Dedicated Dad

Is there a such thing as an Independent source of information? OGE, Im puzzled why you would dismiss NARTH having read only one article, that doesnt make much sense. If youre going to take a position on something you should use your brain and not your heart, try investigating both sides of the issue. As far as the alien thing, I would give him/her the same advice, go and read NARTH, they have plenty of legitimate and independent information. There are literally tens of thousands of repaired individuals in this country, perhaps thats the best proof I can offer your alien. I personally know someone who is repaired from perversion, though he was never a scout, if youre interested, Id be happy ask him to post here but Im not sure how hed feel about that.

From your article.Often, these "therapies" expose their victims to electric shocks or nausea-producing drugs while showing This erroneous technique may have been true in the 60s but its no longer used as therapy by any credible organization anywhere other than the pro-perversion apologists that disingenuously present it as often practiced. This article further loses credibility when it quotes the APA (American Psychiatric Association) as an authority on any part of homosexuality. In 1973, if my memory serves, the board of trusties of the APA deleted the practice of homosexuality from its registry of disorders, how you might ask, by a vote of 4-3. There was no science behind the decision only a vote and 3 of 4 of the trusties who voted in the affirmative are admitted homosexuals. Further, the one-non/gay trustee, DR. Robert Spitzer, who voted affirmative has since changed his mind and now endorses reparative therapy. Im not quite sure why you think this article is balanced; if youre going to endorse something perhaps you should offer something more than a hit-piece with questionable credibility.

I wont be spending much time tracking them downIve commented on your position before and I would reiterate See no evil. Hear no evil, Speak no evil. If ignorance is bliss, why do you want any explanation or why would you trust my opinion? demonstrating feminine poses and other "gay" traitsI just would like to know how these situations are explained. Your presumption is part of the hairy butt excuse/lie which gets a bit too crass to explain in depth, even here in this forum, but briefly it questions the why would they given such an obvious revulsion. Part of the answer is why does one turn to homosexuality in prison having not practiced the deathstyle previously. As to your question, and I am no expert, effeminate behavior is an attention getting routine, it serves to be noticed and perceived much like the class clown enjoys the focus. Further, gay traits doesnt necessarily predict homosexuality, most effeminate little boys and tomboy little girls grow up to be able know right from wrong. Be careful believing any explanations your gay friends give you, they are all lies but not in a traditional sense. They are dying inside, hurting beyond any kind of guilt you or I could imagine. They need to justify their behavior by creating excuses for their iniquity, its a coping mechanism, and their lies have become so real to them they have become reality. We need to have compassion for them but not as an enabler. If you were truly their friend you should support them in seeking help, both spiritually and psychologically. They will tell you that they like the way they are much like an alcoholic denies he/she has a problem. They lie, they deny and they need you/someone to acknowledge they are OK for doing so, its all about justifying in order to endure their tragic existence. It is possible to change, should you ever choose to find the truth you may want to investigate these two web sites. http://narth.com/ http://www.exodusnorthamerica.org/

Well here is what I found out; it is illegal under Federal Law (Uniform Code of Military Justice). Can you cite the section for this provision of the code? Id like to look it up. And is wearing camo illegal or is it illegal to have camo be a part of a "uniform" ? Thats my understanding, I thought its illegality has entirely to do with impersonating an officer or military personnel.

The only problem with camping in camo would be if a scout does injure himself, his cammo may delay his being found OGE, we do indeed agree on some subjects. And youre right about this statement, but doesnt our own olive drab slacks and khaki shirt uniform blend in with background as well? Uniform v. camo is negligible to the objective presence of or troops.

there is an important book out that debunks the science upon which the claims are based that homosexuality is inborn. Is your book My Genes Made Me Do It by Neil and Blair Whitehead? If not, make sure your book addresses the LeVay studies, Hammer studies, Bailey: Pillard twin studies vs. Bailey: Martin twin studies of concordance, Kruijver studies, Swaab and Hofman's SCN Dimorphism studies, and The Prenatal Hormonal Hypothesis. Mom, here are some sources for your due diligence. I believe the subject addresses whether special status, a legal term of art, encompasses behavior as equal to innate condition as in race, creed, color, national origin and gender. If you cant prove homosexuality is innate condition, how can it be protected under law? Should there be a law that stipulates that any organization that doesnt have a policy that prohibits discrimination against football players is not eligible for payroll deductions?

