Hawkrod

SeattlePioneer, I am afraid I disagree with your POV. The point of Boy Scouts is not outdoor skills, Outdoor skills are simply a tool used to help build better leaders. The first three ranks of Boy Scouts are those outdoor skills and are the tools used to be able complete the last three ranks which are leadership skills. The entire point of Boy Scouts is to help make better men, being able to pitch a tent and cook over a fire does not make you a better man, pitching a tent with your patrol and cooking for a group of people, working out the issues that come up and succeeding makes you a better

THe badge magic type products actually come off pretty easily. I used to think it was a difficult mess but there are several easy ways to remove it including dry cleaning. I use Goof Off and it works great (we have a used uniform library, it seems as though I end up doing a couple every month lately!).

The velcro has two halves, you sew the "fuzzy" soft piece on the sleeve (or badge magic if you prefer). The velcro piece is the same color as the shirt so when a patch is removed it is just there. This is how military uniforms are done now. It is amazingly simple and if it works in heavy duty applications like it was designed for it should work well in Scouting. JMO

moosetracker, yes, I was trying to be both vague and abstract as I knew that eventually this would happen and I was not trying to air this here but air my experience and what I came away with from it. It is certainly possible that I was wrong about the OA nominations and if that is the case then I apologize profusely as that was not my intent and I may have misinterpreted what the LA said but other than that I can absolutely document and prove everything else I have said and would not have written it had I not had paperwork in my posesssion to support what I have written or had been first hand

As I have noted, there are other issues. These people have had a common issue that I think (maybe I am wrong but so be it) has created my perception. These people have told lies, misrepresented things, back stabbed, sullied names and so much more. You do not get 30 plus parents and leaders to write letters to the District staff and the SE if you are doing a good job. I will admit that over half of the letters came from out units but more than a third came from members of other units that were present when problems occured and they blame us as these people were members of our unit when many of

Definitely yes. And that fun can be directly tied to getting more adults to participate and get the Scouts to step it up a notch. At a recent "pay it forward" event our Troop had, the boys ran a weekend camping program for the Cub Scouts after the Crew had taken the Boy Scouts Rock Climbing. The parents and leaders were seperated from the boys in both proximity and facilities. One of the dads (who was immediately promoted to ASM after dinner!) had volunteered to cook the adult meals with the SM. The dinner for the adults ended up being mini pizzas cooked on portabello mushrooms inste

Yes, there is a lot more going on but I was trying to make a minor point rather than have it turn into this long drawn out thread. My real point was that you have to look at the volunteers and if they have sons "in the program" who are not participating but the parents are there for anything at the drop of a hat you have to look deeper and see if there is a reason why the boys are not benefiting. If the boys don't want to be there then ask why. If it because they really don't like Scouts then okay but when a boy says he wants to but can't because his mom is staffing another class or condu

Pretty close but these parents have become District/Council involved and pulled their sons out of units to "Lone Scout" (yes, I know, it is not allowed if there is a unit available but these people are manipulators!). The boys really want to be in a unit but are not allowed. The parents claim other boys picked on them etc... but when I talk to the boys (at non-Scout events) and their parents are not around the boys have told me how much they miss it. For these people, Scouting has become their life at the cost of their boys programs. The one I removed from my Pack was a den leader and would ha

BrentAllen, I am trying to be polite here. I am not talking about a boy who has a choice about what he is doing, I am talking about boys that have said they want to participate, who when they are allowed to show up, have a good time but are not allowed because the parents have other plans but when it is the parent doing something it becomes their "duty". People who have committed to do something and then don't because they were asked to do something else by somebody outside of the unit after they have already made the committment. An example would be a Pack trainer that sets up Balloo for the

83Eagle, I fear again, my comment was taken out of context. I never said there was something wrong with working towards knots, I said there was something wrong with adults more concerned with earning knots than their own sons earning rank. When a parent has a youth in the program but that youth is not participating BECAUSE the parent is then it is a problem.

