Its Me

Welcome to Guess the cost.

Add to the standard Webelos uniform and my pants + belt a denner loop and a Webelos leaders patch.

I am a single issue poster.

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Every single issue that I have an opinion on, I post a comment.

I question the membership of the Girls scouts. My wife is a GSUSA leader I am a Cub Scout leader. From my personal experience there seems to be twice the number of cubs as there are cub-age girl scouts. And I think the trend lines diverage as the age of the scout increases. I would expect the BSA/GSUSA to be closer to 4/1.

On money raising BSA Vs GSUSA. The GSUSA has huge money contributor in the cookie sales. Our popcorn sales can't even come close. Thus BSA dues must be higher to compensate.

Good Calendar and I like that you have the themes picked out for the pack meetings.

But you look too crowded in September and October. Within a ten day period in October you have two campouts a hike and a pack meeting. We would not schedule a pack campout with a district/council event that close. Very few (if any) cub families will do both campouts. So you will be splitting the pack because families will choose the more convenient weekend.

You also need something in January.

One more your bike rodeo falls 4 days before world conservation. Why not move the bike rodeo to the next month and hold a conservation themed pack meeting.

But really it looks like a solid calendar for a committee meeting.

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I think the BSA program can be very relevant now and in the future especially if the focus remains on the outdoors. The emphasis must be on outdoor fun and activities followed by super citizen model making second.

If we assume that access to the ourdoors will be ever more foriegn to our over scheduled, suburban and urban youths (cities are still growing). If the kids are stimulated by adventures as seen in the one tv (think Animal Planet, Fear-Factor, Survivior). If the BSA presents itself as a ready made organization to educate youth and families about the outdoors. Then BSA will remain a strong and relevant program.

But BSA must deliver too. Who knows maybe one day someone from this forum will take up the call from several posters to go out start their own outdoor youth program.

The campaign:

"Never seen a campfire, join scouts".

"Never been in a canoe, join scouts".

"Never been more than five miles from a fast food joint, then join scouts."

Sadly, nostalgia is just not what it used to be. (sigh)

I disagree that kids are less scouty. Access to the outdoors is far easier than when I was a kid. Joe's Army-Navy surplus is where we went for camping supplies (Dad was x-military). Now every major intersection has a Walmart or Target selling camping supplies. Not to mention the .coms such as Campmor, Cabelas and REI that are online with fantastic product descriptions and competitive prices. The net has also made information easier to obtain resulting in a learning curve that is faster and steeper. I grew up in the city with limited summer forays into the semi-wilderness of lake-cabin weekends. Animal planet, the Discovery Channel and even the animated show the Thornberrys has brought the outdoors to our kids in way and level that the CBS Saturday morning cartoons never did for us. Maybe Scouting isnt as scouty as it used to be?

Bob White, I would guess that your son is so proficient in the outdoors and with the philosophy of scouting that only a completely unique experience was going to hold his interest. Congratulations on picking Sea Scouts. It sounds like a good program for you and your boy.

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The members of the Scouter.com forums are all ignoring you.

This is an automatic reply. Please do not respond.

Oldgreyeagle, Your reply is the quintessential old guard reply, "if we changed it then someone somewhere would complain." Of course! That's not the point. Trevorum really summed it up well. It sure looks good and as an adult it sure is nice to see those brashing young men all trimmed out in those duds. But the view needs to be seen through the eyes of the boys. And they would rather not be viewed in their scout uniform.

Once the uniform becomes an impediment to joining (and I believe it has) then it fails to serve its purpose. The team analogy can be discarded too as 1) we arent a team sport, 2) sport uniforms are first and foremost functional, with decorative kerchiefs, brass slides, progress beads and various other paraphernalia the scout uniform is not exaclty a minimilist uniform.

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Bob White, that's the best argument you have for wearing uniforms, "because fish have gills?" Think of it from the boy's perspective. I think parents and adults like to see the kids in uniform but I am convinced that most kids would rather not be seen in uniform. Outside of their official duties a cop or paramedic does not wear the uniform. It would call too much attention and even for an adult this attention is uncomfortable.

Even fish don't wear uniforms. Each species looks different from the other.

Good topic.

When I was a kid styrofoam was too expensive. My lunch box was insulated with used fire bricks we picked up from the lead foundary in town. It would have been too heavy if we ever put food in it, so we would carry the lunch boxes empty. And we were grateful!

Kids today don't know how easy they have it.

FS wrote "Itsme, that reminds me of a "friend" I used to have in Scouting. He would invite several of us over for a project and he would leave to pick some things up. We were then supposed to begin work and go as far as we could until he returned. "

I'll give you another topic. "Styrofoam"

Discuss.

What other youth program today requires the wearing of a 1930's military outfit? None. The uniform is costly and kids don't like wearing them. The idea and the arguments will be made that the iniform will somehow MOLD the child into the super citizen that we are after.

If we droped the uniform, scouting enrollment would go up. If we dropped the uniform the program would continue with no loss in effect.

