WisconsinMomma

I'm going to pray for you and your whole Pack.  I hope it gets better.  Big hugs.  

1 hour ago, RememberSchiff said:

Oct, 2014: Sharon Moulds, SE/CEO Laurel Highlands Council 2014-present

https://triblive.com/news/editorspicks/6945412-74/moulds-scout-scouting

"She is one of seven women among about 300 Boy Scout executives. She oversees programs for about 30,000 Boy Scouts in 16 council districts across Pennsylvania, Maryland and West Virginia."

That is a big council!

I am still so sorry.  A pushy person can push their way into an organization, and it sounds like this method is working for this guy.   It sounds like the commissioners want you to have a CM, any CM, and this one seems to have a lot of energy, and they want you to work it out so you have your Key 3 and then it's less work to try to recruit another CM. 

Now, do you go along with it, fight it, or move to a different group?

From what I am reading, the council can decide to allow a person with a criminal history to volunteer if they decide the person has cleaned up and is on a better path.  I am also reading that the Chartered Organization (the church) can still say no thanks.

What have the responses been like to the lack of training? 

I guess my question is, who will work with this Cubmaster and Den Leader to ensure they follow BSA rules?  Since they have shown no respect to you, I would think that CC is not the right role for you anymore.  (Not your fault, but it's not practical or healthy for you to have to be the person to have to confront the CM and request compliance.) 

I think in your shoes, I would resign as CC and focus on my Bear Scout.   I would probably focus on making the Bear Den experience a good time for that group of boys.  A good den is a good thing. 

Maybe that makes me sound like a quitter, but I think limiting your exposure to this person would be good for you.  Why bang your head against the wall?

Since you can only control yourself, you have to find where you want to be in this situation.  

I will mention that I was an interim CM (after 4 years as DL and one year as ACM) with our Pack and recently stepped down because of a conflict that was making my volunteering no fun anymore.  Now I am just the parent, and it's awesome!  (I still volunteer with a Troop and the Council on other stuff.)

I don't generally like pushy Scouters, but on the positive side, they can get a lot of stuff done.  He needs to be trained. If he wants to try stuff, that's fine, but they need to follow Safe Scouting.  I don't think that given the history that you are the right person to try to enforce the rules and rein him in. 

The students' school is closed today for security reasons, as threats have been made against the school and individual students.

A person cannot be pro-life and wear a MAGA hat in DC, be on camera and remain safe. 

On 1/20/2019 at 10:02 PM, Sentinel947 said:

I'd rather the Districts/Council not have an inquisitorial staff. Rather this shouldn't be something adversarial in nature. It shouldn't be a performance review like at work. Rather, the BSA requires the basics (YPT, SM Specific, IOLS). Those need to be made stronger and more impactful. Beyond that, the leadership of a troop should desire self improvement. The resources are honestly in place in many places. Wood Badge can be part of that. Participating in Round tables if your district has ones that are useful. Participating in forums like these. There a number of wonderful books to read about Scouting that can make us better at what we do.  Just like at work, we're at our best when we continue to grow, take on new challenges and learn new things. 

Is it unfortunate that some Troops run terrible programs, cause Scouts to leave Scouting and burnout otherwise excellent volunteers? Sure. But remember, Districts and Councils are equally capable of achieving that too. I generally think a soft power approach for this would work more effectively than a hard power approach.

Really, I feel like there should be a person in each District who runs around and tells all the volunteers, THANK YOU regularly.  So many Scouters are underappreciated.  

I'm just curious.  Thank you!

21 hours ago, qwazse said:

My take: people of various affiliations who gathered together on a national plaza expressed their dislike for one another's associations. Nobody was shoved, punched, stabbed, blugeoned, or shot. It was a good day for freedom of expression in America.

Yes and no. The issue that can happen is if these young people are identified and demonized for life, college acceptances revoked, etc.  There is a trend towards judging and punishing people because of social media, and that is dangerous territory.  Hopefully nothing like that will come of this situation, but it is a real risk.

First of all,  THANK YOU for all of the things you do to support Cub Scouting in your area.  

Second, I am SO SORRY that you have all this drama coming from this man and his "friends".  

Now, let's get practical.

1.  You have a lot going on in your life.  This guy is a pain in the rear.  Are you willing to push forward and take care of this problem, or do you prefer to go join another Pack?   Either answer is OK.  

2.  Jerk is not the Cubmaster.  It is crazy that he buys a uniform, shows up and assumes the role and starts taking over the meetings and conversations.  YOU are the Committee Chair, and YOU are in the power position.  Your Chartered Organization Representative is even more powerful.

