Owl62

How to we order these from you?

Thanks,

Owl

Has anyone here made or attempted to make Wood Badge beads - either on your own or for a Wood Badge Course?

While I am not perfect, I do try to comply with all laws, traffic and otherwise. Especially though when transporting Scouts. Besides being the law - and most are enacted for reasons - like public safety, it just makes common sense to be careful when driving! Driving is dangerous enough anyway.

I have been told in the past that my speedometer must be out of calibration because I was driving five miles below the speed limit. Funny how it was always exactly 5 miles below. On one trip, I was doing exactly the speed limit and passed by one of those radar speed monitoring trailers and it indicated exactly what my speedometer read. I have had 3 others pace me with their vehicle and all of our speedometers agreed.

It was and is clear to me that the individual telling me to speed up new that he was simply trying to get me to hurry up so we could get where we were going. I usually am driving the last vehicle to arrive. While I was once a designated driver for the CO van that we borrowed, I have had my name taken off the authorized drivers list and no longer drive that vehicle. Funny how that vehicle speedometer was also exactly 5 miles off. And I try to totally avoid transporting any Scouts anyway - I volunteer to carry gear instead.

Fortunately the person who always found me to be driving so slow has left the unit. I guess I was not fast enough for him.

Our Scouters now all agree to drive safely and obey the posted speed and drive according to local conditions.

BTW - there are plenty of jurisdications where the police don't give any leeway for speed. There is one state that I know of with HUGE signs at the state line warning all drivers that no leeway is given. I have known people who got speeding tickets for driving as little as 1 mile over the limit. From what I understand, in most jurisdictions, while a leeway may be considered, the police can write tickets or even arrest. I have heard of some states that REQUIRE that an arrest be made for certain speeds over the limit. Bottom line is, no one should count on any leeway being given to the posted speed limit.

I would be VERY concerned about a Scouter who has had multiple speeding violations - especially if he/she was convicted. And it does not matter if the violation happend in relation to a Scouting activity or not. The person, in my opinion is a safety hazard. Period. He is setting a very poor example for the Scouts.

I have heard of adults being denied registration due to speeding convictions. Not sure if it is true. It is my understanding that a Council Scout Executive can deny or withdraw a person's registration for any reason or no reason at all - with or without cause.

If it were me, I would certainly get the unit committee and chartered organization involved in the case and they might want to consider contacting the Council Scout Executive.

Just my opinion.

In order to be "Official" Wood Badge beads, do they have to come from BSA supply? Or can one make their own or get them from other sources?

We are told that our Wood Badge course staff make the beads that we are presented. And I have been told that by multiple people that should be in the know and I believe them. They seem to be of much better quaility than those that are bought from BSA supply. I have both. The beads I got when I completed Wood Badge are very well done and on a black 2mm thick real leather thong with a Friendship Knot tied about 1 1/2" about the beads. The beads I bought as a spare from BSA supply are not near a nice as the beads I got from the course, are apparently of a different type of wood and or finish, and come on a thick rough black leather lace with a simple overhand knot tied about the beads (I replaced the leather thong with a 2mm black leather thong and tied a Friendship Knot in it).

And I have seen Wood Badge beads made of different types of wood and in different finishes - some light some darker. I have seen some with the actual course number maked on them.

Does anyone know the reason/significance and the design of the Wood Badge beads?

In the US all of the beads I have seen about about 1" long, with bevelled ends with a nick in the end of the bevel and the area around the hole that the leather thong passed through is countersunk.

I have an inquiry from a Scouter in the UK who asked about the reason for the nick in the ends and the countersunk areas.

I think that the reason for the countersunk areas is so that the beads can fit interlocked together at right angles (perhaps originally to help keep rattling noise down when worn as a long necklace with lots of beads). I have no idea why there are nicks in the ends.

Does anyone know?

Thanks.

CPR Shields:

The American Red Cross sells them. (About $5)

Our Scout shop sells them. (About $3)

They are available from several other sources.

As for first aid kits. The basic items for a Scout's individual first aid kit are listing in the Boy Scout Handbook. Those items should do for most activities. There are a great number of first aid kits available commercially - of all types and sizes - AND costs.

I prefer to put together my own kit.

