SSScout

My, My , My,...

Aside from "male role model issues" (or is defining THAT part and parcel with this discussion?)

BP in his original program had 8 or 10 boys bunk together in ONE BIG TENT. Adult leaders tented WAAAY over there...

Now, usually, we have TWO boys in ONE tent, many times. Adults are NOT permitted to bunk with the boys, unless they are Dad or...?mom? WHAT BOY IN HIS RIGHT MIND would want to bunk with his mom???(please, mom, no offence intended. But "what would the guys think??") So...

The adults bunk in their own tents (?one?two?...) WAAAAY over there.

And where is the difficulty? Potty issues are easily dealt with, with shovel, screening and "zoning" declarations. And I know ALL Scouts and their leaders are "Ladies and Gentlemen" in their Language AND their Actions...(...Courteous...)

Isn't the umpteenth point of the Scout Law "A Scout is Loving and Respectful of his Mother?" I know MY boy knows that part of the Law, from my example AND direction...

....and not just HIS mother, but anyone elses...

So where is the problem, ultimately, if one politely points out the truth of a matter?

ScoutScooter, y'all have fun, now, hear?

YiS

"Tennyson, anyone?", said the literate lobber.

Thank you, OGE. I knew it was one o' them poetical fellas.

I'm sorry "The Raven" has nothing to do with horse stuff. I'd add that to the poe-tical feedbag.

Did BP mention Kipling anywhere?

YiS(This message has been edited by SSScout)

"AYE... Stick to the CODE..."

"Waaall, actually, we tink of it more like a set o' 'guidelines'..."

YiP

I doubt if our troop could operate as actively as it does if we strictly delineated the SM/ASM group function from the TC group functions. Boy Led? Certainly, as much as possible, but...

Our treasurer is a Patrol Dad. The Fund Raiser is an ASM.

The CC was a Troop Dad, but his son graduated out some years ago. We are very grateful for his experience and leadership. All are "trained". The Advancement Chair is not anything else, his son is a 2C. Another Cmem is the Pioneer MBC. I could go on. Any parent who wishes to attend a TCom meeting is more than welcome. The adult Troop officers come from the cadre of dads (and moms) who put themselves out for the boys. As an ASM, I attend the TCom and I doubt if anyone would not call me a member of the TCom, certainly not my SM.

Any parent (or Gparent!) who wishes to come along on a hike or campout or other activity certainly is welcome. Our boys enjoy the extra recognition(?), and yes, the adult camp serves as a training ground for the less experienced adults AND an example for the Scouts "over there". ("gee mr. J, how'd you do that?")

YiS

I think it depends on whether National has your email address. If you like, call them up (if you can find their phone number) and make sure the person who answers the phone connects you with the "Scouting E News" editor ( if any will admit to being same).

Now joust wait a minute...

YiS

Yep, me too. Just opened it this morning. I somehow found it significant that the third button in the top row said "donate".

But it is nice to be remembered. I don't see the 'Vol" Number thing important, they are just opening up and adding people to their list.

If I can recycle newspapers and 'gimmees' that come in the surface mail, I can recycle (?) this too after its consideration.

YiS.

This is third hand coming from me, but...

I once heard of a Tiger Den that held its meeting at a Starbucks. The adults all ordered a Latte, etc., they pushed the tables together, had an opening, did a craft, some Scout stuff, a closing, pushed the tables back and left in 30 minutes; all to the amusement of the staff and the few customers. They reportedly picked the SLOW part of the afternoon, checked out with the manager before hand. (("just so everybody buys something..."))

When my wife and I did Tigers and Wolves, we made it a point to try and go to "exotic " places on occasion, having a meeting at a picnic ground or even at the fire house (with advance planning) rather than just our dining room or porch. (not counting "field trips").

Be open to new possibilities!

YiS

So we went from fashion to Longfellow? Not a bad transition.

I love to sturrup things every so often.

YiS

Perhaps from one of the "private" boy (and girl!) organizations run by churches like the Seventh Day Adventists and others? I think one goes by the name "Pioneers", but they often call themselves 'scouts' (here we go again). I saw a church ( I forget the denomination) marching in the last 4th of July parade that had uniforms with black piping.