3.  Call your Scout executive and tell him or her about the issues with this non registered person playing leader and creating havoc in your group.  Stick to the big things -- acting as a Cubmaster without authorization or registration, showing up in uniform and taking over meetings, trying to divide the families and get support for him without ever having registered, how he's starting to try to gain support from your council folks when he's not even registered (!) and the problems with the refusal for the statement of religious principle and background check.  Ask your Scout Executive for help.  Emphasize his illegitimacy and lack of any training.  Ask them for support to help your Pack.  See what they recommend, and discuss some of the ideas below with them.  The Scout Executive could certainly send a letter downstream to this individual and all of the relevant district staff that this troublemaker is not part of Scouting, period.  Ask the Scout Executive to help you make a plan for the survival of your pack.  Your key phrases are  -- I need help, and we have an imposter leader who is unregistered, refuses a criminal background check, refuses the statement of religious principle and is not YPT trained. It's getting out of control and I need help to fix this situation. 

4.  I agree with others who say -- change your committee time, date, place, and do not inform or invite the troublemaker.  

5.  You must formally tell the troublemaker he is not the Cubmaster, not a registered leader, and not welcome at your events, period.  Restraining order sounds good to me.  You have to be careful that if this person has been verbally abusive, he might become even worse when disciplined.  You and the COR are both female, and it sounds like the fake CM feels like he can bully and intimidate you.  You might want to have some guys around who feel comfortable standing up to him if he starts to act physically intimidating.  Be careful. 

6.  You must communicate to ALL YOUR FAMILIES that troublemaker is not the Cubmaster.  It sounds like he is playing the part and the families are following along.   You need to give them the name and contact information for the person they should work with, an interim Cubmaster.

7.  You need an interim Cubmaster.  Who will do it?  Who do you know?  You need someone else in uniform who is properly registered to lead your next Pack meeting.  Ask your district for help and see if anyone will help you out for 6 - 12 months to support you and get you through this.   You need your Key Three --  COR, CC and Cubmaster -- to exist as a Pack.  You need to figure out who will help you during this difficult time.   If you do not have a Key Three at recharter, you do not have a Pack.  Your Scout Executive should care about supporting a Pack in a low-income area.  Hopefully he or she will have your back and put some effort into your Pack's survival.

8.  Keep your head up.  Don't sweat the small stuff.  At first, this person (I was going to say parent, but that's not even accurate) sounds like someone with a lot of enthusiasm for Scouting.  But, if he's not working with you, he's in the wrong.  I would not stress over little things --- if someone wants to suggest something that costs money, that is not the end of the world.  If someone wants to plan a fundraiser, that might be good.  If someone wants to run a safe pinewood derby car workshop, then that is great.  But the problem is that this person has no respect for the chain of command in Scouting, has no training, and is not willing to follow the rules.  That is no good.   You should welcome all kinds of ideas and suggestions, and even try new things, but this whole charade of acting like the Cubmaster without a proper registration is a big, big problem.

9.  If you and your COR and veteran Den Leaders stick together, you can beat this. 

I think you are beyond working it out with this person.  I know you are feeling very upset over this issue when you have put so much into helping your Pack.  If he is not leaving, then I think you should move on to an established Pack where you can relax and enjoy. 

It is OK to cut your losses and move on if you want to.  I would probably be visiting other Packs as well as working with your Scout Executive.  Plan A is to fix your Pack and get this jerk out of the picture. Plan B is to move to another Pack, either plan is good for you.

Best wishes, and I hope that you find a solution that works for your family. 

WELCOME GIRLS to the BSA!  WELCOME families!  I wish you an amazing Scouting experience!!!

I want my kids to learn how to handle guns safely and responsibly.  We live where hunting is common and shooting skills are still basic life skills to me.  

1 hour ago, RememberSchiff said:

Is Council interested in what I can bring to training scouters or do they want worker bees who will stick to a fixed script?

I would want to know the details and what decision-making authority I would have.

My $0.02

That's a good question.  I would not expect that the council is seeking people to, you know, rewrite their training materials.  But I think they would be open to creativity in presentation.  And of course, after you volunteer for about a year and the relationship is established, they might ask you to start running whole programs! 

I think there is probably a bit of relationship-building involved while you work out what you want to do and where you think you fit the best. 

I was asked by a guy I met at BALOO (who is our council training director) for names of folks who might want to be on the council training committee.

I gave him the names of everybody I know.  (Not really, but I gave him a lot of names of people I know from Wood Badge and then I gave him the names of all the "old-time" scouters from our Troop (basically people whose kids have graduated from scouting a few yeas ago.)  I told him to "butter them up", meaning, appreciate the scouters!  

Here's my question for you, Scouters -- if you were asked to participate on your Council training committee, would you?  Why or why  not? 

I let our council training direcor know that sometimes the attitude towards council is not rosy.  But perhaps a nice invitation and some appreciation and relationship building would do the trick! 

(Note I am already involved as a regular BALOO Trainer and I will continue to run a Traffic Safety merit badge program annually.) 

On 12/14/2018 at 9:21 AM, ParkMan said:

Hi @rubixcube,As a former Troop Committee Chair - I'll add my .02 here.

