Its Me

This family could be meat eating Methodist that is not the point. What I was trying to focus on is the Patrol Method for a more individualist Scout. Right now, Cub Scouting is great, its family activities controlled by adults. But all boys in the den are the same rank.

The Patrol method uses a structured and tiered approach with boys leading boys. A hierarchal structure is not something that I see this free spirited family embracing.

I have a boy in my Bear den and as I look to the future through WeBelos and beyond I can't see this boy fitting into the patrol method. He and his family are Vegetarians and are members of a pacifist religion. The family loves scouts now. The camping outdoors and environmental focus are right up their alley.

But a structured patrol setting is not something I can see this boy or his family subscribing to. Any experience with this sort of scout?

Wow card games are a problem? Playing card games is wasting time? I can't believe this. Card games new, old, Yu-Gi-oh or regular invovlve the following of specific rules and social order. Two items usually in short supply around boys.

I would agree that he was thumping his chest when he made the decisiosn.

Great discussion.

This does not sound all that different from the corporate world. The first company I worked at had about 100 employee but was family owned. The company was run for the sole purpose of providing 5-6 family members with lucertive jobs. The engineering manager (my boss) was a tyrant who blamed everything that went wrong on his poorly developed staff. And he was not intereted developing his staff or yielding athority. Appealing to the higher-ups was useless as they were there only to protect their own.

When they say scouting is a microcosim of the adult world they are right. But scouts should be learning not the tyranical, nepotism style of management but the growth through training and doing style of mangement.

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BSA should offer more training like that. I like the fact that at the end I was able to print out a document stating that I have completed the training. The only draw back is that I doubt that this information will be sent to my home council.

Actually this is the nicest forum I post on. The people are more curtious and polite on this forum than on the running and backpacking forums I also post on. I typically stay out of the issues and politics thread because the issues are so devisive and the threads take on a no holds barred approach.

I am so much more knowledgable about scouting because I come here. I recently took Wood Badge. I am just a Bear den leader and no one presently in my pack has taken wood badge. I also assume that many of our den leaders don't even know about wood badge. While at Wood Badge I was asked how I heard of Wood badge. Well On-line from the good'ol people over at scouter.com.

Every day I log on sometimes two-three times just to see what I can learn about scouting and youths that day.

Don't leave. I can't wait until you teach me something about scouting. Oops you alrady have.

We have one Indian in our pack and his is an assistant den leader and sits on the School Advisory committee with me.

I am guessing that he has been here a while ~10-20 years.

As the smartest creatures in the forest the Bears have a responibilty to instruct the others.

Mr srisom I can assure you that it was very patrol focused. We ate every meal as a patrol. We sat next to each other for all sessions and placed tents within feet of one another.

The cheer, totum, and main project were all done as a patrol. All food planing for the second weekend was done as a patrol.

We had moments of joy and periods of strife as a partol. I learned more from the two periods of strife we experienced than I did in all the sessions combined. We are the Bear patrol.

Also it was long. There were three full days each weekend with dismisal each time at 5:00 in the afternoon.

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I am not sure what you are talking about. All eight of our troop guides were first time staffers. As far as I know positions like the senior patrol leader is changed out every year.

I was just expecting a twist like. As if we would elect a senior patrol leader and conduct our own PLC meeting. That din't happen.

I was just under the impression that we were supposed to do something at the last cracker barrel. Four patrols got together and shared food but beyond that nothing.

I got the handshakes and the passwords but I don't know which password goes with which handshake. So is back to Gilwell happy land, I am going to work my ticket if I can.

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I just finished my Wood Badge Course and after reading so many posts here, I was expecting a secret twist. All of us in the troop where trying hard to figure out the secret. But it never materialized. At least in my course there really was no BIG secret. Although some of the training sessions applied in the first session often had duel meanings, (usually a team builing theme) these were obvious.

Is this just a difference in course directors or this a difference between the old and new courses?

Bail

Talk to your den and seek a new pack as den, yours pack is a wreck.

You guys that want to ban PWD because of its compettive nature are wrong.

I enjoy working with my boy building the cars. We spend a lot of time on it. As a den we start building the cars, rough shaping and sanding then leave it up the boys family to paint and get wheels on it. At the Pinewood derby I saw every one of my scouts there with their dad. Do you know why? Because the scout and dad worked on it together. The balance of work may differ from scout to scout but the derby does what it is supposed to do.

Positives of the PWD:

1) Brings boys out to a scouting event

2) Gets dads involved in a boy activity

3) Teaches the boys about tools

4) Teaches the boys about winning and losing.

Please do not destroy a working program. Leave the PWD as is.

At our pack race all cars are checked for axle spacing before the race. Was an illegal car allowed to race? As far as all four wheels must be on the ground, even well built cars will have one of four wheels a little higher. There is some "Those are just sour grapes" in your post.

How do you handle this? Go to the cubmaster and tell him that you believe that illegal cars are being raced.

I agree. Besides it is redundant. How could I promise as someone else? Considering the promise is usually said allowed with six other kids its get awkward.

Many cool actvities have goofy uniforms.

I cycle with my local bicycle club. Every Staurday we out there in our best spandex and wild colored shirts. Why? Part functionality but mostly association.

