malraux

10 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

Finished reading that GSUSA guideline.  I have no problem showing the uniform, emphasizing their unique brand, ensuring GSUSA money is spent on GSUSA events.  Recruiting separate... sure.  Many valid points.   

Telling a Troop of Girl Scouts that they can no longer participate in Scouting for Food because it is a BSA event crosses a line.  It crosses the line of an organization more self interested in $ than doing service. I haven’t seen that and GSUSA in my area still does some joint BSA activities when it involves community service... I hope that remains.

Also the bit about no joint pinewood derby events just seems silly.

Edit: didn't see your post above and should have quoted that one.

Would be interesting to cross compare the GSUSA participation rates in those areas. If there's a relative dearth of GS participants in that area, then I could see BSA having a larger field to draw from. (just speculating of course, and I could just as easily make a case for high participation of GS in the south leading more acceptance of scouting generally.)

I know that one of the troops our pack feeds to has an explicit rule that any parent who was in leadership in cub scouts has to take a year off of leadership before they can assist the troop. Again, good to help transition away from the cub scout model.

https://www.scoutshop.org/catalog/product/view/id/398/category/746/

Without knowing specifics, some other considerations are that sometimes it might not be a difficult item, but a nonetheless important one. At the cub level getting baloo trained leaders can be an issue for some packs. It’s not a huge amount of time, but it’s a necessary one for the pack to do things. Additionally, without seeing a whole ticket, it could be an easy step on the way to a much more difficult one. I won’t defend purely easy tickets, but there can be some logic in making some steps easier, if the others are all very long term and hard. 

The snarker in me would make the final act in that troop to ask the sm to sign off on the smc and completion of rank since he did meet with the sm. 

As a den leader, with a decade of scouting experience as a youth, the value of wood badge to me was that it helped to see the whole experience of scouting as an integrated whole.

I do think there’s an issue where the worst cases stand out. If a 60 person class has 90% of the people have simple fast beading ceremony, the 6 who don’t will still stand out. 

I will say that in our council, wood badge is way oversold. Not every person who shows up at a training needs to append a “go to wood badge” to the end of their subject.

I do also wonder how wood badge could be considered a life changing course. Getting married, having kids, or joining the peace corps were life changing experiences for me; wood badge was just a pretty good training course. 

1 minute ago, ParkMan said:

Sure - i get the Wood Badge isn't the pinnacle of Scouting  knowledge.  It's a leadership course set in a Scouting context.  It's can provide you tools to be a better Scouter - but they are just that - tools.

I'm 100% in support of an advanced course for Scoutmasters.  That would be wonderful.  A sort of Wood Badge or Powder Horn scale course about being a Scoutmaster.  Scout skills, boy led, patrol method, etc.  That would be an awesome course!

I'm not looking to start up a debate here.  I just think that the volume of negative Wood Badge comments are excessive.

 

It sounds like a good course for a summer camp to offer for scout masters. 

Doesn’t powderhorn function as a more advanced outdoor skills course?

3 minutes ago, shortridge said:

The BSA is already pro-vaccination, thank goodness. See Public Health merit badge, requirement 2.

Or their vaccine page on camp. 

13 minutes ago, qwazse said:

do we have incident reports of such things?

To clarify, what are you asking? Do we have incident reports of measles outbreaks occurring at a summer camp ever, or do we have a measles out break at a bsa summer camp in the last 5 years?

The national rule is tetanus is mandatory, the others are just recommended. 

Nope and I have lost any respect I might have had for your other positions. 

5 minutes ago, WisconsinMomma said:

Why open the can of worms?  Parents can and should decide their preferences.

Because the choices of one greatly impact everyone else. Hep A can pass when dealing with less sanitary condition combined with food, which sounds like every campout cooking situation. Measles can spread very quickly with even casual contact, and is pretty bad.

Also, its a good idea to go through the job specific training for the den leader position. You can either do it via the online portal where you did ypt, or find a class. The council/district is likely offering a class soon for all the new den leaders; ask your cub master.

it kinda depends on how it gets used. For example, with cast iron chef, the scout needs to plan a menu and budget it. Those are written things so using a sheet with those make sense. 

It also depends on the worksheet and the goal. Part of webelos is transitioning from the cub program to the scout program. That means that the scout should start getting used to the idea of tracking his advancement (ie getting sign offs in his book/worksheet) and working somewhat independently. To the extent that the worksheets help with that, good. To the extent that instead of reciting the outdoor code from memory the den leader is requiring the scouts to write it out and write a paragraph on applying it to a hike, that's bad. (Obviously if a scout for whatever reason was more comfortable writing rather than speaking it would be an ok accommodation).

2 hours ago, shortridge said:

Is your objection that

(a) Scouts should not have premarital sex,

or

(b) that Scouts should use protection?

Be prepared seems to cover these moderately well.

Do we deny eagle to a scout that goes hiking/camping in bad weather and ends up needing a rescue? 

Not specifically what you asked, but you should be checking to see if any other den leaders also qualify for the den leader training award and or the scouters training award. Assuming the District Rattler Award is what comes up with a google, I would nominate the CM for that as well. The committee that decides such things can only say no. The committee chair should also be signing that stuff as part of their position.

As far as I know, my pack covers dues. Given the time and effort leaders put into the process, it seems rather unfair to ask them to pay for that privilege.

http://www.firecrafter.org/webelos-camper.html

4 minutes ago, packsaddle said:

Could you please expand on your 'blatantly sexist' characterization of the BSA and how this is the real problem in this case? (yes, I know this risks going off-topic but it might be related depending on Kryten's reasoning)

Presumably it’s the asymmetric way that women can supervise boys but men cannot supervise girls. 

1 minute ago, ParkMan said:

If a troop invites a den with girls, the troop has to make sure it has the staff to support it.  If it doesn't that's the troops fault - don't blame the girl you invited.  What kind of example is that?

My only real thought on this is that the current rules say that girls need to be in a den with a female leader. Part of the webelos den leader job is to go camping with their den at troop events. It really ought to be upon the pack with the visiting webelos to find the leader, not the troop hosting.