The Latin Scot

From Scotland, really? That's fantastic, welcome to the forums!

Interesting. Whenever an organization makes an announcement about an upcoming announcement, I get mildly suspicious, lol. 

Interesting. I guess I'm down for the whole retro-vibe, although it's still drably executed. As for the color "changes," they've actually been pretty consistent with coordinating color schemes for a long while now, with the one exception of the Wolves wearing yellow hats and neckers as a holdover from the days when all Cubs simply wore blue and gold. Otherwise the Wolves have been using red as their color for many years now. I suppose it was inevitable that they would eventually switch entirely to their red color scheme, but I will miss seeing Cubs in the classic blue and gold in any case. 

As long as my Webelos stick to the plaid and don't go to a straight green any time soon, lol.

EDIT: I also feel somewhat irked that the Webelos Handbook does not feature the Arrow of Light, nor even mention it, as it should. It's frustrating that the highest rank in Cub Scouts doesn't even make an appearance on its own handbook.

On 3/22/2018 at 8:50 AM, Eagle1993 said:

New Cub Scout books will be available in June. They are integrating the new requirements (that were previously in an addendum), rewording for gender and using the new Cub Scout color scheme.   Old books still work if you have the addendum.  See pic of the Wolf book attached.

If I may ask, where did you get this photo and information? Mind you, it's not entirely surprising, but what is the source of this picture? I confess the cover is ... well, boring to say the least. I hope they don't go with this monochromatic style in the end, but curious to know more. At least they are incorporating the addendums into it, but as the leader of an all-boy unit, I hope they don't go overboard with the gender-integration images inside. And what about our old friend Ethan? Will his twin sister Edna be joining us now?

sigh ........ I know it's been said a million times over, but this whole inclusion thing is really ruffling my feathers again, lol.

The one in front looks just like one of my Webelos Scouts actually. I think it's the begging expression on his face.

I have 8 boys in my den. Only 2 are presently legal American citizens; the others are immigrant citizens of Mexico, China, and Taiwan. But I tell them that since they will grow up in this country, and live under this nation's laws, they should consider themselves Americans, and that they have a responsibility to this country that is giving them and their families so many of the opportunities they enjoy. If they live here in America, I tell them, then they should feel a part of the great tapestry of this country, and that comes with inherent duties which they should feel the need to fulfil. Not only do the boys respond well to this idea, but I have had parents thank me for helping their sons feel that they have a place here that they didn't feel they had before, and I have had a few mention that their performance at school and their relationships with their peers has improved since developing the idea that they have a legitimate and important place in this country. I think that's one of the most important things Scouting can do for those who are new to our nation.

Earning the Atomic Energy merit badge at the San Onofre nuclear power plant was incredibly exciting, but personally, my favorite was actually Mammal Study - I have always been a passionate naturalist, and so this badge was right up my alley. Same with Reptile and Amphibian Study, when I got to take care of a neighbor's pet tree frog for a month! And of course Reading was fun, since I have always been and always will be a major bookworm, so this was an easy and exciting badge for a reader like me to earn.

When I was in Scouts back in 1999, we spent a day at the San Onofre Nuclear Power Plant (before it was shut down) over by Camp Pendleton. We went through the whole facility, including demonstrations of how powerful the outer shells were, the amount of energy it could generate, and more. We wore hard hats, got special badges, and completed the Atomic Energy merit badge, as it was called back then. It was the last badge I earned, and it was definitely one of my more memorable experiences in Scouting.

I concur; it's only sensible that adults who are present at activities for that much time be registered as leaders.

Our district charges $170 for the week, or $150 if you register at least 30 days before the event. Having attended with my Den for the past two years, I can't say it's entirely worth the cost. 

That's just what we  do; my assistant has all the woodworking tools, and one of my Webelos who lives up the street from my has a nice big garage and a father who is ready to open it up for us to use. In two weeks it will be open for a few hours on a Saturday so that any boys in the pack can come work on their car, and there will be one more Saturday closer to our derby in April when they can come in if they missed or didn't finish during the first week. 