I used to horseback ride with a Fox hunting group. Yes the Taly-Ho people. Uniforms were applied there too. Pants, Shirt, Jacket and even buttons were dictated. These were more outdated as far as today's fashion but the clothes linked us to a centuries old tradition.

When I am in cycling cloths and with peers also uniform no propblem. Four or five together just as good. On a ride by myself when I stop in for a water at local 7-11 and my clip-on shoes go click-click, my pants look like I am wearing diaper and my shirt has some Italian Cement Company's name on it, people stare. Same thing when I rode horses and stopped with tall boots, and riding pants, (most of the time I left the whip in the truck) people would stare.

Maybe its harder for kids but uniforms are applied to most activities. Go to a skateboard park and see if they are dressed alike. My bet is they would look very similar.

end ramble

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Zahnada, thanks for the reply. I don't disagree with the Chief's statements that the mom makes the decision to enter Scouting, but its misleading.

What I would like to see is youth targeted advertising. Mom makes all grocery purchases yet CoCo-puffs is advertised almost exclusively during kid shows. I haven't seen the fimilar crazy Cuckoo bird during a Desperate House Wife show. So how did mom know that little Johnny wanted CoCo-Puffs? How did little Johnny even learn about CoCo-puffs? It was on TV, it looked good, so little Johnny told mommy he wanted CoCo-Puffs. If left up to mom, would she buy a cereal that is 70% sugar? No!

What I am saying is that the Council chief is right mom makes the decision on scouting. But mom makes all the decisions for her child. Mom is a harder sell. Targeting mom will require slick ads, premium time slots and a focused message. We should take our cues from CoCo-puffs. We target the youth and sell him on a simple message of fun, outdoor and learning. He sells it to mom, not us.

Brother, please provide us a link to this new shirt that you testify too.

Here is what I presented to the Pack last night:

Thursday Night:

Optional Campout (Reserving thursday is a trick to get the campsite for the weekend)

Friday Night

Campfire Sing along 8:00 - 9:00

Saturday

9:00 Webelos Flag ceremony,Prayer,Announcements

9:30 - 10:30 Fort Invasion

1:30 Shell hunt along beach (with lifeguards) no doubt this will turn into a swim party

4:00 Tug-of-war Dads vs the world

8:00 campfire program with den skits, I'll have a short story and if appropriate will deliver it.

10:30 lights out

Sunday, short service

Dens to arrange meals

I offered to hold the cross over during the Saturday night campfire but the campout is in May and most will have crossed over by then. Also it would eat up all our campfire skit time.(This message has been edited by Its Me)

Building on some of the other ideas. Bury the bones in excavation area made from sand, dirt, sawdust whatever is available.

Put words or letters on the bones so they form a scout slogan. "Take only pictures, leave only foorprints". May be a good one.

If you have budget get some cheap hats from Oriental Trading. I did a search there for a Pith helmet and a construction hat and got hits for both.

http://www.orientaltrading.com/otcweb/application?namespace=main&origin=home.jsp&event=link.home&tabId=Home

I have seen boys just paint the block of wood as it came out of the box. The nail-axles weren't glued on. It did ok. At least it wasn't last. A good pack will have a few ringers that the cubmaster and other den leaders run that seem to be beat by all other cars.

We use Wal-Mart spray paint that cost $1.00. Spray paint dries in 1/10th the time house paint will dry. While at Wal-mart buy some rough and some smoooth sandpaper if you want numbers 80 grit and 150 grit. Then cut the sheet in quarters and turn your boy loose. Tell him not to sand right by the wheels.

Most boys will sand until its a tooth pick. When his sandpaper gets to all paper and no sand give him a new quarter sheet. Before painting give it a once over with the 150 grit.

When you get there look for the best looking car and ask that dad for some graphite lube. It will be in his right front pocket.

We have monthly pack meetings and awards are given out. The pack functions regardless of the fact that the leaders don't meet.

The pack is really run by a single family and not by a collection of individuals. I am ok with this, and as the age of this family's youngest is the same as my boy, I don't fear a change will happen during my tenure. However there are a few concerns I have. One is that new leaders are on their own. As I described above. Two, once this family's last scout crosses over, there will be a large void in the leadership positions.

I think lynncc, described it best. I would keep the dens seperate but try to get more interaction between the two dens. Who knows she could look at the way I run my den and go "jeez I can do better".

If I were Cubmaster (did I really just say that) I would assist the den leaders in developing their dens I don't believe this is presently occuring.

Should this den not make it, I certainly would like the boy and family whom I already know to join my den. If I didn't know anyone in the other den I am not certain I would be as interested to help. In fact I know I wouldn't. I am helping really the only way I can. My primary duty is to keep my den strong. I have no time left to serve as a training chair or other pack level duty.

With limited additional effort I can expand my den meeting to include another den. Both dens may benefit.

My den meetings aren't as polished as I would like so it isn't to demonstrate superior den skills. The other (real) story is that our pack doesn't have committee meetings. Actually we had one leader's meeting last year and the one meeting this year. I was at Wood Badge for this year's meeting so it will be another year before we have another.

I suspect that this leader is all alone and feels abandon. Since the pack has no leaders meeting, no training chair she has no guidance or support. I am only presuming this since our cubmaster has little contact with me and I assume all are treated this way.

Maybe I should hold a Bears only den leaders meeting.