DeaconLance

6 minutes ago, Eagledad said:

Hmm, good question. Embarrassing? 

Barry

What constitutes the uniform in many poorer parts of the world.

30 minutes ago, TAHAWK said:

 

Wearing a uniform (i.e., looking the same, clothing-wise) has slipped to an aspiration, as has  the Patrol Method and, as part of that method, youth leading. Nothing wrong with aspirations. See "Leave No Trace."  But what does BSA do to recognize actually achievingthe Patrol Method or to discourage adults from refusing to use that method?  Zip, zero, nada.  Actually doing it is not even part of Journey to "Excellence."  Even the "lip service" is fading.

 

Patrol method is objective #9 on JTE.

On 6/13/2019 at 1:34 PM, qwazse said:

Historical Note: Heritage Scout Reservation started out with patrol cooking at both camps Freedom and Liberty, but the demand for dining hall options was so great that the Freedom dining hall was built. The advantage of the latter is the scouts dine with staff and get to know them. There's more time for songs, skits, and (oh, mercy) announcements.

And the advantage of Liberty is not having to put up with songs, skits, announcements and waiting to be dismissed.

It shouldn’t be worn.  The insignia for completing Scoutmaster Specific training is the “trained” patch.

There is no requirement that the Scout type it.  As long as he wrote legibly in the workbook it is acceptable.

The youth religious emblem square knot was introduced in 1971, the adult one in 1973.

For Catholics the adult religious emblem knot is used to represent the St George Emblem alone.  So it sounds like they simply gave you the knot as an award which is not a proper use of the knot given there are several patches the National Committee provides for such a purpose.

I noticed the new Guide states square knot are now limited to nine, not just recommended. 

There was a National Maine High Adventure Area at one time (ceased operation in 1991?).  That would have been located in Region 1 in the old 12 region system.  I have never heard it called Region 1 Canoe Base.

 

http://www.mainehighadventure.org/

Did anyone besides LDS charter Varsity Scout teams?

Right, the NCCS doesn't have the authority to state the Church's position -- any opinion that they offer must be understood as a private opinion. To the best of my knowledge they don't even have any episcopal oversight.

The NCCS does have episcopal oversight and they are the official representation of the USCCB to the BSA. They do have the authority to state the Church's position as it is the only position they have. The bishops give them their position. Now the USCCB is large and individual bishops may not agree with the majority position and opt to disassociate their parishes from chartering units as we see in North Dakota. As long as the BSA honors its position to allow Catholic COs to choose leaders according to Church teaching I don't see any problem.

Deacon Lance

The Golden Arrow was an award for patrol leaders who met certain training and performance requirements not unlike the Scouter Training Award.

Very nice qwazse! And SMMatthew this probably the better way to go. Mixing different sacred texts run the risk of offending everybody.

Trevorum writes: " As I have posted elsewhere, many organizations that sponsor religious awards progams have no offcial affiliation with the religious bodies they represent. For example, the National Catholic Committee on Scouting is not an official body of the Catholic Church - rather, it is a group of Catholic Scouters who want to serve Catholic youth."

Your statement regarding the National Catholic Committee on Scouting is incorrect. It is an official body of the Catholic Church founded by and under the oversight of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. The same is true of the Eastern Orthodox Committee on Scouting which was founded by and operates under the Standing Conference of the Canonical Orthodox Bishops in the Americas.

Eagle92,

Thanks for the info. That is very strange indeed.

Eagle92,

"First Class rank, cloth, gold on tan, No. 00418; large standard metal pin, No. 00017; Boy Scout, left pocket; center front of campaign hat and expedition hat."

After looking at this I interpret it to mean Scouts wear nothing on the hats until they earn First Class then they may wear the First Class pin or nothing. As you said it is a restricted item so how would you order it for a Scout before he earn it anyways?

After rethinking this, I don't think the troop can trump the Eagle Scout's right to wear the cloth badge. The other ranks have an option of badge or pin. Eagle does not. Medals are for formal occasions.