If you don't have people with the tools and space readily on hand, you could talk to local shops or hardware stores and see if any of them are willing to open up their resources to families in advance of your derby. And then invite them to the races when you have them! Some recognition for them in honor of their help would  be a great way to involve your community and get your program out their. Always look outside the box when you feel stuck. ;-)

The thing is, that kind of natural separation is entirely normal at that age. It's simply the way most pre-teen kids think, and so it would be unhealthy to force any legitimately co-ed program on these ages. That's why I hope National is true to it's word and creates a separate program for girls that steers as far away from the boys program as is possibly. No girl/boy patrols, no sharing troops - a total separation of boys and girls in their own programs, even if the girls are working on the same requirements. As far apart as they can be is best for these ages, developmentally speaking. 

I don't have a copy of Scouting with a Neckerchief, although I know the item you are referring to. I haven't seen a copy in print but only know it from multiple references online. I would imagine somebody here would have it, right? Anybody?  In any case, they didn't have as much published supplementary material in the early days as they have now, when we are practically drowning in new material being published almost monthly.

As for collarless shirts, yes I have seen many, many examples of those. But for certain, in the very latest Guide to Awards and Insignia, the official policy states on page 13 under "Special Regulations:" The unit has a choice of wearing the neckerchief over the collar (with the collar tucked in) or under the collar. So at the very least, as of the past few years both options are 100% authorized by the BSA.

Actually it was! I am looking at the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th editions of the Handbook which I have in front of me right now (it's good to have a solid library), and in the uniform illustrations, all of them have uniform diagrams featuring the neckerchief being worn over the collar. In fact, let's not overlook the fact that on the very cover of the 3rd edition, there is an illustration of a Scout in profile - with the neckerchief over the collar! And just about every early painting by Norman Rockwell shows Scouts wearing the neckers old school style - with the neckerchief over the collar. And with all due respect, they are pretty darn authoritative if you ask me. Rockwell was a stickler for accuracy and his paintings almost never deviate from the proper way to wear the uniform at the time of their execution, and during his long tenure as Chief Scout Executive James E. West demanded complete uniform accuracy in all offcial BSA illustrations and publications. So, yes, it was not only authorized, but in fact it was the norm to wear the necker over the collar for many, many years. 

1 hour ago, FireStone said:

Was there a time when neckerchief-over-the-collar was the rule? Maybe back when neckers were larger and thus the size made under-collar more difficult? 

I kind of wish we went back to the larger size neckers. And wore them more without the uniform, like a lot of non-US orgs do. We had a boy at camp recently wearing his neckerchief over a t-shirt. I'm keeping hope alive that maybe this could catch on.

 

Yes, if you look at materials from the 20's and 30's, it was expected of boys to wear their neckerchiefs over the collar, a look I very much enjoy. 

When I take my boys on service projects or especially rigorous outdoor activities, I only require them to wear the necker so that they can be recognized as Scouts. At this point I have emphasized the appropriateness of this option so often that most of the boys in our pack and troop can quote with a degree of precision the exeprt from the guide to uniforms and insignia regarding the appropriate wearing of the neckerchief without the rest of the uniform. 

EDIT: I am including this link to a webpage I found extremely educational regarding neckerchief wear; it isn't official BSA material, but I found it authoritative enough in its own right. 

http://inquiry.net/uniforms/neckerchief/swn1.htm

1 hour ago, JustAScoutMom said:

But most packs have an elaborate event for rank advancement and crossover, while some combine it with B&G.  Most packs have a tradition on how they handle this every single year....this throws a wrench in tradition for the packs, and everyone on top should know it.  I don't think its unreasonable to wait until 2019 but it has to be in place right after 1/1/2019!  If for nothing else, the troop needs to be organized prior to accepting new scouts.

