CNYScouter

I would like to take WB this summer, however it is not being offered in my council this year and would have to go to a neigboring council to attend. Last year our councils WB course was canceled due to not enough people signing up. I have seen since then there has been a push to get leaders trained and a bigger turnout for training. It seems that WB should be done wihtin your council to network with the other scouters in my council, however I do not want to wait another year to only find out it will be canceled again. Any thoughts

Hi SWScouter, Most of the people staffing this are on our councils WB staff and I knew them when I was on staff with them at our last SM training session. I am planning on taking WB out of council this year as my council is not running a WB course this year. After seeing who was taking this I have to agree that attended by scouters that are more serious about the program. At this I saw my Districts new DC, the person who ran our Scouting University and I sat next to a woman who has been involved with scouts for over 30 years and was taking this as her last ticket item for her WB beads. Our council has a big push on training leaders going on as we are going to mandatory training for all adult leaders in the next couple of years. The last few years we have had real trouble staffing training. However I have heard that we have 10 new trainers volunteer to be on staff for SM/Outdoor training this spring. Our council is facing dwindling numbers and it has been attributed to untrained leaders nit running quality programs. Between this and insurance requirements they are hoping that requiring training for leaders will turning this around. The councils representative (professional) that was there said that the BSA was one of the few organizations that works with children that does not require training for its adult members and he thought that we may seea mandatory training requirement coming down from national in a few years.

I went to the Trainers Development Conference over the weekend and I have to say this was one of the better training sessions I have attended. (I have not had Wood Badge yet, I will be taking this in Sept.) I felt that this gave some of the most useful information so far in BS training. The stuff I received will not only help me with Scouting but I can use most of it in my professional life as well. I have wanted to take this but our council has not run this in quite a few years, There were 20 participants this time. I would recommend this training to everyone and was very glad I took it.

Ive heard rumors that my council is putting in a Dining Hall at Sabbattis. I also was told that they are spending $1M in improvements (dining hall included) there. I dont know when this is taking place or if patrol cooking is being eliminated or it will still be an option or if this is all just a rumor to try and boost attendance.

Our council has $15M liability policy for Scouting activities. I was told by my DE that in 2 to 3 years the insurance company is requiring all leaders to be trained in their position for this to be in affect. I was also told that it will be required for any adult to go on an overnight with a Troop or Crew will need to have SM training/Outdoor training to be covered by this insurance. Of course you will always have the Units that ignore this.

My 14 year-old Star Scout didnt ask or need anything Scout or camping related as we have been slowly purchasing these from him as he needed them. However, whenever I went out with the Scouts, I was always borrowing or using old equipment, so for Christmas I wanted to update stuff and heres some of the toys I received: LED Lantern small and very bright 0.5W LED Flashlight - 1 AA battery very bright and small Princeton Tec EOS headlamp Lexan Tableware Set Columbia Hells Canyon II water shoes (I wear a size 14 so finding these was no easy task) I also got some things just for fun: Magfire standard fire starter Garmin eTrex Handheld GPS My wife also hit the Jambo clearance items at Scoutstuff.org and got me a Jambo T-shirt, Polo shirt and jacket.

To go along with my other topic about "getting a totally trained unit" I would also like to know how to make training more effective. Last spring I decided to move to another Troop becuase of the lack of a scouting program being offered in the Troop we were in. I looked at about 1/3 of the Troops in my district. Every adult leader told me they were fully trained but none of the troops were using the Patrol method nor were they boy-run. The message I get from this is that leaders are taking the training however they are not using the training or they didn't get what was taught. So, how do you make training more effective?

Our district has a new Traning Chairman. They have sent a survey to all unit leaders and one of the questions they asked is: What method is best to achieve a totally trained unit? So, what methods have worked for you to acheive this?

Since it seems the forum is on a Uniforming kick right know I thought I would add to it. Required or not, good looking or ugly, functional or not functional, Uniforming is one tool that is used to reach the Aims of Scouting. So, why do we wear a uniform? 1) The uniform reminds a Scout of who he is and what is expected of him. It is a visual reminder that shows you believe in the Scout Oath and Law. 2) The uniform identifies a Scout as part of a patrol, troop, council and worldwide youth movement. 3) The uniform is where a Scout can show the achievements he has earned. 4) The uniform can be used to show leadership. If youth leaders are encouraging the wearing of the uniform, other scouts will follow. 5) The uniform is also used to identify a Scouts POR. 6) Adult Scout Leader wears the uniform to be a role model. Youth learn by example. You cant ask the boys to wear the uniform if you are not willing to wear it yourself. 7) It is an equalizer. If all the Scouts are wearing the full uniform, you cant tell rich from poor, everyone is a Scout. Im sure there are more reasons behind why the uniform is an important part of the BSA. The Troops that I have met that encourage the wearing of the full and get the Scouts to wear the full uniform (not force them to wear it) show a great deal more pride in their unit and exhibit a much more positive attitude towards Scouting than the ones that dont. I finally purchased a pair of uniform pants and socks. I have to say I feel different when I wear the full uniform (OK, I still need a belt). I recently was on staff for our Scouting University. The only people wearing a full uniform were the staff. Very few people in attendance even wore their scout short. Did I feel better than them? No, however I did feel I was being a role model and setting the example. The next weekend I was on staff for Outdoor Leaders Skills. Because we had heavy rain the week before and due to the mud and wet conditions I chose not to wear my Scout pants,. I dont know why, but I just didnt feel right. Here I was training new SM/ASMs but didnt have a full uniform on. How can I say that you should be having your Troop wearing the full uniform when I wasnt weariong one myself. With these reasons I cant see why anyone would not encourage the wearing of the full uniform.