One thing to remmeber is that many first aid kits see little use (THANKFULLY!). So the items get old, and outdated. I cleaned out a unit first aid kit a while back. Everything with a date on it was expired and all the packages where yellowed and brittle. The gloves where dry rotted and crumbling. We replaced it all and now check it and replace items as needed before and after each activity that it is take on. You might want to have a list of contents with the date the items were put into the kit and if known, the actual expiration date of the items and keep them all fresh and up to date.

I agree that service and trying to adhere to the standards of the Scout Oath and Law and what is in my heart are most important to me. Giving back to a program that has given so much to me....

And of service - and it comes in all shapes, sizes, and flavors. Remember those that are at nearly every activity - helping where they can. The activity quartermaster, the Scouter who volunteers to serve as director of an activity, those that empty the the trash when it is full rather than have it overflow, Ever notice that at training and other activities - it seems that the same people are nearly always there. Even attending training, unit committee meetings, roundtables, unit meetings, campouts, camporees, jamborees, helping with service projects, serving on Boards of Review, serving in ANY volunteer position for that matter, etc - is service.

I think that sometimes we tend to forget those that work, usually quietly and usually as discretely as possible, in the background. They seem to seldom be recognized and even try to avoid recognition. Most of them don't want medals or other awards, They get their greatest reward in knowing that their service and contributions are needed and important.

Far as I know, the "other" Scouting organization that trys to closely follow Baden-Powell's orginal program is the Baden-Powell Scout Association. They have website and there is at least one US unit - in Fort Worth, TX. That's about all I know about the organization though.

As for the official rules and regulations. I forget who originally asked for it here in this forum, and there have been those that claim that the documents that we do have, contain all the rules and regulations we need to see, but, I think it is altogether reasonable for any member of the BSA to have access to that document - even to have a copy. Why not? There are references to it through the various documens that we have access to, but the actual rules and regulations seem to be very hard to find.

Perhaps the official rules and regulations should be posted on the BSA website?

I was just wondering what your favorite tent(s) is/are?

As for me:

Eureka Get-A-Way 2 for the little backpacking I do and ocassionally for one nighters. I bought it for Wood Badge and Powderhorn to replace a decades old Camel backpacking tent (similar to the Eureka Timberline 2 man tents).

Coleman Sundome for regular camping. I have two sizes: 7X7 and 9X7 and select the one most appropriate for the event. The are the olive green and buff colored versions.

Coleman Outdoorsman for longer term camping. This is an "A" frame tent that is 10X8 and makes a great summer camp tent. It is forest green and white. This tent has a unique pole system that is all shockcorded together. All you have to do is lay it out on the staked down tent, slide the pole sections together to form the A frame, pull the tent up and clip it to the poles and throw the rain fly over it and attach it. Can be set up by one person is a very short time.

For my wife and daughter who are also involved in Scouting I bought them a smaller Coleman Outdoorsman that is 9X7. Same type pole system as the larger version. It is tan and white.

I use 6mil plastic sheeting ground tarps under all my tents to protect the tent floor.

Technically speaking, commissioners are district level Scouters and should not wear the unit numbers of their unit with the Commissioner patch (same for other district positions such as District Committee). About the only correct option for Scouters dual registered in both unit and district level and about positions is to have separate shirts.

I have seen MANY Scouters who are unit Scouters also serve in District and Council positions who use velcro to attach their position patches and just change the position patch and colored shoulder loops depending on the activity. Again, technically speaking this is not correct uniforming. Check the insignia guide.

However, I see nothing wrong with it. Its shows involvement in the program at varying levels which I think is good.

One situation where velcroing position patchs would not technically violate uniform policy is for Scouters serving in more than one position above unit level - such as serving as both a Unit Commissioner and as say a member of the District Committee. A separate shirt (Without unit numbers) could be used with velcro where the posiion patch goes and then just change it based on the role being performed at the time.

I have searched and searched and have not found any mention of how patches are to be attached to the uniform (sewn, ironed on, or using velcro, pins, snaps, even staples (and yet I have seen staples used).

As for me, I have a separate shirt for distict services (without unit numbers) but it did cost me an additiona $40+ which I consider an unnecessay expenditure of funds when if the the option were officially available whe could just change position patches and shoulder loops. But I do try very hard to wear the uniform properly right down to the socks.

Rip,

Your idea is good.