There are several books in scouting. Let's pick one and analyze it.

Kind of funny because in another thread the question was asked why volunteerism is down then the author ponders the decline of adult fraternal organizations. The reasons get thronw out the window when we see that parents are too busy making sure their kids are in all in sorts of organizations.

The variables of scouting and a general associated grading assessment.

Kids (good families, sound community) = 9

Parents (They bring the kids and help out) = 8

Leaders (ok about have some training a couple with a lot more) = 7

Committee Members (not a as strong as could be but gets the job done) = 7

Charter Organization (Big Church, too many youth programs and BSA is just one) = 6

Programs (kids find them pretty interesting but wish for more cool stuff) = 9

Meeting Place (Ok, church back room very similar to an over used classroom) = 8

District (Not bad a little weak on holding training programs) = 7

Council (Pretty good with event, store hours, has needed material..) = 8

BSA (Preoccupied with civil suits and the big picture) = 8

Total score = 77% a passing grade

Now how many of those factors can one individual effect? Two? Three?

IMHO, with a lot of effort one person might be able to change two scores

Are we (me included) taking scouting too seriously? After all scouting is merely a youth group program designed to be run by volunteers from a church, PTA or similar family focused unit. It is meant to keep the kids occupied with fun activities that promote good behavior. Its not meant as officer training school or as an outdoor survivalist school. The history of scouting does not show that it was founded to fulfill parental and school responsibilities.

So when we discuss the finer elements of the program are we taking ourselves too seriously? The professional scouters I know and see regularly seem a lot more laid back than many of us.

Dear volunteer:

You guys aren't having any fun. I recommend that you set up a committee to plan an afternoon BBQ. Select three weekends at a park shelter or your church picnic area where we can handle 30-50 people. Have the meal plan, budget, proposed dates and activities ready for committee review six weeks before hand. Arrange for volunteers to set up, cook and take down. Also call Bill's bread to see if he will donate several loaves as we are on a tight budget. Please schedule and obtain the needed equipment for 4-5 really cool family activities. Otherwise the kids just run around and scream.

I wish I could help but I am very busy with the upcoming JLT as well as being on Woodbadge staff this year.

Your

Unit Commissioner

I love these things so make sure you let me know when so I can attend.

You guys have become real politicians at this, by answering the questions you wished that I asked. I didnt ask about patrol methods or adult involvement.

If the uniform is not required, and the program encourages youths to make decision regarding the running of their unit, would the boys be within their rights to elect to forego the uniform?

If the troop is boy lead why can't they vote on whether to wear the uniform or not?

Oak Tree I agree with you. I cringe when I see posts stating that they are holding off on certain activities because they want to save them for Boy Scouts.

Cub scouting is a great program. Kids join beacuse they hope to do things that they are currently not doing. Mainly camping, followed by conctructing and then learning cool stuff about snakes and such.

If I have a compliant about Cub Scouts it's the book. Too much is about youth safety. Now kids need to learn about safety but the boys didn't join Cub scouts to be lectured at about safety or to get assignments that look excalty like their third grade homework. Researching and writing a report sounds like homework to me. Take a look at the activities I lifted from the Bear Handbook. Is this what boys think of when they join cub scouting? I am not saying its bad stuff but must scouting fill every gap in a youth''s development? I have a set of cub scout books form 1954 that I would much rather use. And I say scouting was an easier program then and more focused on the interests of the boys.

-Write or tell what makes America special to you.

-Find out something about the old homes near where you live. Go and see two of them.

-Find out where places of historical interest are located in or near your town or city. Go and visit one of them with your family or den.

-Call city or county officials or your trash hauling company and find out what happens to your trash after it is hauled away.

-List all the ways water is used in your home. Search for dripping faucets or other ways water might be wasted. With an adult, repair or correct those problems.

-Trace your family back through your grandparents or great-grandparents; or, talk to a grandparent about what it was like when he or she was younger.

-Tell what to do in case of an accident in the home. A family member needs help. Someone's clothes catch on fire.

-Tell what to do in case of a water accident.

-Tell what to do in case of a school bus accident.

-Write a thank-you note.

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Set your secret decoder ring to F9 to decipher the message below.

Neetlavo erom knird.

Public schools have paid and well trained professionals interacting with the students. There is typically an army of behind the scenes staff that reviews and prepares programs. Books are designed to be stimulating and fun to read. National commissions are funded to look for ways to improve the country's youth education system. Yet kids still fail, dropout and otherwise don't achieve.

We are just stuck with what we have. Its a bigger issue than just one component.

Juris is a troll and bad troll at that. He can't form a sentence. He can't structure a paragraph and his premises for his positions are completely unfounded.

His replies in the Cubscout Forum on whether Cubscouting belongs in the BSA program were utter gibberish. His replies were nothing but clichs and generalizations.

He may be Jason, but I though Jason as well as Fat Old Guy had a much better understanding of the Scouting programs.

Juris uses sweeping generalizations, states the obvious and over emphasizes his experience. He is a kid.