My sons Troop doesnt believe the uniform is important and allows the boys to wear whatever they want to meetings and outings. One kid will have a shirt with no neckerchief, one will have a shirt with a neckerchief, the scout next will have a bolo tie. Other kids will be wearing the red polo shirt and a few will have no uniform. None of the Scouts wear the pants and the only adult with a uniform shirt on is the Scoutmaster. Some of the comments I have heard about this informal uniform policy: - After the Troop went to the Merit Badge Camp-oree at the Navel Academy in Annapolis, MD. I heard a comment that they were the only Troop there that did not have full uniforms. - At our council camp-oree they were the only Troop that not a single kid brought their uniform. - The Troop no longer goes to district events because it was embarrassing on how disheveled and unorganized the Troop was compared to other Troops. These comments did not come from the Adult Leadership but from Scouts in the Troop. When I tried to say something about this I was told by the Troop committee that this uniform policy adds to the uniqueness of the Troop and they saw no reason to change it. If anyone think Uniforming doesnt matter these types of comments show that the boys do notice and care about how they look.

Gee, what perfect timing. I need to stop at the local Scout Shop on the way home to pick up a gift for and Eagle COH this weekend. Some of those deals look too good pass up. Now if it would just stop snowing!

If you read the back of the New Unit Application it says that a Chartered Organization Representative may also serve as the units Committee Chair or as a Unit Committee Member. BoxieLady - Don't give up its not as bad as it seems. It will be all worth it in the end.

I didn't know there was a Venturing YPT. There was no mention of a different YPT for Venturing Leaders during the Leader Specific Training. I was told there was a specific YPT for the youth in a Crew but not a separate YPT for adults. Is this available on-line? Does anyone have a link for Venturing YPT? The DE that we met with suggested that the club members be directed to the on-line version from our councils Web site. That training is the same for Cubs, Scouts and Venturing. Ill see about getting the Fast Start Video to show during training when I talk with the Training Coordinator.

nldscout- if BSA's position on Liability and Supplemental medical is they will always cover you no matter what dumb things you do ... without exception ... Why are we always told "No Tour Permit - No Insurance coverage" I have been told this by my DE, our Council Training Chairman, the Course Director at SM Training, my District Training Chairman, 2 other District Training Chairmen and by a Trainer at another council I took a course at. If we are covered no matter what, why are we being repeatedly told otherwise?

It just seems that everywhere a charity is asking us to donate money or goods. Our church has a tree with gifts for the needy we are asked to purchase. Our kids schools are always asking for donations of food and new clothes for us to but and donate. Even at work, we were asked to bring in a new toy for a Christmas giveaway. I think that these are all worthwhile efforts, I was hoping that Scouting was the place the my kids would actually go and give service to a charity. A do agree that it is often As to the Units Service Projects: One of the Boy Scout Troops fundraiser service projects was talked about at a Committee meeting but it was already decided that it would be done and the details of what needed to do be done were discussed. However, it was never mentioned that this would be done at a Troop meeting. The other fundraiser, my son showed up at a Troop meeting and started working on a craft to sell. This was not discussed at a Committee meeting and he (nor I) had no idea that this service project was taking place. The only thing positive I can say that this is more than our first troop did in the way of service projects. In the 2 years we were in the troop the only service projects scheduled were Eagle Projects (about 2 a year). As far as my daughters GS troop, her two leaders decide everything. We have suggested different ideas but in my sons troop, no one else seems to have issues with doing these for projects. Also, the last time I made a suggestion about soemthing with the Troop I was told, by the CC, I should wait and learn how this troop does things before suggesting something. Our ideas for service projects seem to be ignored in the GS Troop. As for not having enough volunteers, Ive stopped volunteering for things because I am very rarely asked to do anything. In the 4 years, I have been a Scout leader, I can count on one hand the times I have been asked to do something. Everything I have done I have followed through and done a good job. The only thing I have ever turned down was when I was asked if I wanted to be a UC. At the time, I was the CC for a Pack and an ASM for a troop and there was no way I could take on another role.