I had made a suggestion earlier that the BSA should adopt some type of jacket/coat "system".

My recommendation was a 3 component system consisting of:

1. A waterproof wind/rain parka with a hood that rolls up into the collar. This would serve as a wind/rain jacket and a a light jacket. (Matching trousers would be another option to form a "rain suit")

2. A wind/rain resistant jacket that has light insulation.

3. A fleece jacket that would could be used as a liner for all of the above in cold weather, or as a light jacket.

These could all be bought and worn together or separately as needed. Similar components are readily available on the market.

As for color(s): I think that one color for all programs would suffice - perhaps some shade of green anywhere from a faded green to a dark green.

As for insignia for this: I would recommend that the red BSA patch be used on all three components but be optional.

Not only would this system "standardize" cold/cool weather jackets, but it would make available rain gear, and 3 different options for selection based on personal choice and local need based on weather, etc. It would have a ready made layering system that we recommend anyway. It could be relatively lightweight, easily worn, carried and packed.

I have made my own version of this with system for both programs that I am involved in (Boy Scouts and Venturing). For Boy Scouts I used olive green and for Venturing I use forest green. Consists of a lightweight fleece jacket, a lined hooded jacket and a water resistant nylon parka with a hoon that rolls into the collar. Each component system cost me about $60. In cold weather it can be beefed up with sweatshirts or sweaters.

As for the wool Jac-Shirt - I would recommend that the color be changed to a forest green and be optional - it could be integrated into the system I discuss above.

Bob,

On what do you base your comment about Wood Badge beads?

The Insignia Guide page 28 states:

"Wood Badge slight or woggle, No. 02173, trained Scouter, with Wood Badge neckerchief; necklace with two beads, No. 02175l three beads, No. 02176; four beads, No. 02177; under the Wood Badge neckerchief, and over the ends and below the woggle, with the official uniform...."

Then at the end of that section there is the following sentence: " Wood Badge beads may be worn with a neckerchief as stated above or alone."

I believe that last sentence means with the Wood Badge neckerchief because it says "as indicated", rather than with any neckerchief.

Also the first part of the section says "With Wood Badge neckerchief".

I don't think the intent of that last statement is to allow wearing of Wood Badge beads with any neckerchief. But I could be wrong. Perhaps there is another reference about this?

I like this belt. It is practical, adjustable, reasonably priced, durable, and lightweight.

Two pet peeves of mine are: that the buckle should be polished and worn with the edge of one end of the bucle aligned with the edge of the pants fly; and that the end with the brass end should protrude out of the buckle just the width of the brass tip - not wrapped around the waist over the belt. Any excess belt material should be passed through the buckle keeper and worn UNDER the belt out of sight.

All of this is just to make the belt look better when worn.

Although I usually wear a leather belt with a custom buckle (I am a buckle person!), I do sometimes wear the webb belt and buckle.

The Insignia Guide addresses neckerchiefs.

It addresses what leaders wear on page 6 -7.

Basically is says that Cub leaders MAY wear the Cub leaders neckerchief and Webelos leaders wear the Webelos leaders neckerchief. Note that one says "may" and the other says "wears"

In Boy Scout units neckerchiefs are optional but if adopted by vote, ALL members adide by the decision.

It also goes on to say that local councils may prescribe which neckerchief is to be worn on a council or district basis. I guess that means that the local council can REQUIRE Boy Scout units to not only the wear of a neckerchief but which one to wear.

But the uniform inspection sheets seem to indicate that neckerchiefs are optional for male adult leaders with the short sleeve shirt and totally optional for female leaders.

Wood Badge trained Scouts can wear the Wood Badge neckerchief with woggle and beads or the beads alone on the official shirt. The way I read the requirements, the Wood Badge woggle and beads cannot be worn with a unit neckerchief, only the WB neckerchieg. Sometimes I wear our Troop neckerchief and when I do I do not wear my WB beads or woggle because th guide is clear on the matter.

For Boy Scouts, the official shirt collar is worn open if no neckerchief is worn.

Our Boy Scout troop adopted a neckerchief about 10 months ago. It is a standard official neckerchief and they have the option to wear the official slide, a handmade slide, or tie the tails in a knot. They made the wear optional except for Scoutmaster Conferences, Boards of Review, Courts of Honor, occasions of ceremony, and when prescribed by the Senior Patrol Leader such as staffing events, visiting other units, etc.