1))The Totin' Chip as an earned patch dates AT LEAST to 1960. (Guess how I know that?). Back then, it was white with red border and red lettering and a red axe . I have since seen at least four different designs saying "Totin'Chip": another red on white, and three red on tan. The patch was to be worn on the right pocket flap, until one was OA, when the OA flap would be worn on right pocket flap OVER the T/C. The idea of tearing off a corner of your award card for an unsafe act is a Troop affectation. In our old Troop, if your stupidity warranted attention, your T/C was summarily revoked and one had to re-earn it. Now, how is it that we do Axe Throwing contests at Camporee?

2)) The Firemans Chit is new. Red on Tan, it denotes knowledge and skill in fire building and safety. Same corner cutting idea in some Troops if one "plays with fire". Also worn on the right pocket flap in most Troops, and so one can get a thick right pocket flap.

3)) The Whittlin'chip, for Cubs, is special. It is mentioned, in passing, only once in the Bear book, I believe, and then one has to go hunting to find any guidance about requirements. When I taught it to my Webelos, I used mostly my own knowledge of knives and Safe handling and proper sharpening. We carved soap figures. Messy but clean. As a patch. it is specifically NOT worn on the uniform (don't know why. The book states it so.) Wear it on your award vest.

4)) When I earned more than one tempo patch (from summer camps and Camporees, etc.) I learned to sew them back to back with a ribbon loop, and thus hang two at once that I could flip over if so moved.

Same idea with the nifty new plastic hangers one can get. Stuff two appropriately shaped patches in'em and turn 'em over occassionally.

Also see "Treasure of the Sierra Madres" with Humphrey Bogart for more guidance on ""Badges"" *wink*wink*

YiS

"Layer Cake Dinner"

A good layer of coals, or a small even fire

A Dutch oven or deep cast iron skillet and lid

Spread out i/2 pound bacon in the bottom of the skillet. Next,

Spread out i/2 inch deep hamburg. Next,

Spread out 3 medium onions, peeled, sliced 1/4 inch thick. Next,

Spread out 3 largish potatoes, washed, "eyed", (leave skin on if washed well), sliced 1/4 inch thick. Next,

Spread out 3 largish carrots, washed, "ended", sliced 1/4 inch thick.

Next,

Put Cover on it. Put on heat. Wait 30 to 40 minutes. Keep steam coming out. It is HARD to burn the contents, but it can be done if you try.

Serve with big spoon. S&P to taste.

Notes: Don't forget to "soap" the outside of the skillet to facilitate cleanup. Camp stove can be used...The contents will shrink slightly, so the top can be put on a FULL skillet.

If you are of Italian extraction, add a tomato layer and oregano

(get a deeper skillet)

YiS

Elevetyumpteen years ago, I became my troops first Eagle. This was due to several dynamics (aside from my own desire and drive), which I'll not go into at present. The troop set up the CoH and, quite frankly, I'm not sure if my folks had much say in its arrangement. It was a larger version of the troops usual CoH, candle lit, Scout Law, etc. Scoutmaster said something, some other Scout high mucky mucks (whom I did not recognize) said something, my mom cried. My dad almost did, he was a singularly unemotional fellow,usually. I remember all my Scout friends shook my hand.

I have attended ECoH on camping trips ( the ceremony was held in the wood lot of the boys grandfathers farm, next to a campfire), in grand church halls, in rented halls in the Holiday Inn. I've attended as an invited guest (daughters boyfriend, "in the past" as she says now), as a Scout of the troop (old troop has had 42 since me), as a Scouter in my sons present troop (not yet for him. Giv'em time). I've seen various types of crepe paper and flags. I've eaten really pasty cake from a bakery, mom's choco cookies, and BBQ chicken. I've drunk fruit juice and Kool Aide. I've remembered my own Scout history and listened as somebody recounted a teenagers shorter time line. I've heard very little music, actually, but Taps from a hidden bugle at the closing of the proceedings always moves me.

