WHEELER

From the thought of Anaxagoras (c 500-428 BC): "Other things share in a portion of all things, but Mind is boundless and rules itself, and is mingled with no other thing, but remains apart by itself....For Mind is the slenderest and purest of all things. Mind is the ruling force in all things that have life whether greater or smaller." Aristotle commented that Anaxagoras was the first 'sober' thinker amongst a succession of 'babblers'. For Anaxagoras, nature displays order. Order is only the product of intelligence. That is Mind. The ancient Greeks speculated that there was chaos, and from mind motion was set into that pre-existing chaos causing recognisable forms to seperate from it. There is a Mind out there greater than us. Clinias the Cretan, in the Laws of Plato: "Why, to begin with, think of the earth, and sun, and planets, and everything! And the wonderful and beautiful order of the seasons with its distinctions of years and months! Besides, there is the fact that all mankind, Greek and non-Greeks alike, believe in the existence of gods." Paraphrased: "See nature, Know God."(This message has been edited by WHEELER)

"To provide for the general welfare" does not mean social security. The Founding Fathers would be horrified how "general welfare" has now been expanded. This is not the original meaning. Franklin Roosevelt got his ideas from the fascists and socialists in Europe, especially Mussolini. FDR is also the one that threatened the US Supreme Court to disband it if it didn't find his programs constitutional. Was FDR a law-abiding citizen? What example did he set? The US Supreme Court ruled against his policies, and he threatens them. This is a good sign on the legitimacy of Social Security??????? The income tax was struck down eight times by the US Supreme Court as unconstitutional. It is the third plank in the communist manifesto. These people talk about equality but the graduated income tax is about treating people unfairly. See, Karl Marx got his idea for an income tax from the Bible. God required a tithe from all. Rich or poor every body gave 10%. God treated everybody the same. Karl Marx took that and graduated it. Now we treat the rich different from the poor. This is not righteousness but unrighteousness. The graduated income tax is pure evil.

To evmori "Socialism and communism are not interchangeable terms." In a sense they are. Socialism is the genus and communism is the species. Fascism is also a species of Socialism. Socialism is found in the acronym USSR and in NAZI. NAZI is the National Socialist Workers party and it's platform was socialistic. USSR is the Russian Soviet Federated Socialist Republic and it's platform was extreme socialism. "The Bolsheviks defeated their opponents in a civil war(1918-20) forming the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics designated on Dec. 30, 1922." Encyclopaedia Britannica, Vol 10 pg 255. Socialism either takes two forms communism or fascism. No way around it evmori. To Old Grey Eagle: The League of Nations is the precursor of the United Nations. Thanks for the heads up on that little bit of info. It explains alot of things now. What caused WWII was WWI. WWII would never have happened if WWI did not. What caused WWI was an anarchist shot Prince Ferdinand of Autria in Serbia. Anarchism is a form of socialism. In order to stampede people into their creation of one world government, THEY, the socialists, caused the horrors of WWI. Woodrow Wilson the socialist, then proposed the "League of Nations" as the solution to WWI. First the socialist causes the problem and then says, hey, here is the solution to it. It is called Hegel's dialectic. The League of Nations failed because the Senate of America rejected it. It was resurrected in l949 as the United Nations. On your second point, wrong again. Baden-Powell noticed that his soldiers were not up to what needed to be done in the Boer War. The IDEA first started when he was in the military and saw a defeciency in British soldiers. The Boy Scouts were in response to this first observation. "But while in Mafeking cadets had had nothing to do with scouting they HAD been useful during the Siege, carrying messages and thus freeing for work in the trenches many adult riflemen who would otherwise have been needed for this orderly work. If members of Bristish cadet corps and brigades could do likewise, he told boys of Southport and Liverpool, 'THERE WOULD BE NO REASON WHY THEY SHOULD NOT TAKE THEIR PLACE IN OUR THIRD LINE IN DEFENDING OUR SHORES.'" "While conceding that the Brigade's 'greater virtue lay in training boys to become the best type of citizens', he urged his young audience to make themselves 'a strong force behind the Volunteers and the Army.' The Boy-Man, pg 360 The Brigades were started by a William Smith himself a soldier and a Christian. The boys were in uniforms and drilled. The author uses the term "young Christian soldiers". Ibid pg 361. The Scouting book itself has its predecessor a manual for the use in war and was developed during war. Men are warriors and boys are to be trained to their task. As to the merit badge "Citizenship for the World". I don't remember it. I don't have my sash with me and if I did; the first thing I would do is cut it off my sash and throw it away. Third point. One of the rules of Lord Baden-Powell was Loyal to King. Democracy always seeks to kill kings. Socialism seeks to destroy monarchy. One can not be loyal to king and then be a part of socialism. Socialism is anti-monarchical. I will be loyal to King.

Achilleez, One of the sayings on the Delphi temple is "Know yourself". It really is part of a longer wisdom saying "Know your human weakness in contrast with the power of the gods". We are humans not gods. But there is a god out there. When men have no god, they become gods. Faith in higher being is really necessary for manhood. Know your limitations. Know that you are created. Not eternal. We are immortal but not eternal. Humility is a V-I-Rtue. With faith in God, comes humility. Man knows his place in life and seeks not to usurp that of God. Know yourself and your place in it and that is righteousness, another V-I-Rtue. Know your human weakness (and that tells you, you can't be a God) In contrast with the power of the gods (who made all things and you.) You don't have to be a Christian to be in the BSA. Believe in Divine Providence, the Great Spirit. But nature does declare the presence and wisdom of God.