I was told by my DE that in the next 3 years or so, our council will require all adults attending Boy Scout overnight activities will need to have taken NLE, YPT, SM Leader Specific and the Introduction to Outdoor Leadership Skills. I was told that the councils insurance company will require this for liability insurance coverage. My DE said that they do not care if the person sleeps through the training but they will have had to attend the training. I know that my council is in the middle of putting mandatory training in place and was told that this will be the requirements after the mandatory training for all registered leaders is in place. He also said that there were many Scout Councils facing this and that it would start to become more commonplace in councils in the US.

emb021- I am aware that the necessary training does include all the things you mentioned. The club has copies of the Venturing Fast Start (along with where to get it on-line) and will be distributing it to the members. As NLE and YPT are the first courses a new leader needs to take this is where we will be starting. The club feels that they should get as many members as possible to take these and I know the people to contact to set these up. The shop will be open for club members to use, along with any members of the crew to use, most nights and weekends. The club feels that NLE and YPT are important and wants its to know what Scouting is about and the YPT rules that go along with the responsibility of being a CO. The Venturing Leaders Specific Training will be taken by the club members and other adults that will be working closely with the youth, but I dont think that every member of the club needs to take the Leader Specific Training as there are over 60 people in the club.

OK, I just dont get it. My daughter came home from her Girl Scout meeting and told us what her Troops service project for the Holidays is. We are expected to give her $15 so the Troop can go and buy gifts and items for a needy family. A notice came home with her that said that she could only ask immediate members of her family and could not go out and solicit donations for this money. My son came home again from his troop meeting in which they spent the meeting making a craft to sell and then the money will be donated to another charity. This and the cookie dough (its a dry mix) sale are the troops service projects for the year. Getting involved does not seem to be the answer as neither of these projects were brought up for discussion and were decided to be done by one or two people. Its not that I dont think these are things that need to be done, but are not in my definition of service projects. My kids youth group at church went down to work in a kitchen to feed the homeless. This is my idea of a service project. My son and daughter didnt really want to attend, but my son came home and was smiling when he told me that he scrubbed pots and pans for the 2 hours they were there. My wife and I are the only ones who seem to have a problem with this (or at least we are the only ones saying anything). Perhaps this is part of the reason my daughter GS Troop went from 17 girls last year to 5 this year (and I dont think my daughter is interested in staying in this much longer either). Im beginning to think that I am wrong to want to oppose these types of things as no one else seems to have any issues with doing these, but I dont see the kids getting much out of activities like this.

2040

Thanks for all the responses. After meeting with the DE last night is looks like a Venturing Crew is the way to go. I talked with the President of the Club on Saturday morning, he talked with club members over the weekend and it looks like they have enough adults in the club interested in becoming leaders (even a female Associate Advisor) and enough clubs members with Venturing age kids to get this started. This was something they had talked about doing for sometime but never knew where to begin. They have asked me, since I am the experienced Scouter, to set up the necessary training (NLE and Youth Protection) and they are going to get as many club members as possible to take these. Ill keep the forum updated on the Crews progress.

I was wondering more on how does the organization and the way an Explorer Post is run differ from the way a Venturing Crew is run and is organized? I know how a Venturing Crew works but have no idea on the structure and the way an Explorer Post is run. emb021 yes this is the question that needs to be answered. This type of youth group could go into either a Post or a Crew. We are meeting with the DE tonight to see which is a good fit for the club and where to proceed next.

I dont see why it has to be one or the other when you can incorporate both of these. The older, higher ranking scouts had to learn the basic scout skills at some time and you should be able to refresh these skills quickly with them. The older scouts can than teach this skill to the younger scouts. This can then be done with lashing and any other basic skills that need to be worked on. Yes, this is not the fastest way to teach scout skills but we are not always looking for the fastest way to do things but ways to use the methods to achieve the aims.

I think Monopoly and Scouting are a good analogy. As is Monopoly, Scouting is a game. A game with a purpose. As with all games there are rules to follow. In Scouting there are 8 simple rules. They are called methods. As with any game, you must take the time to learn the rules on how to play Monopoly or Scouting. Scouting, as with Monopoly, many people play the way they think it should be played and not the way Parker Brothers intended it to be played. Monopoly, if played the way it was designed, achieves its intended goal. If the game is tweaked it may or may not achieve its intended goal. Monopoly has a measurable and distinct end to the game. This is where Scouting and Monopoly differ. Scouting does not have a measurable and distinct end to the game. If you tweak the Scouting program, how can you tell if you have achieved its intended goal? The only sure way to know if Scoutings goals are being met are to use the rules (methods) to play the game (teach the Aims).

Explorer Post still do exist they are under Learning for Life. see: http://www.learning-for-life.org/exploring/index.html Most of the Explorer Posts in our council are sponsered by a business. I was really trying to find where to steer this group into as they do not fit into either of these as the club is not career oriented like an Explorer Post nor are they outdoor oriented like most Crews but the club would really like to have a Scouting program associated with it. However, I have taken Venturing Leader Basic Training and I was told that a Venturing Crew does not have to be Outdoor/High Adventure oriented.

This sounds to me that more leadership skills are needed or the SM got nothing out of Wood Badge. Isnt a leadership skill recognizing a need or seeing a deficiency and finding a way to fulfill this need or eliminate the deficiency and following through to see that it was taken care of? This SM is fully aware of the lack of basic Scouts skills being taught in his unit and the lack of adults with the knowledge to teach it and shouldnt he be working towards a solution to fix this instead of just saying the only person who was good at it no longer comes any more?