across the lake or around the pool with the freestyle. By the end, I've passed most with a nice easy Breaststroke, resting as I go.

 

OGE, was he just a guard, the coordinator or the director? Was he gone the next week, after all the complaints to the camp director?

 

LongHaul, I'll see how well I can do the breaststroke and time the swells next week. I'll be floating somewhere off of Hilton Head.

 

ASM 915 - (use to stand for "a swimming maniac")