To those who pointed out that this merit badge was available in l972. I was also taught that we lived in a Democracy and believed such for a very long time. All these years of being decieved. Just like in Plato's cave sitting there staring at shadows and not knowing the truth. I climbed out of the cave and saw the Light. How all these adults have been lying to me and obscuring truth. I making sure my fellow scouts don't grow up as decieved as I was. On my honor I will do my best to do my duty to God and my Country Two points here. Duty to God. For the Christians in the BSA how does that square with the Marxist goal of One World government? Is this not an oxymoron? First I am supposed to have duty to God but then turn around and further the Marxist goal? This is an oxymoron. Second Duty to country. How can one do his duty to country when he is busy subsuming it into the One World Government? Another oxymoron! See we don't have the Doric mentality of harmony between word and action. I say the words and then do something else completely opposite. That's great that is called HYPOCRISY. If you are going to talk the talk, you better walk the walk. I pledge to do my duty to God and Country but then teach others and act to promote One World Government. It is plain that you don't know what it means to be men. Be true to yourselves and not say the scout oath, please. It is only a man that stands behind words. An effeminate can say one thing yet do the complete opposite. Here is another oxymoron. Marxist sociology is about effeminizing men. Yet supposedly the BSA program is about making men. That is why all this talk about the BSA being "about fun". Yes, keep them childlike and dumb and they will all kneel. You can't have it both ways. Either you will masculinize men or effeminize men. (This message has been edited by WHEELER)

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Because even back then, Lord Baden-Powell was under heavy criticism of his program. The military style of the Boy Scouts and their all male program at the time, evoked strong criticism in that country. Socialism has been brewing a long time their also. Now that is all fact above. This is my opinion. I believe that Lord Baden-Powell wilted under the heat of criticism and in order to allay his critics and present the program in a better light for it to be received, he compromised his principles. This was not his original intention I believe. Now. With modern scientific studies, and my own personal experiences and observations of others has coincided with those studies, it is dangerous to mix boys and women. Boys live on ideology. The ideal of manhood has got to be presented to them for them to know their destination as men. Without this they are rootless. Furthermore, studies in the classics have pointed in the same direction and so has Edith Hamilton. Lord Baden-Powell gave under pressure. I have before due to weakness of character and I wish I hadn't. Peer pressure is terrible either way.

The Boy Scouts of America are becoming more progressive and dropping old ideas because (1) their critics, (2) modern people don't understand concepts that were normal back then,(3) trying to 'fit in' with the times. Socialists and socialist ideology is making great headway in all areas of our culture. This is the last sentence in the post To be a Man. Laurie writes this: As a program post, I found no value in it. Had it originated as an issues post, it might have received fewer thumbs down. I would hope that you'd be more upfront and at least tackle issues as just that: your own opinion rather than as a Scouter who knows it all and is here to correct all of us who just can't seem to get it right. Bob White writes this: The mission of scouting is not to turn boys into men. How does one deliver a scouting program without understanding its purpose? Eamonn writes: Sorry I don't see your point. I have never looked at Scouting as training boys to be men. Even as a Scout Leader in Baden Powell's back yard we looked at Scouting as: The mental, Physical and spiritual development of the young person to become a worthwhile member of Society. I THINK WE HAVE A PROBLEM HOUSTON. My point still stands the Boy Scouts are becoming more progressive and dropping old ideas because (1) their critics, (2) modern people dont understand concepts that were normal back then and (3) trying to fit in the with the times. Socialist and socialist ideology and words is making great headway in the Boy Scouts of America. All my points are proven. To evmori: If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a duck. If it walks like a socialist, talks like a socialist, it's a communist. The BSA cannot serve two masters.

What is a merit badge on being a citizen of the world doing in the BSA? In the merit badge book on the etnic heritage of the USA is a chapter with picture of the United Nations!!!! With a merit badge book it is promulgating just like Antonio Gramsci has said, Change the culture, change the politics. Antonio Gramsci is alive and well in the BSA. Notice about anything lacking in the preceeding messages about boys to men. It is all in marxist gender neutral terms.(This message has been edited by WHEELER)

Benjamin Franklin is refering to Plato's Republic. There Socrates talks about the KYKLOS. (Cycle in proper English) It goes Monarchy, Constitutional Government, Democray, Tyranny. America went from Monarchy, To a Republic, is now a Democracy, Tyranny is the next step. What causes the turning is the character of men. When men change their character, the state does also. Rome started out; Monarchy, Republic, small interlude of left/right civil wars, Juluis Caesar stepped in and inaugurated 500 years of despotism. Where the government was god. God put man in the garden to "cultivate and keep". Benjamin Franklin said, "If you can keep". Keep means to guard. It means to be obedient. When men become effeminate, they can't keep anything. Democracy is the sign of nihilism and the lack of the rule of law. Benjamin Franklin is refering to keeping the Kyklos from turning. The wheel is spinning spinning spinning and ignorant and effeminate men can't stop it nor keep the Republic. Also picked up the merit badge book, "Citizenship in the Nation". pg 5. "The United States is a republic--citizens elect individuals to represent them". "---citizens elect individuals to represent them" is not a definition of a republic. This is false. A Scout is Trustworthy. One can't even trust the organization. pg 5 "The USA has evolved into the greatest democratic nation in the world." Really?? Where in the Federalist papers is democracy looked on with favor? No where. Among the classics? No where except at Athens. pg 5 "their democratic heritage". How about our Republican heritage? On page 32 of the booklet, it mentions social security. Can someone in the Boy Scout program please tell me where in section 8 of article I where the duty of the federal government is to take care of old people? Please someone. A Scout is Obedient. The 10th amendment reads, "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people". Taking care of old people are the responsibility of families NOT the federal government.