The ceremony is to be meaningful and memorable. Suggestions can be made by anyone with an interest in the boys award, but I must agree with all posts before, I think the C of the EBoR can't really impose his design on the Troop or family. That's just bad manners. He is not a "commandant".

Scoutmom, pass my congratulations on to your friends and their young Eagle. Tell him not to forget to put all his Scout badges in a shoe box to show his son, eleventyumpteen years from now.

YiS

And when did Scouts start playing polo? Hah! The "Polo Merit Badge!"

Wooo... Invigorating dip... up the ladder for another dive in...

Perhaps this thread should be titled "Choosing YOUR religion" ?

Beaver: Thank you.

Fuzzy: I offer another quote. I like it when someone much wiser than me speaks my mind...

"The humble, meek, merciful, just, pious and devout souls are everywhere of one religion; and when death has taken off the mask they will know one another, though the diverse liveries they wear here make them strangers."

== William Penn == 1644-1718

YiS

A boy and his dad were walking along a beach after a storm. Alot of debris had been washed up, and they would stop every so often and look at the treasures at their feet.

They came upon an area where alot of star fish had been washed up. The boy picked one up and threw it back into the ocean, then another and then another. The man shook his head and said, "you know, you can't help all of them". The boy picked up another star fish and threw it in the ocean. "Maybe so",he said, "but I can help THAT one ... and THAT one... and THAT one..."

YiS

((G2SS not withstanding))

A mountain climber slips and falls. He finds himself literally holding on to the rock face with his fingernails. "HELP!" he cries out, "DEAR GOD, HELP ME!!"

A voice comes to him: "I would not forsake you, my son".

"What? Who's up there?" says the mountaineer.

"It is I, your God" says the voice.

"Really? I thought... I mean I..."

"I understand."

"C-c-c-can you help me?"

"Yes. Just let go and I will hold you up in my loving arms..."

"..."

The mountaineer says " IS THERE ANYONE ELSE UP THERE?"

You can do this once, maybe twice a year...

Begin with your standard opening and when you get to the Cub who leads the reciting of the Cub Promise, the Cub master runs in and says " now hold on Johnny, I know all the Cubs know the Promise , right? But I'd like to know if the PARENTS have been paying attention" Here, he holds up a paper bag, in which has been placed folded 3x5 cards, on each is written one word of the Cub Promise.

"Now I want each parent to pick out a card ((shake the bag to make it rattle)), then I want you folks to line yourselves up in the proper order ((walk around and get the adults to pick out a card)), to spell out the Cub Promise. Without talking!!!

Here I go. I think the water is deep enough to dive into...

1) I think I like BP's instruction about the choice of a boy's religion being mostly up to the parents, and the Scouters role being mainly to encourage that. The exact quote has been noted here before.

2) One's religion is composed of three main components, that which is taught by others (parents, Sabbath school, bull sessions at camp and at school, etc.) , that which is learned by ones self (reading the Bible/Quoran/Talmud/etc.) and that which is EXPERIENCED by ones self (see St Francis, et al). RELIGION is not necessarily FAITH.

3) It has been my experience (both from family and (sunday school teacher and Scout leader) that youngsters need some religious education, not only for the cultural background (yes, everyone should know about Noah and the Ark), but to know what their parents espouse. Youngsters need something to either ACCEPT (and add to) or REBEL against (and deny).To allow them the questionable "luxury" of wandering around spiritually until they might find a religious community to latch onto is ,I think, not serving our chidren well.

4) The original article noted that the author felt she had let her children down because they did not recognize AT ONCE the crucified Christ in sculpture. She felt she must find a way to "educate" her Cub in "A" belief. I reread the article, looking for a comment about finding a way to educate her Cub in "THEIR" belief. There's the problem. Like most of our society, we find it efficient to let someone else... fix our car, ...make our clothes, ...teach our children about God.

5) NO where in this article do they discuss finding a "good fit" for the PARENTS belief, only that the child be taught (something) about God, and the parents somehow find agreement in what the child is taught. And that is how one finds a church/temple/meeting/ashram to attend? This seems putting the cart before the horse to me.