Regarding the leather belt-like hatband for the campaign hat.

I would like to know what the official way is to wear that band around the crown of the hat. Which way does it go?

Thanks.

Scamp,

The Insignia Guide 2002-2005 version does address headgear regulations. It talks about official headgear but then does not define what that is.

However, there are uniform inspection sheets available, and I suppose they are "Official" references.

The Male Leader Uniform Inspection Sheet states: "Boy Scout leaders wear the olive and red visor cap, or campaign hat. Cub Scout leaders wear the blue and gold visor cap. Webelos leaders wear the blue Webles cap. Varsity Scout leaders wear the blaze visor cap."

The Female Leader Uniform Inspection Sheet state: "Cap (optional) Leaders wear the same visored cap as the youth they serve - blue and gold for Cub Scouting, bule and light blue for Webelos Scouting, olive and red for Boy Scouting and blaze for Varisty SCouting. Campaign hat may be worn at troop option for Boy Scout Leaders."

I am not sure of the authority of a WB course director to dictate the uniform. Although I can understand where they would want as much uniformity as possible. But I would question a requirement for a female leader to wear a hat when an official publication says it is optional.

So it appears that female leaders can wear the campaign hat. And I see nothing wrong with it if the female leader wants to wear one.

BTW - and I know this has nothing to do with this, but in the military, female Marine Corps Drill Instructors wear the campaign hat while female Army Drill Sergeants do not - they wear an "Aussie" style hat that is pinned up on one side.

BadenP,

I have searched the Venturer Handbook pretty thoroughly and I can't find a REQUIREMENT to wear the official Venturing uniform (Spruce green shirt and grey shorts or pants) anywhere for any type of activity. It does state that it is the recommended uniform. But it also says that the "uniform if any is the choice of the crew.".

This is why there are so many questions about the Venturing uniform. The BSA's own references conflict. The Venturing books are pretty clear that a Venturing crew can design its own uniform. But the Insignia guide says that no alterations may be made to the uniform.

Perhaps someone here knows of a source at the National Council where we can get the official stance on this.

Thanks.

FScouter:

Thanks. Sure enough it is there.

I appreciate it. Thanks again.

If you could design a new/ideal Scout uniform (for any one or all of the program areas, what would it be?

Be_Prepared:

May I ask what the source of your information is?

I am very interested in learning what the "official" BSA requirements for this award are.

Thanks.

How is a form user's status (New, Junior, Senior, etc) determined?

Also, are the rating stars gone forever?

Thanks

Venturing uniforms are being covered in the Uniform Forum.

I recently posted:

The Venturing uniform is not covered very well in the insignia guide.

But in the Venturing Leader Manual, it is:

"The recommended uniform is the spruce green Venturing shirt with green epaulette tabs and gray backpacking-style shorts of gray casual pants. However, the uniform is the choice of the crew. Sea Scouts may wear the Sea Scout uniform. For those crews that choose to have the Venturing uniform, it is recommended to wear it when traveling, at crew meetings, at other SCout meetings, when serving the public, and at other appropriate times. When doing field activities sush as sports, water activities, mountaineering, etc., your crew might want to wear something more appropriate to the activity.:

The Venturer handbook says about the same thing but adds:

"Your crew may design its own uniform."

This raises the question: Can a Venturing crew choose to adopt and wear the official spruce green Venturing shirt, but not the official gray shorts or pants?

I think the intent of the BSA is to require both the official Venturing shirt and shorts or pants together as a complete set.

BUT, the manual does say that the crew can design its own uniform.

Many crews adopt the official Venturing shirt, but choose to wear shorts or pants other than the official ones. I know of one that adopted beige shorts or pants (looks pretty good). I think part of the reason for this, right or wrong, is the extreme high cost of the official Venturing shorts or pants.....

Can anyone actually quote the offical BSA stance on what the official Venturing uniform consists of.

That being said, I personally where the official spruce green Venturing shirt with either commercial gray shorts or pants that are nearly identical to the official ones. Techically, this is not correct, but I do it for several reasons: The official shorts and pants are ill fitting - even worse than the Boy Scout shorts and pants. The venturing shorts and pants do appear to be better made and of more durable material than the Boy Scout shorts and pants but they are still not of very high quality. They are not very readily available and when they are not all sizes are available. And finally, they are VERY VERY expensive. That little Venturing logo on them must be the justificaion for the additional cost. The official Venturing socks are $13.50 a pair!!! I can buy 3 pairs of very high quality hikig or running socks for that price.