Just went down to the local store that sells Boy Scout paraphernalia. It is a block away from the library. I bought the merit badge book Citizenship in the World. What is going on in the Boy Scouts of America? What is the United Nations? The United Nations is the last step in the evolutionary process of political organization. All the workers of the world unite! was the cry of Karl Marx and Engels. In the book, One World (published by One World Publishing Co, Notre Dame, Ind. 1984), John C. Kiang traces this movement to socialism: As far as world unity is concerned, Marx and Engels were the pioneers who expounded that modern industry had furnished a real foundation for a world unity, and declared not only that working men have no country, but also that Communists are further reproached with desiring to abolish countries and nationalities. (Pg 248-9) Kiang footnotes these statements in his book: In this declaration Marx and Engels claimed that the struggle of the workers was international in essence. National differences, they pointed out, were being wiped out by the development of free trade, by the growth of a world market, and by the increasing uniformity of industrial and social conditions. The workers in particular were being denationalized by modern industry, and had no fatherland. (pg 248) Karl Marx wanted to do away with nation states and replace it with one global government. Alger Hiss wrote the constitution for the United Nations and was outed by Whitaker Chambers as an communist. Records released from the now defunct Soviet Union prove this right. Not only in that book but another book, Elements of Socialism by Spargo and Arner (MacMillan Co. NY. NY. 1925) discuss and elucidate the foundations, the philosophies, the strategies and the goals of socialism. It states that society evolves like mankind evolves and the final evolution of the political states of man is One World Government. This by the way was written in l925! Modern Socialism is essentially international.(page 202) The State is not abolished. It dies out. (page 213) On page 219, it says, The establishment of a World Economy must necessarily have the effect of softening the differences between nations and of bringing about something approaching a world federation. Is not NATO that world federation? ...how about the UN? There is a chart in that book, that does display that world government is the final evolution of the societies of man. Why on Gods green earth are the Boy Scouts of America participating in communist ideology???? Are these people so lost? It says in Psalm 1, v1: BLESSED IS THE MAN WHO HAS NOT WALKED IN THE COUNSEL OF THE UNGODLY, AND HAS NOT STOOD IN THE WAY OF SINNERS, AND HAS NOT SAT IN THE SEAT OF EVIL MEN. What are the Boy Scouts of America doing? They are walking in the counsel of the ungodlythe communists. The Boy Scouts of America are standing in the way of sinnerssocialists. The Boy Scouts of America are sitting with evil men!! The first thing that the Viet Cong did when they entered a village was kill all the Catholics. During the Greek civil war of the late 40s, communist forces went around killing all the Christians they could find. The Republican forces in the civil war of Spain in l939 killed all Catholics they could get their hands on. Over two hundred thousand Orthodox priests, monks, and nuns were slaughtered in the Communist purges of the 1920s and l930s. According to commission chairman Aleksander Yakovlev, most priests were shot or hanged, although Communist death squads crucified many on church doors and left others to freeze to death in winter after being stripped and soaked in water. In addition to those killed directly , Yakovlev confirms that another half-million priests and religious were imprisoned or deported to Siberia. In a top-secret message of March 1922 to the Politburo, Lenin urged frenzied and ruthless energy in seizing church properties, and called for current famine and disease to be exploited in removing enemies of the regime. As many representative of the reactionary clergy as possible should be shot, Lenin commanded, in order to teach opponents of communism such a lesson that they will not dare to think about any resistance whatsoever for several decades. (First Things, May l996, pg 87) In the French revolution, the forces of revolution, the socialists, stuck Christian babies on pitch forks. Book of Sirach: 13.17 What fellowship hath the wolf with the lamb? What agreement is there between the hyenna and the dog? This is the principle of non-contradiction. God set up nation states. God destroyed the Tower of Babel. These people seek to rebuild it. The United Nations is a communist organization. Its values are opposed to all of Christian teachings. There is even a chapter on International Law. There is no such thing as International Law unless there is an International King! The Boy Scouts of America subscribes to the Gospel of Karl Marx and is teaching its boys to be little Marxists.(This message has been edited by WHEELER)(This message has been edited by WHEELER)(This message has been edited by WHEELER)

"Puberty rituals are mainly an enactment of the psychological seperation that the boy must achieve from his mother. The three stages that van Gennep identified, seperation, transition, and incorporation are visible in these ceremonies. Among the Australian Kurnai, the pattern of seperation is to make a momentous change in the boy's life; the past is to be cut off from him by a gulf that he can never repass. His connection with his mother as her child is broken off, and he becomes henceforth attached to the men." The initiate is often considered dead. he is often whipped and mutilated to remove him from ordinary society,and van Gennep understands the Jewish rite of circumcision in this context. The Jewish boy is set apart from Gentiles and women by a mutilation that is also a seperation of the flesh from the body. Only after this separation can he join the community of Israel." Pg 48-49 of the Church Impotent. Male identity must be established in boys. All older primitive cultures saw the need for this. They OBSERVED how boys can be destroyed by the feminine influence. Modern man has become weak and blind and encourages effeminancy because it doesn't have to fight for anything anymore.

Still no one can figure out why Benjamin Franklin said, "A Republic, if you can keep it". What does he mean "If you can keep it"? What is he referring to? It is obvious that 2300 year old dead men did have an impact on the Founding Fathers. One person I think Adrianvs even said he studied Plato. The current opinion is that we don't have to listen to dead men, yet this was not the opinion of the Founding Fathers. How can one understand this country and its government, if moderns reject what the Founding Fathers accepted? What does this mean "If you can keep it?" I ask you to read your book in Genesis what other word was used for the reason God put man in the Garden? There is a correlation here.(This message has been edited by WHEELER)

Thanks for all the feedback.