YiS

You can do this once, maybe twice a year. Neat stunt>>>

Start your meeting as usual, but when you get to the Cub leading the Pack in the Cub Promise, the Cub Master runs up and says...

"Now hold on ,Johnny. I know all you Cubs know the Cub Promise and do your best to follow it. But I want to know if the PARENTS know the Cub Promise... ((here, the CM holds up a paper bag and rattles it. Inside are folded 3x5 cards, each with one word from the Cub Promise on it)) "I want each parent to take a card out... There you go... yeah, you too, Fred... and then WITHOUT TALKING, line up your cards in the right order to spell out the Cub Promise... Think they can do it? Let's see..."

This stunt will take about 10 minutes or so, and the Cubs will love it ((embarrass the parents?? oooo...). Some of the parents will take charge from the ones that don't quite know it. Good chance to see who's involved and who might not be, if you didn't know before.

Obviously, you can ((AND SHOULD)) do it also with the Law of the Pack and include the Slogan ("Do Your Best").

Have fun... YiS.

Quick takes:::

If A-B mission is to sell beer, and BSA mission is to "instill values" etc., and when we have a "Join Souting Night" and many boys gather round the Pinewood derby track and the monkey bridge and tent set up, ...

HOWCUM it seems to be the parents we have to sell, not the boys?...

(true)

At the end of a 10 mile in, 10 mile out overnight, at the trail head parking lot:

"No, I thought your wife was picking us up?"

" Hey, Joe, could you toss me the...

((Choose one... or be sued for improper name usage))

"Band Aids? ...self adhesive wound bandages ?"

"Kleenex? ...soft tissue paper nose wipers?"

"model of that classic '67 Mustang? ...mid twentieth century pony car?"

"roll of Scotch tape? ...self adhesive clear acetate tape?"

"my Teflon skillet? ...non-stick tetra fluoro carbide frying pan?"

"that Xerox copy? ...that photo process self image?"

"my PC? (ooops! crash)" ... my non-IBM made personal calculating device?"

"my Primus?" ... little portable petrol fired cooking apparatus?"

"can of Coke?" .... sorry, we don't serve Coka Cola products here."

"My Panzerkampfwagen?" ...my new Abrams A1?"

"A couple of BVDs?" (does that date me?) ....two pair u-trou?"

Oh Hum..... YiS

Although not in my personal neck of the woods, I can recommend Camp Gorton in Five Rivers Council, near Dundee NY. Not too big, nice waterfront on Lake Waneta. Phone 670.292.3220. A friend is staff there, and I have visited recently, both with and without Scouts.

My, lots of choices (so long as the local councils don't need to sell the camp to pay the taxes)

YiS

My luverly wife is the Dcamp Program Director which makes me...

First asst...

Publicity...

"specials" getter...

Fill in (who's missing on staff? archery? Scoutcraft? Den Round up? Skits? Campfire MC.....?)

Sign maker/poster...

Flag pole installer...

hey, it's my job it's what I do...

Any way...

*Lots of advance notice...

*Our council sponsors mucho district Dcamps, thuout the summer, so parents can go another week if they can't match the home District Dcamp...for a surcharge of...

*SOMEONE (not just me, fortunately)does a Pack "visitation" to talk up all forms of Cub Camping (not just Dcamp) in Feb- Mar- Apr-...

*It is required to register by Pack, got to have a Pack Camp Coordinator, with Den walkers listed, and if the numbers don't match, the Pack is called to task...

*We do the 'Early bird discount and special patch" thing. seems to help.

*On the friday evening before the first monday morning we have an early check in ""on site"",and Pack Den walkers training and T shirt pick up . THis allows folks to get familiar with the site and what is expected of the Den Walkers. It also seems to help enforce the prior early registration. Then monday morning is 95% done...

*Yes, we make it plain that last minute walk ups monday morning are added to a camp den after the fact, we don't hold things up for the late folks, and we insist that the attending parent serve as a Den walker for the day..., but yeah we sure don't turn someone away.

* Mostly I think lots of Drum Beating (roundtables, emails, visitations, word o' mouth)is what is necessary and ENFORCE the deadlines...

* and BOY is it fun...

YiS