malraux

1 hour ago, mashmaster said:

This 18 month lead up is painful, I am not sure why it took 18 months IMHO.

I have found it pretty obvious how it was all going to shake out as well, with the only uncertainty if they will have separate patrols in willing troops or just separate troops. But there was a huge contingent here and elsewhere arguing that it was happening way too fast and too soon to possibly plan.

And for what its worth, given the three alternatives of 1> scouting not being mentioned at all on the news, 2> scouting being mentioned in terms of bankruptcy and sex abuse scandals, or 3> scouting being mentioned for adding girls, I'd say that possibility 3 is better than possibility 1. Though yes, I'm ready for it to be done, got the patch, lets worry about spring camporee and summer camp plans.

Quote

World Crest, cloth, No. 143; worn by all registered youth members and adult leaders to symbolize membership in the World Scouting movement; centered horizontally over left pocket and vertically between left shoulder seam and top of pocket. (guide to uniforms and insignia)

Thats the rule for where to wear it on the uniform. I really wouldn't worry about it for the relatively short period till uniforms come in. The absolute worst thing to do with an enthusiastic new member is to get annoyingly uniform policeesque when the real problem is the actual supply of uniforms.

I might steer in favor of wearing the neckerchief because that’s what a lot of other scouts do in other countries. But yeah, as a temporary thing she should wear the crest however she wants. 

The red berets are cool again apparently. 

PWD seems to bring out the worst in some to complain and push the rules.

Every race seems to encourage the rule of "must be a newly built car", so you aren't in the wrong there. A car that is just wheels removed and regraphited is not a new car. As you now see, you should follow the original rules regardless.

I guess the real question is how do you want to handle the families going forward. What is it the families want? What will make them happy? is it worth it to keep them around?

Feedback might be a gift, but I'm not sure it'll be accepted as such.

At this point it is very much not your problem, and I agree that at this point your best response is to ignore the old troop (or at least its problems) is the best answer. But I still don't understand the goal of the parents to family camp in the troop structure. If they want to go camping on only their terms, just go camp.

17 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

One of the other parents ended up letting the cat out the bag that she and her husband were one of the reasons why I left.

Now my friends and I are getting texts from her about if it was true or not. They are not responding to her. I told her I will contact her tomorrow as I am slammed at work. Will begin my missive tonite. 😁

"Yes" is hardly a missive.

9 minutes ago, mrkstvns said:

In our local council's scout shop they do. 

https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2015/02/25/the-world-crest-means-sew-much/

The ones in our scout shop often have everything pre sewn because then the scoutshop can charge the $2.00 per patch few for sewing.

7 minutes ago, fred8033 said:

I fully agree.  I hate troop shopping as a default hoop to jump through.  But, if your current scouting unit is not a good match at any time, look for a better situation.  There is no reason you can't change at any time.

Having listened to lots of people with troubles in their current troop stay miserable for far too long, people really should consider it more often and quickly.

While some units act like everyone who goes to a particular school or church must attend the associated Pack/Troop, you are welcome to shop around. I recommend looking at the unit finding website at https://beascout.scouting.org The information there can be a bit out of date but should let you know where else to look. In your situation I would definitely look around for a new pack.

25 minutes ago, Eagledad said:

the 3 Aims

Technically, we now have the 4 Aims: Character, Citizenship, Personal Fitness, and Leadership. Leadership was added very recently.

On 1/11/2019 at 6:09 PM, ParkMan said:

I'm all for setting the bar high for membership in the OA.  I get that we all want it to be BSA camping - but it's not what's written.

A mild defense of having it not be just bsa sanctioned camping:

I would think the goal with scouting is to teach the youth to act wisely in all that they do, but especially in the outdoors. By the time a scout is first class, he/she should have a reasonable grasp of setting up a tent, planning a menu, following lnt, etc. Allowing OA qualifications based on camping outside of the BSA seems to follow in that mindset, that you should use this knowledge outside of just scouting.

Compare and contrast that wording with the camping MB requirement.