In regards to those who think the Bible has no meaning because it is 2000 years old. St. Paul quotes from the Bible saying "Do not muzzle the ox while he is treading the grain." He says this at ICor 9.9 and I Tim 5.18. He is quoting from Deut. 25.4. He says that "It was written for our sake". St. Paul says "All scripture" is to be used. Not parts and pieces of it. St. Augustine said, "If you believe what you like in the Gospel, and reject what you like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself." Menander said the same thing, "If you judge the gods, you have become gods." (paraphrased.) Scripture is the sword of truth. Why not use it? Jesus was very careful to fulfill all parts of scripture that pertained to him. He said many times, "so that the scriptures may be fulfilled...." again "So that the scriptures may be fulfilled...." He said, "The heavens and the earth will pass away but not any word, jot, or tittle will pass from the scriptures. Jesus said, "Man does not live by bread alone but by EVERY word that proceeds from the mouth of God shall man live." St. Paul quoted from scriptures that were 1000 years or much older than him. St. Paul used scriptures and Jesus obeyed the scriptures unlike many men today.

To Old Grey Eagle: I have read in a post in the Scout History section or somewhere in this thread about BP making those comments. I am at a School Library and do not have audio but I am aware of those comments. What I ask the community to do is to read four books. The Communist Manifesto which opposes the teaching of Scripture. Karl Marx promotes equality and therefore, feminism. St. Paul, as I have quoted in the post "The Training of Boys to be Men" states the opposite. The references to feminism in the Communist Manifesto points to a fact that it is a part of Marxist sociology. The next two are "The Church Impotent" and "Sex Differences". They both point to where boys are repelled by the feminine. Truth does not contradict truth. BP was not perfect but his program can be perfected. "To do our best" is a mentality of constant improvement. Do you recognize that women and their influence are quite dangerous to manhood and manliness in boys? The next book is "Leadership is Male". It is strictly a Christian work. Before we talk any further on this subject and yell at one another why don't we read things first. I have read these books. If you have read something with this regard inform me and I will do some reading. BP like Plato was corrected by Aristotle and both were corrected by Christianity, can be corrected thru scientific and more classical studies. Next to Bob White, I saw your post in this thread where you stated that the BSA is not about training boys to men. You assault me having anything to say because I have not participated in this program but you have participated and yet you bear false witness or you are just plain ignorant so your premise about me falls flat on its face. And to Adrianvs: There are two scriptures. There are two pillars of truth. Consistency is the criteria of truth and I am showing parallels between the two. Your approach to philosophy is not the same approach of the ancients. They quoted their ancient literature and wisdom sayings of their "primitive" religion to prove points. Truth is truth. (This message has been edited by WHEELER)

"Although history is fascinating, you really should live in the now and not the then." If one says the Pledge of Allegiance, what should one be pledging to? What you are telling me, is that words have no meaning? What you are telling me is that we should accept ignorance and imprecision of detail and definition? You are a leader? Then I give a statement from Benjamin Franklin. Someone ran up to him outside the convention and asked him, "What government are you going to give us?" Mr. Franklin replied, "A republic, if you can keep it." What is he refering to?

Thank you Old Grey Eagle. I was in a rush and from the edit, I could not scroll down and find it, so I guessed at it. My apologies. Irregardless of MacAlveny's authorship, the article shows what is going on today. If you don't want to take from MacAlveny, then read, as I have been corrected, Alexander Solzhenitsyn. This modality is alive and well everywhere. Just like computers are infected with viruses, so is this society infected.

I am an Orthodox Christian. I use the text that was common among all the early Christians. Most of the early Christians used the Septuagint. One can order this online just type in Septuagint. I use "The Septuagint Version; Greek and English with Apocrypha". from Samuel Bagster and Sons Limited, 4 New Bridge Street, London. My copy was printed in Great Britian. The Orthodox Church considers the Septuagint an inspired translation. There is a seperate book of wisdom and ecclesiasticus in the apocrypha section. These are considered by both the Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches as inspired scripture. The bible found at St. Catherine monastery by the Protestant Bible scholar included these books. Firstpusk and Old Grey Eagle want to slander the messanger because of the message. But notice the author at the beginning refers to Alexander Scholzentizen. This famous Russian philosopher sees the same thing. The references are at the beginning of that article.(This message has been edited by WHEELER)