Officially I think, Ventures and Venturing Leaders should wear the complete official Venturing uniform if that is the uniform the crew adopts. But then again, the manual says that a crew can design their own uniform.

The Venturing uniform is not covered very well in the insignia guide.

But in the Venturing Leader Manual, it is:

"The recommended uniform is the spruce green Venturing shirt with green epaulette tabs and gray backpacking-style shorts of gray casual pants. However, the uniform is the choice of the crew. Sea Scouts may wear the Sea Scout uniform. For those crews that choose to have the Venturing uniform, it is recommended to wear it when traveling, at crew meetings, at other SCout meetings, when serving the public, and at other appropriate times. When doing field activities sush as sports, water activities, mountaineering, etc., your crew might want to wear something more appropriate to the activity.:

The Venturer handbook says about the same thing but adds:

"Your crew may design its own uniform."

This raises the question: Can a Venturing crew choose to adopt and wear the official spruce green Venturing shirt, but not the official gray shorts or pants?

I think the intent of the BSA is to require both the official Venturing shirt and shorts or pants together as a complete set.

BUT, the manual does say that the crew can design its own uniform.

Many crews adopt the official Venturing shirt, but choose to wear shorts or pants other than the official ones. I know of one that adopted beige shorts or pants (looks pretty good). I think part of the reason for this, right or wrong, is the extreme high cost of the official Venturing shorts or pants.....

Can anyone actually quote the offical BSA stance on what the official Venturing uniform consists of.

I checked the Insignia Guide 2003-2005 and there is a section on Jackets and their insignia. The red wool shirt-jac is mentioned but it does not mention who is authorized to wear the shirt-jac.

The 2004 Boy Scouts of America Official Retail Catalog shows the red wood shirt-jac on 6 of the LEADERS Section and page 5 of the BOY SCOUTING section (And it is listed as a "Jac-shirt". It is available in a variety of youth and adult sizes.

I am not sure if the catalog is implying that only "Leaders" and BOY SCOUTS can wear the shirt-jac or jac-shirt or not.

In my nearly 40 years in the program, I have seen adult leaders in all program areas wear the shirt-jac - especially those who have been in the program a while. And I have see some BOY SCOUTS wear it - especially the older young men. I have never seen Cub Scouts, Webelos, or Venturers were it.

I am registered as both a Boy Scout and a Venturing leader and I wear my shirt-jac with both uniforms.

It is very warm but it is not of the same high quality of older versions.

I really wish it was available in a forest or olive green though. Red is one of my least favorite colors.

These are the requirements that our council sent out to us:

INTERNATIONAL ACTIVITY PATCH REQUIREMENTS

Complete any two of the requirements listed below and submit a minimum one page written report on each requirement to the Council International Committee:

1. Participate in an International Activity approved in advance by the Council International Committee.

2. Participate in a home hospitality program either by hosting or being a guest of a Scout and or leader for a minimum of two days and two nights. The guest or host should be from a non-U.S. Scout organization recognized by the Boy Scouts of America.

2. Participate in the study of another country or countries (including the Scout movements in those countries) that is adulated as a theme by a Cub Scout pack, Boy Scout troop, Varsity team, Explorer Post, Venture crew or ship upon approval of the Council International Committee. Submit a report (minimum length two single-spaced pages) on the study.

4. Participate in a Jamboree-on-the-Air (JOTA) for a minimum of 4 hours; which could also include working on the Citizenship of the World merit badge,

5. Participate as a pen pal with a Scout and/or leader from a non-U.S. Scout organization recognized by the Boy Scouts of America; or communicate by email on the Internet by downloading the communication and submitting a report (minimum length two single-spaced pages). As a general rule, communication should b exchanged over a period of at least 90 days and or/ for at least three rounds of communication.

Upon completion, submit the reports to the Council Program Department for review by the Council International Committee, When approved a participation card will be issued which will authorized the participant to purchase and wear the International Activity Patch.

I am not sure if these are correct or not, but this is what we got.