Personally, I think a lot of packs could stand to tone down their "elaborate events" - they become almost like wedding receptions what with all the pomp and money thrown into them. I think that learning to simplify things and creating a more modest approach to rank advancement at the Cub level is an important lesson for many packs. Yes, we should be celebrating achievement and advancement - I always do with my den - but it should be to a degree that's appropriate to their age and accomplishment. The grand advancement ceremonies and Blue and Gold banquets with the huge costs and extravagant decorations are too much if you ask me. In my opinion, being compelled to simplify can only be a good thing.

I definitely pull out whatever I have when I teach the Scouting Heritage merit badge. My stuff generally isn't that old, but the boys are pretty motivated when they see that a youngher guy like my can still be interested in all the old stuff, and they get excited when I find little odds and ends to add to my collection. Maybe someday I will acquire enough to have a really legitimate collection! Aside from my collection of Handbooks (I have one each of every single edition now), most of my stuff is pretty recent.

1 hour ago, gblotter said:

Those garrison hats are sized incredibly small. Even our youngest Scouts wear a size large.

Aw ... I am 34 years old and I still wear a small. Now I feel ridiculous. 

My Dad wears a garrison hat though; he's a Wolf Den Leader and the boys love it. Between his garrison and my campaign hat, we're pretty well covered in my home! Now we just need to find my mom a good lady's hat that doesn't make her "look like an airline stewardess." 

Perfect; thank you so much! This is just the thing I have been looking for. 

1 hour ago, HelpfulTracks said:

I collect neckers (I love them) and have several different Eagle versions (Blue, White NESA, Lifetime NESA, NESA Jambo, Staff etc).

I usually wear my white NESA to Eagle CoH. But I have seen various versions worn by adults and think it is appropriate no matter which color, after all, Once an Eagle Always an Eagle. And I have never considered the blue one to signify anything other than Eagle Scout (no age qualifier I mean).

BTW - if you are looking to return the favor, NESA makes a red "Eagle Awarded in 2018" necker that would be a nice gift

Wear can I obtain this? I searched the Scout supply site to no avail; do you have a link? I LOVE the idea!

56 minutes ago, HelpfulTracks said:

Per the 2015 Guide to Awards and Insignia

The unit has a choice of
wearing the neckerchief over
the collar (with the collar
tucked in) or under the collar.

This is absolutely correct; in fact, for many decades Scouts were supposed to wear the neckerchief over the collar with the collar tucked under. Allowing them to tuck the necker under is the more recent option, but as @HelpfulTracks has pointed out, both are entirely permitted.

8 hours ago, gblotter said:

Me too.

I wear a bolo tie - partly to set myself apart as Scoutmaster but mostly because I hate neckerchiefs.

I would be fine if our troop abandoned the neckerchief altogether, but the boys really seem to like it.

I LOVE neckerchiefs! They add such a classic feel to the uniform, not to mention their little splash of color does a lot to brighten up the earth tones of the rest of its items. I admit I am starting to amass quite a little collection of neckers, all for different occassion - I have my Cub Scout Leader blue, and my Webelos plaid, not to mention the white NESA necker I just got a from a boy's parents to wear at his coming Eagle Court of Honor. I can easily see myself ending up with a whole plethora of colors to choose from; I love colors, and the neckerchief is the one part of the uniform where you can really add a bit of flair! Especially for somebody like me who otherwise tries to be an absolute stickler for proper uniforming, lol.

@karunamom3 I would love to hear how this event turned out if you have a moment to share!

Wow ... that house is bigger and nicer than the house I grew up in! Those boys had better appreciate it, lol. 

Well fortunately the boy's mother dropped by and actually asked if the blue Eagle necker was something that I was comfortable wearing or if she should have gotten something else. We had a rather delightful conversation mostly centered on the over-eagerness of her son, and we opted to switch out the blue on for the white NESA necker instead. This way the boy still feels like he is sharing the moment with me (which is far too kind of him already), while I can still be distinguished as a leader and not as one of the Eagle recipients. The boy's mom joked that I should just go with it and pretend I was one of them just to see how much cake I could get out of it. I can't say I didn't think about it.