There is quite a bit of discrepancy about what a Republic is. Some say it is a parliamentary democracy, others a constitutional democracy, and still others a representative democracy. All these statements are wrong. A Republic is a term coined by Cicero. It is from two Latin words Res(things) and Publica(public). Transliterated from the Latin; it means the public things. But there is another word that our Founding Fathers knew that also typifies this type of government. It is from the Greek and it is politevma. St. Paul uses it twice in the New Testament. Both Cicero and the New Testament (and the Bible in general) had great influence in the formation of America. In Philippians 3:20, St. Paul says, "But our commonwealth is in heaven, ". St. Paul uses the word "politevma'. It is translated into the old English word, the commonwealth. A commonwealth is another word for a republic. Massachusetts, Kentucky and others are not states; their official name is Commonwealths. St. Paul uses this word again in Eph 2.12 when he refers to the state of the Chosen People as the commonwealth of Israel. What is he describing here? God is the King and the judges were the aristocracy, through merit, that governed Israel. And the Law of God, the Torah, ruled the people. The prophet Samuel tried to keep the republic by unsuccessfully dissuading the people from making a monarchy. He is describing a government that is mixed of three elements and a particular mentality. Cicero also terms the republic like this as a mixed form of constitution. (1) A republican form of government is a mixture of the best elements of the three forms of government; the monarchy, the aristocracy and the democracy. Poli in the Greek word means `many'. The period of the judges in Hebrew history is a 'politevma'. A 'Politevma' is the Greek word for constitutional government. This word is used by Aristotle in his book, Politics, to describe a Republican form of government. Aristotle records that some people assert that the best constitution must be a combination of all the forms of constitution, therefore praise the constitution of Sparta. (2) He further remonstrates that the better the constitution is mixed, the more permanent it is. (3) The definition he gives for this kind of government is a POLITEIAN; the form intermediate between them which is termed a republic, (mesi de touton in kalousi politeian)for the government is constituted from the class that bears arms. (4) Again, Aristotle states that constitutional government is, to put it simply, a mixture of oligarchy and democracy. (5) Polybius (as also Plato and Aristotle) distinguishes that there are three types of governments "kingship, aristocracy, democracy". Furthermore, like Aristotle, he goes on to state that the best constitution is that "which partakes of all these three elements". (6) "The first to construct a constitution--that of Sparta--on this principle", Lycurgus, with some inspiration from his fellow Doric brothers in Crete (7) created a government that combined an hereditary kingship with body of advisors from the aristocracy and another that represented the rest of the people (the democracy), all being checks and balances on each other. Polybius concludes saying: "The result of this combination has been that the Lacedaemonians retained their freedom for the longest period of any people." (8) and "for securing unity among the citizens, for safeguarding the Laconian territory and preserving the liberty of Sparta inviolate, the legislation and provisions of Lycurgus were so excellent that I am forced to regard his wisdom as something superhuman." (9) The American constitution was derived from Cicero. Michael Grant explicates the significance of Cicero: "This 'mixed' constitution, previously admired by the historian Polybius (to whom Cicero's debts were extensive), reappeared again and again in early discussions of the constitution of the United States of America, figuring prominently, for example, in John Adam's Defense of the Constitutions of Government of the United States (1787). (10) Coining the term "Republic", Cicero was familiar with Dicaearchus of Messana who wrote a treatise on the mixed constitution of Sparta, the Tripoliticus. (11) Dicaerchus was greatly admired by Cicero. Cicero provides the knowledge train of this history of the tri-political government: This type of discussion, which I am undertaking, derives most of its material from that other philosophical school, of which Plato, was the leader. The men who came after him, Aristotle and Heraclides of Pontus, another follower of Plato, threw light on the whole topic of national constitutions through the inquiries they conducted. Moreover, as you know, Theophrastus, Aristotles disciple SPECIALIZED in this type of investigation; and ANOTHER OF ARISTOTLES PUPILS, DICAEARCHUS, WAS ACTIVE IN THE SAME FIELD OF STUDY. (12) Aristotle does not use the word democracy and republic interchangeably. Neither does Socrates in Plato's Republic. They are quite different institutions. A republic is the rule of law. "...it is preferable for the law to rule rather than any one of the citizens, and according to this same principle, even if it be better for certain men to govern, they must be appointed as guardians of the laws and in subordination to them;... the law shall govern seems to recommend that God and reason alone shall govern..." (13) A democracy puts the people above the law. Aristotle noted, "men ambitious of office by acting as popular leaders bring things to the point of the people's being sovereign even over the laws." (14) The mentalities of these two styles of government are very different and it is an important distinction. Aristotle says in V vii 7 that "constitutional government turns into a democracy". Then, all three, Socrates, Plato and Aristotle warn that, "Tyranny, then arises from no other form of government than democracy." "And Huey Long very penetratingly said that when fascism came to the United States it would call itself democracy". (15) What is the example of this tri-political form of Government in the Constitution? The Presidency is the element of the monarchical office. The House of Representatives is the element of democracy. But what element represents the aristocracy? It was supposed to be the Senate! Originally planned, the senate was supposed to be filled by appointments from the states legislators. The Senate, as originally defined, was supposed to be the inclusion of the natural aristocracy, the landed gentry, AND a representation of states interests, as a corporate entity, in the Federal Government. The Senate was supposed to be a check and balance against the Presidency and the Demos, the House