I'd encourage you and some others to become registered Troop Committee members.  Find some jobs to help out with.  Next time something like this comes up, you'll all be in a much better position to say "No, let's not do that."  Along the way you'll also help strengthen the troop too - a side bonus.

2

The problem is that old guard members don't let in any new blood.  It's all ego and know-it-all-ism.

Old guard adults are such a pain in the patootie.  Tell them that since they have no kids raising funds, they should listen to the people who have kids actually in the troop.  If they aren't raising the money, they need to take some freaking input. 

Email them, call them, complain to them.  Complain up the chain. 

I can't stand old guard leaders who don't serve the membership.  Back in the day, in 1980, we did it like this, and my son, who's now 45, did that for his eagle project,  yadda, yadda, yadda.  Ugh!!!   

When I was a den leader and frustrated with some of the committe, I focused my energy on the den and just did what I could to get through the Pack and committee meetings.  Put your energy into your den. 

Write a letter back. Come to camp. Here are the rules.  No interference, and if you interfere, you will be asked to leave the troop.

Make sure you have enough drivers w/o the troublemakers. 

OK, comrade. 

No worries!

That was a very classy letter from national. 

11 hours ago, ParkMan said:

What on earth could a fellow   person do to greatly improve a unit with 4 hours a month.

Not all DEs are men, nor will they be going forward.  

15 minutes ago, AltadenaCraig said:

WisconsinMomma:

Keep your focus on Scouts, not on adults.

You don't have time for this rabbit-hole, much less the risk of being a moralizer or a prude, etc.  Of course, if this language is used in earshot of Scouts that's a different matter.  Adult-only committee meetings?  Let it go.

 

My issue is that when we are meeting as a committee, we are on-duty as volunteers for the BSA, and therefore submit to the values of the organization. 

If we were at a non-Scouting event, then I don't care.  I care about Scouting. 

I struggle a lot when I hear people use bad language at committee meetings.  Unfortunately, I have heard the phrase (I'll make it less crude) "poop show",  at both a Cub committee and Troop committee meetings. 

I decided to leave Cubs because I felt that there was a growing negative vibe overall, coupled with a lack of appreciation for many of the adult volunteers.  Then at the next Troop meeting I went to, I heard the same phrase, but in a less accusatory and critical way.  

But honestly, I hate hearing this kind of language from adults in Scouting.

Now, if I hear this again at troop committee?  Do I say something?  Is that too parental?  

I am *not* a delicate flower, I just want people to use clean language throughout Scouting, observing the Scout Law.

What would you do / say?  Thanks! 

Your son is too young to be in Boy Scouts, but he could be in Cub Scouts as a lone scout.  So maybe that is where they are coming from, your son is not old enough to register as a Scout, but could be a Cub.

Have you looked at all the churches and schools in your area for a Pack to join?  I would probably approach the question as -- my child wants to be in Scouting, we have not found an organization to join, and we might want to pursue Lone Scouting (for whatever reasons) -- what do you recommend?  If they don't have a lot of experience with Lone Scouting they may just not have a lot of knowledge to share.  Read up online and if possible, talk to others who have done it.  It also might take you a while to find the right person.  Be persistent and polite in your follow ups.

Get a Youth Application and turn it in as a Lone Scout?  I don't see how they can turn down your application, to be honest.  

Good luck! 

https://www.scouting.org/commissioners/lone-scout/

https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2015/09/28/what-are-lone-scouts/

Here's a Facebook group for lone scouting:

https://www.facebook.com/LoneScoutingUSA/

There are seriously NO other merit badge counselors?  Which one is it?   Pulp and Paper??  

I can understand being frustrated that a meeting was rescheduled, and a 2 week plus wait -- that is frustrating.  I can also understand how 12 year olds don't have it together organizationally and it takes multiple tries to make things happen.

I am sure that it can feel like you are delaying things like asking him to bring his calendar (who uses a paper calendar?) rather than you proposing dates that work for you, but someone has to offer dates, and make the communication.

I get frustrated sometimes when people get a little too picky about --- first you have to do this, then here's another hoop, and then this needs to be done just so.  It can be hard for kids to communicate with adults, and if the adults are not accommodating, or have road blocks, or are difficult to reach /busy schedules/slow to return calls, it's all a big pain in the backside!  This stuff can be 1) slow and 2) frustrating, and it is very hard for 12 year olds to be successful with!

So take a breath and don't get upset. Have a good trip! 

I think the mid-20's is a fine age for starting a career in politics, and obviously the voters supported him, so I hope he serves the people of Iowa well and I hope that he lives the BSA oath and law throughout his service to the people of his state.  

BSA teaches about citizenship and we should be proud.  Generically proud, we don't have to be specifically proud of political stances, etc. but proud that a Boy Scout is serving people, yes!