"Think about it like the Eagle Scout award. We give a lad both a medal and a patch. He wears the medal the day he receives it - instant recognition. If he's under 18, he'll likely sew on the patch - and if you're wearing the Eagle Scout patch, you don't wear the medal."

This error keeps being repeated and it drives me crazy. Normally the Scouts wear the Eagle badge and Scouters wear the Eagle knot. Both may wear the Eagle medal in addition to the cloth patch on formal occasions.

The Insignia Guide states:

"Cloth badges and embroidered square knots are representative of metal pin-on awards and are designed for the convenience of the wearer. Generally, when a cloth badge is worn, the metal one is not worn."

"Eagle rank, cloth, silver, white, and blue on red, No. 00489, Boy Scout, left pocket. Adults wear square knot, No. 05011."

"Eagle Award, silver medal suspended from scroll, No. 00135; sterling silver, No. 00112; Boy Scout. Adults wear only on formal Eagle occasions."

It doesn't state never under any circumstances can you wear a medal and knot/badge at the same time. I don't think whne the regulations were written it was intended that cloth badges had to be taken off to wear the medal or that everyone had to have two shirts.

SO few kids wear the campaign hat I think it is a none issue. My understanding was everyone was to wear the universal pin except, First Class and up who were to wear the First Class pin.

I think they should just wear the badge. They could wear the lapel pin if the Troop is adamant, a bit small but better than wearing the medal all the time.

Yes, the world over the necker is the most recognized sign of a Scout, except the BSA where it is only an option. I think the new Canadian uniforms look sharp and functional and the BSA should take notes.

Full uniforming is a great ideal that the BSA does nothing to promote outside of lip service. Lord Baden-Powell described the essentails of the uniform: hat, necker, shirt, belt, socks and emphasized it be complete and correct. His HQ provided the uniform but his Scouts were not required to purchase it there. For shirts, shorts, belt and socks any dark blue, khaki, grey, or green ones would do. The only requirement on any of it was that the shirt was to have two pockets in front. No expensive "official" uniform. Just uniform use of readily available clothing. If the BSA was serious about full uniforms they would adopt our founder's wise policy.

And now a few words from our founder:

It is risky to order a boy not to do something; it

immediately opens to him the adventure of doing it.

Correcting bad habits cannot be done by forbidding

or punishment.

The boy is not governed by dont, but is led by do.

Lord Baden-Powell of Gilwell

It disproves the oft offered justification that scouts are impressed with knots. The boys in my troop feel the same way. They only knot they recognize and care about is Eagle.

Taken from the Scoutmaster's Handbook, 5th edition, 1959.

"While Scouters may wear the insignia to which they are entitled, a 'total display' may not be in the best taste if the uniform looks overdecorated. Unauthorized insignia or incorrect wearing of authorized insignia is always wrong. Scouters must set the example for Scouts in this matter. The Scoutmaster who wears only his Scoutmaster emblem, council or community strip, troop numeral, and service star on his uniform is never guilty of poor taste."

Also something worth noting, when this handbook was issued there were only 10 square knots available: Honor Medal, Silver Buffalo, Silver Antelope, Silver Beaver, Medal of Merit, Scoutmaster Key, Scouter Training Award, Eagle, Quatermaster, and Silver. At this time when you earned the Scoutmaster Key you took the Scouter Training Award off, so 9 would have been the max and that would have been improbable.

I note in British Scouting only one knot in a category is worn. If you are awarded Silver Wolf you take Silver Acorn off. I wouldn't mind seeing this either.

The BSA already regulates the number of medals that may be worn at 5, Sea Scouting does the same with knots at 6. I simply think the entire BSA should follow their lead. It looks better and keeps egos in check. As for inspiration/conversation starters, 1, 3, or 6 knots can start a inspire/conversation as well as 9 or 12 or 15. I remember when a Scouter with three knots was considered highly decorated.