of Representatives. The Senate was supposed to be the real GUARANTEE of the rule of law. The Senate was supposed to be the backbone of the U.S. Constitution. This all changed in l913. Along with the passage of an constitutional amendment of the graduated income tax an idea from Karl Marxs Communist Manifesto, another constitutional amendment was passed. The passage of the XVII amendment fundamentally changed the character of the American government, demolished the checks and balances necessary for good government and converted the American government from a Republic to a democracy. There is now no check on the demos. This is the necessity of a bi-carmel legislative house; i.e. the senate and the representatives. In Article III, sec 4, it states, The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government What does this mean (and is not being practiced or obeyed today)? The Senators of the respective state houses should be appointed by the seats of county government. These appointees should be men of outstanding rank and stature, landed, and knowledgeable; the aristocracy. The States Senate should be not only the representation of the natural aristocracy but also representation of the counties in the State Government. As it stands today, federal governments and state governments are not practicing a tri-political government. All human institutions and nature mirror this republican form of government: i.e. the family; father-king, mother-aristocracy, children-demos(16) / the military; officer-king, non-commissioned officers(i.e. Corporals, Sergeants, Gunnery Sgt. etc)-aristocracy, enlisted(Privates, PFC, Lance Corporals)-demos/ Factories; plant manager-king, foremen-aristocracy, workers-demos/ Hospitals; doctor-king, nurse-aristocracy, patients-demos/ Christianity; bishop-king, priests deacons-aristocracy, laity-demos/ Christianity; Jesus-King, clergy-aristocracy, laity-demos/ Nature of the cell; nucleus-king, mitochondria-aristocracy, cytoplasm-demos/ Nature of the body; brain-king, spinal cord-aristocracy, organs and muscles-demos. There is a famous saying in the Military that the Non-commissioned officers are the backbone of the U.S. Military just like on many a family farm, (that I have witnessed) it is the woman that is the hardest working member. The aristocracy is needed in every organization. What is an aristocracy? An aristocracy is the combination of two Greek words: Aristos means the best and kratos means power. Kratos is the same ending for the word democracy. The aristocracy is needed in every human organization. Could the U.S. military operate without a non-commissioned officer corps? Could a family operate well without a mother? Neither can a society operate without an aristocracy. The aristocracy are the professionals in society. Those that exhibit the BEST characteristics of citizenry. They lead by example. This tripartite paradigm is throughout reality. And just like Aristotle says that nature gives evidence of the metaphysical this really is a natural proof of the existence of the Trinity. The Family is One but three persons; the Army is One but of three classes; etc and so forth. There is One God but three Divine Persons. American institutions do not come from Athens but from Sparta, which was heavily influenced by Crete. Just as Crete gave the name of Europe, she is also the birthplace of 'mixed'/constitutional government. Plato discerned that Persia and Athens show the fundamental elements of all political life exaggerated as far as possible in one direction and the other(the one monarchical, the other democratic)the merit of Sparta is that she has been trying to blend them, and has therefore maintained herself for a long time. (17) A republic is really the golden mean between the extremes of democracy and Asian monarchical despotism. These extremes are physical manifestations of the spiritual condition of the state. A Democracys mentality is that the people are sovereign over the laws, which really means that the people are God and the Asian despotism, which was taken up by Alexander the Great, his successors and the Roman Emperors starting with Julius Caesar, is that the king or Emperor makes the law so he is God. Werner Jaeger makes it clear that this is what Socrates sees that A state is never power alone, but always the spiritual structure of the man whom it represents. (18) Both of these extremes show the marks of nihilism. In Conclusion Mixed government goes by two English names: Republic or Commonwealth. A Republic is a form of government that has mixed the best elements of a monarchy, aristocracy and democracy. A Republic is tri-political government. It includes all classes in government and excludes none. It provides checks and balances on all so that all live in harmony. A Republic is an harmony of the state. (1) Cicero, On Government, translated by Michael Grant, Penguin Books, NY, l993. On the State, 23-4; pg 180. (2) Aristotle, Politics, Loeb Classical Library, Harvard University Press, Cambridge, Mass, 1932 bk II iii 10; 1265b 30-35; Pg 107. (3) Ibid, Bk IV x 4; 1297a 5-10; Pg 339. (4) Ibid, Bk II iii 9; 1265b 25; Pg 105 (5) Ibid, Bk IV vi 2; 1293b 30-35; Pg 315 (6) The Portable Greek Historians: The Essence of Herodotus, Thucydides, Xenophon, Polybius; edited by M. I. Finley, The Viking Press, NY, NY, l959. Polybius bk VI sec 3; Pg 475 (7) Plutarch, The Lives, trans by John Dryden, rev. by Arthur Clough, The Modern Library, NY. Pg 52. (8) Finley, Pg 482 (9) Ibid, Bk V sec. 48; Pg 493 (10) Cicero, On Government, Pg 7 (in the footnote) (11) Ibid, On Laws III 14-15; Pg 200. (12) Ibid, Pgs 199-200 (13) Aristotle, Politics, XXI, trans. by H. Rackham, Loeb Classical Library, Harvard University Press, Cambridge, MA, l990. Politics Bk III, xi3-5; 1287a; Pgs 263-265. (14) Ibid, Politics, Bk V. iv 6; 1305a 30-35; pg 401. (15) Liberty or Equality, Kurt von Kuenhelt-Leddihn, Christendom Press, pg 123. (16) On Divorce, Louis de Bonald, trans by Nicholas Davidson, Transaction Publishers, New Brunswick, NJ, l992. pg 45-46. He uses the words power, minister, and subject. The Christian religion itself, which I shall never cite in the course of this work except to show its conformity with reason calls man the reason, the head, the power of woman: Vir caput est mulieris, says Saint Paul. It call the woman the helper or minister of man: Let us make man, says Genesis, a helper similar to him. It call the child a subject, since it tells it, in a thousand places, to obey its parents. (17) Padeia, The Ideals of Greek Culture, Werner Jaeger, translated by Gilbert Highet, Oxford University Press, NY, l944. Vol III, pg 236. References to Platos Laws 693d-e (18) Ibid, Vol III, pg 234.