"Camp a total of at least 20 nights at designated Scouting activities or events.* One long-term camping experience of up to six consecutive nights may be applied toward this requirement. Sleep each night under the sky or in a tent you have pitched. If the camp provides a tent that has already been pitched, you need not pitch your own tent."

The OA wants a BSA summer camp experience, plus another 10 nights camping. But by the wording, only the 5 continuous nights need be at the bsa sanctioned event.

It appears to be working for me. According to the initial presentation, the time involved is 45 minutes + 40 minutes +40 minutes. So right at 2 hours. No idea yet how comprehensive the material is.

I did the online training about 1.5 years ago. It was of mixed utility. I know that they also just rolled out a new training course (as in this week) for the online stuff. Not sure if the in person stuff is the same.

As for leaders not knowing stuff, first, its possible that they didn't do the training. Getting our leaders trained is a pain in the butt. Second, at least with the old training, what I found was that it was hard to figure out what was important vs meaningless and a fair amount of the info is spread out everywhere. Or the info isn't current with the new rules or whatever.

Looking at the new training, it looks more straighforward and usable.

Pinewood derby cars? That’s upcoming and is a wood project you apply a finish to. 

Something something immediate recognition. 

31 minutes ago, Saltface said:

Maybe I’m mistaken, but I don’t believe a district signature was always required. At any rate, I know for a fact that my local scout shop will sell you one no questions asked. 

I walked into my scoutshop and picked up my den leader knot right after turning in the form. Then after months of the district person complaining about the exact signatures on the form, the district finally issued me a certificate and knot. The lesson I learned was that the paperwork was too much work to bother trying to do correctly.

Wasn't required when I earned my eagle in the early 90's.

4 minutes ago, T2Eagle said:

I think leveraging that support would be critical to a new troop's success, but I don't see any reason why the new troop would need to hold meetings or campouts with the existing troop.  The essence of scouting is a group of friends who get together and become better citizens and better individuals by planning and carrying out their own program.  Let the girls do that.  Tell them how it should work with them making decisions and carrying them out, and then let them do just that.  

This is perhaps closest to my feelings as long as we are really making separate troops a thing. The girls should drop in to an existing troop meeting and a plc meeting once just to see what they are like, but the best way to learn how to do all the elements of scouting are direct experience.

1 hour ago, Treflienne said:

For a new girls troop it seems obviously better to link to a friendly local boys troop than to try to go it alone as an completely independent troop with a separate troop committee.   

Situation:

Girls: Probably 6 or 7 girls.  Young and inexperienced. Ages 6th-8th grades.  Most scouting experience among the girls:  one did everything her brothers cub scout pack did, one did some camping with girl scouts as a Brownie/Junior/Cadette.  A good bit of enthusiasm.

Adults: One (me) with GSUSA experience and absolutely no BSA experience.  One (an eagle scout) with extensive experience in a cub scout pack.  One with no experience but willing to be a committee member.   We have yet to press the other parents to find out what they would be willing to step up to do if nudged to do so.

Several local boy scout troops all are pleased to see a new girls troop starting.  All have offered to link to the new troop. Their CO's also are okay with the idea.

Seems obvious to me that the girls should go with one of these offers and not go it alone.   

Anyone care to give contrary advice?  Would anyone rationally go it alone instead of linking?  Why?

I guess the question is if you are a linked troop, exactly how are you linked? Sharing of committee, space, equipment, joint activities, etc are all possible. But that does also mean giving up some of your own self determination as well. I'd also take the warning about being sure that you have youth and adult buy in as well, at least for whatever it is you will be sharing.

Same with what I’ve seen with Cub Scout packs. The only consideration might be if the male and female bathroom facilities are in different locations.

2 hours ago, Summitdog said:

Makes some ranks but for reasons that are not relevant to this discussion decides to repeat 5th grade.  

Really any sort of grade repetition would do it, as there wouldn't be a reason to make a kid repeat the "bear" year in cubs just because he repeated the 3rd grade.

Most often a paracord woggle. I do have a bunch of legacy slides as well (national jamboree, neal slides, etc). I don't like metal slides.