EVERY thing I have read that is scientific fact says it is inborn. Care to cite any studies in particular? In fact there is no scientific fact that has every been proven or recreated under similar laboratory conditions. do you only have intimate relationships to procreate? Of course you do unless you want to risk the chance of creating life, and hopefully that fact is not a point of view for our Scouts. If youre insinuating something other than the procreation aspect, and I think you are, Im not sure how it proves that homosexuality is innate and appears to be irrelevant to the point. Roe v. Wade is not about "I'll do whatever I want", Its about not living with the consequences of your own actions, its about promiscuity, its about destroying precious life for selfish reasons. And, Im not talking about in the case of rape, incest, or illness of the mother so please, and I mean this in a nice way, spare us any specious diatribe and circumstantial analogy. My point was directed to the licentiousness of indiscriminant sex out side of marriage and the decline in moral values as its been aided by the passing of RvW leaving a slippery slope for the practice of homosexuality to go under the radar. There are some Christian churches that do NOT say being homosexual is SIN.Of course there are, how else can they justify having homosexual clergy. But I never brought religion into any of my points, how does it prove that the practice of perversion is innate? Where have you read that these are flawed?Ive got all kind of cites that prove the flaws, how about citing a study first. So does that mean I can just "choose" not to be depressed, even though I inherited it from my family? So now its a medical condition and not innate, or are you saying alcoholism is a disease?

Im sitting here scratching my head wondering at what point in time did political correctness take on the philosophy that perversion was innate condition. To answer my own question I would speculate some where between the sexual revolution (I should be able to do anything I want regardless of the consequences), Roe v. Wade and the LeVay studies, all contributors to the degeneration of the nuclear family. How far has society digressed to where right is wrong and wrong is right, Mom I have to admit Im a little taken back by your need for someone else to prove a negative for you. Perhaps you could perform your own due diligence, heres a hint though, and it has something to do with the survival of the species and free will. What makes you think it is?

"The state can't be party to the discrimination." Totalitarianism rears its ugly head again. have policies prohibiting discrimination based on race, color, religion, national origin, disability, age or sexual orientationThe inequity of lumping in behavior with innate condition is flagitious and reprobate. The practice of perversion is and will always be a choice, to equate it as an intrinsic state of being is like comparing Down Syndrome with incest. I will never understand how ones conduct deserves special status and why it merits more rights than I have.

MADISON, Wis. -- A handful of state employees asked Wisconsin officials Tuesday to enact a rule that would prohibit state workers from donating part of their paychecks to charities that discriminate based on sexual orientation. Opponents of the administrative rule, including Gov. Scott McCallum, said it would prevent state workers from donating money through payroll deductions to the Boy Scouts of America or United Way chapters that don' t have a nondiscrimination policy addressing sexual orientation. McCallum ordered Administration Secretary George Lightbourn last March not to enact the rule. "His position hasn't changed," McCallum spokeswoman Debbie Monterrey-Millett said. "If state employees want to be able to give to the Boy Scouts, they should be able to give to the Boy Scouts." State employees are free to make donations privately to any group, but they must follow guidelines to donate part of their paychecks, including that the charities not discriminate. The current rule does not list sexual orientation. The payroll donation rule would require charities getting donations from state workers through payroll deductions to have policies prohibiting discrimination based on race, color, religion, national origin, disability, age or sexual orientation. Chris Ahmuty, executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Wisconsin, said the state is in violation of anti-discrimination laws without the rule. ACLU attorneys filed the petition Tuesday with the state Department of Administration on behalf of eight state employees. The group is ready to file a lawsuit in Dane County Circuit Court if McCallum and administration officials decline to enact the rule, Ahmuty said. The Supreme Court decided in 2000 the Boy Scouts could exclude gays from serving as troop leaders. "That doesn' t mean the state has to provide them with a special opportunity to access employees," Ahmuty said. "The state can't be party to the discrimination." http://www.channel3000.com/news/1191755/detail.html

Should we replace the US Flag with the UN Flag?Nope, the Brotherhood patch. Get with the program K9, you're too narrow minded!

The Stamp Collecting and Coin Collecting merit badges, tie them all into the Collecting merit badge. Good idea, and you should use the Brotherhood patch for this too, nest pas?

Im sorry but the extra high skilled merit badges, Life Saving, Shotgun, Bugle-ing and any that I have neglected have got me stumped for an 11-12 yrld. Please forgive my skepticism but this exceptional Scout is more than a prodigy, he is an exceptional athlete and highly skilled to be anything he wants to be. Look forward to his election into politics and/or your physician; this boy is going far!

There's an auction on the eBay right now for a group of 20 shirts. Too bad we cant do this here on Scouter.com? hmmmWhoops, is that a challenge?