There are always exceptions to the rule. Yes, I know there are examples out there in the bioshpere but they are few and far between. Generally, most people are exposed to farm animals and predators. I have never seen homosexual acts in animals. Do I see roosters humping other roosters? No Cattle? NO Horses? NO Cats? NO Do dogs hump one's legs? yes but has this been caused because the dogs have been spayed or neutered? Who knows. Yes, in the jungles and oceans of the world, I read the article in the recent magazine, one can find cases. EXCEPTIONS does not make the rule. The general does. But if remember right, when the choice is open to procreate the animals procreate. Homosexual men leave women and hang exclusively to other men. They seek death. In order to continue their society, they must recruit. The recruit other effeminate men who are unsure of their sexuality and manliness. Homosexuality always erupts in cities. In the country, when a country man, usually of low intelligence, and CAN NOT CONTROL HIMSELF, will use bestiality. As John Adams said, "All men are cracked."

This is an excerpt of two pages from The McAlveny Intelligence Advisor, January, l993 pg2-3 Has the incredible transformation of American traditions and values, of our government, and our whole way of life over the past two decades happened spontaneously, or by accident? No! There have been powerful forces behind the scenes orchestrating and manipulating the transformation of America according to a well laid out plan that has been in operation for many decades, if not centuries. As Igor Shafarevich wrote in his excellent essay Socialism In Our Past And Future and Alexander Solzhenitsyn wrote in From Under the Rubble, the destruction of religion and the family are central to socialist ideology. The socialists, internationalists, and communists of the world (they no longer call themselves communists) are now following the revolutionary strategy of Antonio Gramsci the late founder of the Italian Communist party and a Marxist theoretician who died in 1937. (Franklin Sanders wrote in detail recently about Gramscis strategy in his Moneychanger Newsletter (P.O. Box 341753, Memphis, TN 38184.) After spending time in the Soviet Union in the 1920s, Gramsci concluded that the clenched fist revolutionary approach of the Bolsheviks was not a winning strategy, but that socialism (i.e., communism) would triumph through the reshaping of consciousness in society. Gramsci, concluding that the cultural superstructure determines the political and economic base and not the other way around, wrote: In a developed society, the passage to socialism occurs neither by putsch [ED. NOTE: A sudden revolt or uprising] nor by direct confrontation, but by the transformation of ideas, which is to say, a slow reshaping of consciousness. At stake in this war of positions is the culture (i.e., the source of values and ideas). The seizure of political power is not possible until after the seizure of cultural power. Culture is transformed through government (and its agencies), schools, universities, social sciences, trade unions, churches, and the print and broadcast media. In essence, Gramsci said the socialist revolution would be brought about by the transformation of a societys culture and values, not through political or military power. By changing the values and very mode of thinking of the enemies of socialism without their conscious knowledge, they would become socialisms allies. We are not talking about a communist revolution or military takeover in the traditional sense, but a wholly different danger: the establishment of radical socialism by the undermining and transformation of traditional Western values. [ED. NOTE: And that is precisely what the socialists in the American government, universities (and lower schools), media, Hollywood, churches, etc. have systematically done over the past two to three decades. They have been preparing Americans for acceptance of a socialist/Nazi/Marxist-Leninist-style police state and to willingly become slaves by undermining our culture from top to bottom. And this is the great danger of the Clinton Administration. It is likely to continue the Bush/Wall Street economic policies, but is rapidly going to culturally transform America and its values to conform to the Gramsci strategy. The whole process took only about 14 years in South Africa which now stands on the brink of a socialist/communist abyss.] Gramsci articulated the importance of Lenins Long march through the institutions (i.e., the penetration of the media, the universities, public interest groups, churches, and cultural institutions) stressing that by working through such institutions, cultural values could be altered and morals softened irreversibly, setting the stage for political and economic power to drop into the hands of the Left (as it has done over the past decade or so, and will do like an avalanche under Bill and Hillary Clinton and Al Gore). According to Gramsci once socialism dominates the cultural and ideological scene, revolutionary power and control by the state will quickly follow in one short easy step. The strategy of the socialists then, is to change the way society thinks about problems to gain control over the minds of the population. An essential element of Gramscis strategy was to replace the religious (or Christian) inclinations in a targeted society with a social gospel (i.e., a Marxist-Christian dialogue, liberation theology, etc.) which is totally devoid of all supernatural content. Gramsci did not want to destroy religion, but rather to neutralize all spiritual aspects and use what remains as a vehicle for the pollitical struggle and socialism. Worship, faith, prayer, the sacraments would be replaced with what Gorbachev calls human values, human solidarity, abolition of social injustice, and the end to oppression of women, children, blacks, native peoples, homosexuals, the disabled, etc. Gramsci therefore strategized a convergence of religion and socialism and a takeover of the entire field where culture is elaborated and diffused (i.e., schools, universities, the media, Hollywood, etc.). Following Gramscis strategy, the socialists of our day (in America, Europe, South Africa, and throughout the West) have developed a superstructure reflecting socialist culture replete with socialist literature, films, plays, poetry, and various forms of art and music. The stage is now set in America (and throughout much of the West) where the closet communists are ready to build more openly upon this well-established superstructure. It is important to note that the new thinking in the old Soviet Union (CIS); the New South Africa of F.W. de Klerk and Pik Botha; the New Covenant of Bill and Hillaiy Clinton, Al Gore, and their entourage of socialist advisors and staffers, is based either directly or indirectly on the writings and strategies of Antonio Gramsci. [ED. NOTE: I should be remembered that Bill Clinton has studied under and highly praised Italian socialists and communists. (See the November 92 ML4 for details); and it should also be remembered that many of Clintons top advisors come from the Institute for Policy Study, an influential socialist group which follows the agenda of the Marxists and Gramscians.] This writer is reminded of a quote by John Stratchey, the former head of the British Labor Socialist Party and a communist, who said in the 1930s: There cannot be a direct transition from capitalism to communism. First we must move to socialism, as a necessary stepping stone to communism. Sun Tsu, the Chinese military strategist, wrote in 50 B.C. that to conquer your enemy, you must destroy their will to resist. Of course, that will is destroyed if you can convert your enemy without him ever knowing it. Eventually, it becomes impossible to oppose socialism. In 1984, Orwell said that the purpose of the new language, Newspeak, was to make opposition to Big Brother impossible to even conceive. Anyone who failed to embrace the politically correct socialist mentality was, by definition, mentally ill. It was not enough to destroy Winston Smith. It was necessary to turn him to the point where he would love Big Brother. So, in the 1990s, America is plunging rapidly into ~Antonio Gramscis socialist quagmire not by accident but by clever, well-orchestrated and well financed design. Behind this socialist transformation of America (culturally, socially, politically, and economically) is the Liberal Eastern Establishment (epitomized by the socialist/globalist Trilateral Commission, Council on Foreign Relations, Club of Rome, Bilderbergers, Fabian Socialists, Socialist International, etc. Behind these groups is probably the centuries old Illuminati, with its occultjc/Luciferian substructure. The Clinton Administration, the Bush Administration, and the Carter Administration are (or were) wholly owned by these socialist/globalist groups, and the Nixon, Ford, and Reagan Administrations were partially owned by same. Their goal: the emersion of America (and the West) into a socialist world government called the New World Order, on or before the year 2000. Elements of his socialist New World Order include a global financial ,system replete with a one world Central Bank and currency, global currency controls, and eventually a cashless, computerized society); one world environmental control (replete with a global Environmental Protection Agency which can track down and punish corporate or individual environmental criminals); a one world educational system (to prepare the citizens of the world to think politically correct i.e., as socialists, slaves, and citizens of the New World Order); a one world economic system; one world population control (which will be anti-family, anti-reproduction, anti-children, and pro-homosexual, and which will lead the charge globally for abortion, euthanasia, and other population control measures). Also included is a one world police force, now called the New World Army (under the control of the United Nations), designed to keep the peace globally, eliminate global dictators (or resisters to the New World Order), and enforce global socialism and world government. The U.N.s New World Army (pushed so hard by George Bush over the past two years) is establishing itself as the world police force, first in Operation Desert Storm, next in Somalia, next back in Iraq, and next in Serbia/Croatia/Bosnia and/or South Africa (where it is likely to be sent to install the communist ANC in power). Eventually, it is envisioned that New World Army (U.N.) troops will be sent anywhere in the world (even into America) to stamp out resistance to the New World Order. There is a supernatural (occultic) dimension to the New World Order, called by some the New Age Movement (and epitomized by Maurice Strong, Shirley MacLane, Jane Fonda, Ted Turner, John Denver, Zbigniew Brezezinski, George Thousand Points of Light Bush, Al Gore, Hillary Clinton, the Dahli Lama, and a cast of millions worldwide), which also promises world government and sharp population reduction by the year 2000 the Dawning of the Age of Aquarius. Herein lies the interesting paralel to the supernatural, occultic underpinnings of the Nazi Third Reich. The McAlvany Intelligence Advisor, P.O. Box 84904, Phoenix, Arizona 85071

Achlleez why should we follow your opinion. Are you greater than God? Why should I do as you say? Because you "feel" so The Bible is the moral teaching of God. It is not an opinion but an authority. II Tim 3:16 "ALL scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction and for training in righteousness." Righteousness is a V-I-R tue. Scripture is an authority. Not man's opinion. You are even trying to tell us not to use it. St. Paul says to use it. What's the difference between you and him? The Bible condemns homosexuality consistently. Plato condemns Homosexuality. "I mean to pronounce it wrong that the male should have to do carnally with youthful male as with female--and to fetch his evidence from the life of the animals, pointing out that male does not touch male in this way because THE ACTION IS UNNATURAL. (Laws 836c) "Everyone must censure the unmanliness of the one party, who surrenders to his lusts because he is too weak to offer resistance, and reproach the other--the impersonator of the female. (Laws 836e) Philosophy also backs this up. God is male. God begets. He doesn't receive anything. Because he is perfect. Anything that receives is weak. In the sex act, the woman receives while the man begats. The act of the male is to beget. The act of the woman is to receive. In homosexuality the man becomes female in order to receive. Homosexuality is the inversion of the natural order and an attack upon the very essence of what it means to be a man. That is why the left like it. Plato says "Lawless as most men are". (Laws 838a) Homosexuality is lawlessness. Without order.

The first three principles of leadership is: Know yourself Know your job Set the example. Tell me Do you know your job? Without knowledge how do you know you are not really doing harm? What studies has the BSA done and what scientific knowledge does it educate the leaders here on the "training of boys to men"? Obviously, you do not know. Ignorance kills. Do I follow somebody, who doesn't know what he is doing? Set the example. How important is this for a boy? What example is being set? No woman can set the example of what it means to be a man. No woman has what it takes to do that. This is why men are so apathetic and are turning to escapism, women are taking over everywhere. Churches that have women soon lose the men. What man wants to be led by a woman? You are who you follow. Dictated to by a woman. How can a woman sharpen a man into being a man? Impossible. You are who you imitate. It is clear that the Boy Scouts of America does not KNOW its job and its importance. This is the shining example of the incompetance. What is incompetance? Ignorance of knowledge. A scout is loyal. Loyal to what? nothing anymore. All the tribal societies that Baden Powell saw had some training for boys that modern society has lost. He restored that mission with the Boy Scout program. No, we let women who covet being men instead of being women, join to become psuedo males. Covet is envy. Envy is hate. Women always covet the man's position. It is called penis-envy. This modality is evident in Feminism where the female is going to usurp the position of the male and the male retreats into childishness, and effeminancy. Just like Adam. Feminism is the embodiment of that hate. Thou shalt not covet. For God created man to be immortal, and made him to be an image of his own eternity. NEVERTHELESS THROUGH ENVY OF THE DEVIL CAME DEATH INTO THE WORLD: AND THEY THAT ARE OF HIS SIDE DO FIND IT. Wisdom Septuagint 2.23-24 The devil coveted. Women covet the place of man. Death follows.

JUST FOUND THIS POST. OPINIONS OPINIONS OPINIONS. There is very little "knowledge" in this whole thread. "I feel this... "I feel that.. Sound like a bunch of women. Why don't you read the Communist Manifesto where Karl Marx calls for Feminism? Why don't you people read? Too tough for you? I give you some books for you since you don't have any knowledge whatsoever. The Church Impotent; The Feminization of the Church Leon Podles. Very scholary and informative of male pyschology Sex Differences, Modern Biology and the Unisex Fallacy by Yves Christian. Leadership is Male. You are what you follow. If you follow Marxism, you are a Marxist. Feminism is the ideology of Marxism! Are you all that decieved? Judases! (This message has been edited by WHEELER)