Sorry, upon rereading the article I see I miss understood your inference to Woodcarving vs. Woodwork.

http://www.meritbadge.com/bsa/mb/119.htm I didnt know there was a Woodwork merit badge either and I too wonder how someone can be in scouts for five years and and receive 123 merit badges. Thats more than 24 merit badges per year, what kind of life can one have with school work, friends, church, family and anything else beyond Scouts? That is why I put this article in the politics and issues forum.

the 16-year-old Eagle Scout has 123 merit badgesHe got his Eagle badge at 12.I dont know which is more incredible.

http://www.bergen.com/morenews/scout20011228.htm Friday, December 28, 2001 By DAVID NOYCE Scripps Howard News Service ALTAMONT, Utah -- A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, and reverent. For Jedadiah Curry, add ambitious, goal-oriented, and downright driven. And the 16-year-old Eagle Scout has 123 merit badges to prove it. For the record, that's every Boy Scout merit badge -- from American business to woodwork, including some that have since been discontinued. Jed completed the requirements for his final merit badge last month, making him one of only a handful of Scouts to pull off such a feat and fulfilling a goal he has had since age 8. Jed, a high school junior, always has been on Scouting's fast track. He quickly earned every Cub Scout award, then moved on to Boy Scouts, where he started collecting merit badges at age 11. He got his Eagle badge at 12. That's the point at which most Scouts ease up. They get the required 21 merit badges for their Eagle, then pull back. Not Jed. The pride of Troop 266 quickened his pace and went on to earn nearly six times the required badges. "In my 25 years of professional Scouting I've only seen one or two who have done that," said Kay Godfrey, information officer for the Boy Scouts' Great Salt Lake Council. People are even more surprised when they learn about the physical ailments Jed endures. For starters, he must take up to 20 pills several times a day to combat cystic fibrosis, a strength-sapping genetic disease he was diagnosed with as a baby. He spends at least an hour a day hooked up to a machine that breaks up mucus in his lungs, and packs a battery-powered device on camping trips that does the same thing. To treat his Type I diabetes, Jed checks his blood four or five times a day and gives himself insulin injections. Then there's the asthma. It needs attention, too. All these maladies might lead one to believe Jed is a sickly youth. He's not. He swims, runs, plays baseball, and performs in plays. And for much of the past five years, Jed has been piling up a troop-load of merit badges. Some were easy. He polished off mammal studies at a single camp. And woodwork? "All you have to do is carve something," he says. Most of the water merit badges -- from swimming to lifesaving to water skiing -- were a breeze, too, at least for Jed. "Swimming is one of the best exercises for cystic fibrosis," his mother, Penny, explains. Although Jed has every merit badge, he remains active in Scouting. But what if new badges are created before he turns 18? Will he go after them? "I'm through," Jed says.

I guess that depends on how you define perversion and what is truth... Verbal Aerobics: Lesson #1. If you dont like a definition, change it. Lesson #2. Make fact subjective. Whoops, now its coming back to me, we have been there done that. Note to self, stop banging head on wall.

essentially reminded schools that they may not discriminate based on viewpoint I love how right and wrong is reduced to a point of view. The practice of perversion is intrinsically wrong and no amount of verbal aerobics can change this truth.

We use to go on two-week portages through the Boundary Waters north of Duluth on the Canada/US boarder. The Superior-Quetico area has Seagull-Saganaga-Northern Lights lakes that connect by easy portages and are/were truly wilderness areas. It to this day is the best trip/outing Ive ever been on. Try a couple long distance practice runs on the Fox River before you go and go in August when the skeeters and the flies are less obtrusive.

Sorry, Dedicated Dadbut I've never heard a Wisconsinite talk quite the way you've describedYou have nothing to apologize for, perhaps I do if you took it disparagingly and if so I appologize. Some of my fondest memories of higher learning and people are between Beaver Dam, Horicon and Ripon/Green Lake, some day I hope to retire there. Its been a long time since, commer-once, stop and go lights and yah-hey have been part of my vocabulary, I thought Id give it whirl for cry-ay-ay.

We have patrols plan the outings for the troop,Perhaps this may be the problem, if you're not revisiting the well attended outings each year you're bound to hit a few that arent as fun as others. Change is not always a good thing. IMHOOK, we are located in a small city in Wisconsin, in the general middle of the state Hey, HOWS BY YOU, whats ya catchen? Good luck this Saturday, Bretts gonna make Vince proud, hey! BELIEVE-YOU-ME, San Frans a bunch of leakers, theyll get pounded so small on da frozen tundra theyll be taking their showers in the bubbler, you-betcha.

PETA went to court to insist that if this training would not stop the birds must be humanly treated. Of course they miss the concept that using live birds gives the dog better training. The better trained the retriever the better the hunter is in conservation, if you find all of your downed ducks you are harvesting less out of the environment. If you lose some in the field and take your limit youre taking more game than you could have. This is a simple concept I would think even the dimmest of the PETA bulbs could grasp. Ive done mainly hunt tests and a couple field trials with my dogs and all of the ducks and pigeons used are domestically raised for this purpose.

Um I thought I heard last night on Fox News that the whole thing was a hoax. Can anyone confirm this? the poorly thought out plan by PETA might get somebody shot instead of saving the deer. I believe this was more their intention than saving any deer, if there were real human death they stand a better chance of furthering an anti-hunting agenda. OK OK conspiracy-theory/Off.