Welcome, I am new here also but saw this post and had to laugh. I am known as Big Bear or Yanegwa

ScoutNut, I fully agree with what you are saying but I think you took what I said out of context. I was talking about problems directly related to adult volunteers who are in it for themselves, not for the benefit of the youth or more specifically, their own children who miss out on the program because of the parents type of involvement. I will say that at times, my involvement has been an issue. Hopefully not in a negative way, but because I do as much as I do, my kids are "forced" to do more than they probably would on their own. Being program director at summer camp meant that my boys

I think you may want to reread what I wrote, I did not imply that it IS a problem, I said it "can be" a problem. The issue is not the same as your other examples as those organizations do not exist for the benefit of the youth registered. Your comparing apples to oranges.

pohsuwed, I think you hit a nail on the head. I have not been a Scouter all that long but have been part of a couple of EXTREMELY active units that required all adults to get off of their tails and run. I have earned a lot of knots in short order as our CC's have been very proactive in documenting and submitting the forms (I actually did not know that the individual was supposed to be responsible because the CC always made sure it was taken care of!). I actually have a youth program related knot for every year or two that I have been in Scouting along with a District award or Merit, William D.

I agree that Scouting is a great program for adults and I know it has changed my life but I also find that for some adults Scouting is their life and that can be a problem. I have met several people who have Scout age kids that either do not participate, or are always taking a back burner while the parents are very involved. We have a couple right now that fit this mold and have had others in the past (one I actually removed from our unit). The problem is Scouting becomes their lives. These people are staffing Woodbadge but their kids are sitting at home playing video games. They do see the be

I think it is a great idea and have tried to find Vecro in the correct colors but have been unsuccessful. I think it would be great for boys rank and position patches as too many change too frequently. For some boys it may not be an issue but we have some go-getters and of course every six months you have changing positions. I also like it for adult leaders because, although it is great to have a uniform for each position, that is not always practical especially in these tough economic times. I actually have 7 uniform shirts (I wear a lot of hats) but often find that I need more than one for s

I just wanted to thank you guys for doing what you all do so well. I have a really tough time tracking all the stuff going on in Scouting and just recently started participating in various forums when I was looking for help on some other issues. Now I get ideas daily and something like this is great because I have boys in my unit that qualify or are very close to qualifying and I didn't even know it existed! I don't even have to worry about the dates as all of the requirements have been completed since last summer when this award already existed (one of the few benefits of a new unit, nobody d

I agree that some people don't comprehend what an arid climate is like. Open fires is an issue for us but we lost a big chunk of our local camp in a fire and that camp was donated because the last one was also lost in a fire. Here, where we live, our average annual precipitation is about 5 inches and is mostly snow (snow has less water in it than rain). The fire dangers here are serious and even our local city owned camping facility that has cleared areas with deep metal fire pits requires a permit from the fire department for a cooking fire but they won't even issue a permit for just a campfi

I agree, "Good turns should need no reward" but this is an excellent opportunity to use to sell good turns. Yes, I said "sell". Too many kids and adults forget that doing the right thing is not always the easy thing to do and these type of situations make excellent opportunities to sell the other kids on doing the right thing. Does the boy need an award for doing it? No, but giving him one in front of everybody will certainly make others think about it when they are in the same spot as well as reinforcing the value of having done the right thing to the boy. JMO

Actually, this applies directly to Scouting. A speed trap by definition is an unfair violation of your rights. A trap is designed to make it impossible to do the right thing.

I have to agree that the CS program can be tough at a District level. In our District we have the Pinewood Derby, Raingutter Regatta, and Cub Day Camp as activities. After you add in popcorn sales and Scouting for food you have quite a bit of program to go along with Council events such as resident camp, Stampede (it is kind of like a camporee for all Scouts including cubbies!), and special programs like Webelos Woods, rocket academy (LA Council but we always do it because it is so close) and civil war re-enactment. The reality is that between District and Council activities, I can have my uni

But do you disagree with what I wrote? There used to be a place where the speed limit dropped 25 MPH but the lower speed limit sign (which was less than 1/4 mile from the higher one) was directly behind a larger yellow diamond warning sign. The poles for the two signs were only about a foot apart and directly in line with each other. To me that is intent on somebodies part. It took intervention of the SAG to get it fixed.

I do think there is a big difference between a speed trap and a change in speed limits. A speed trap would be as described above, a sudden change in speed limits that can't be seen in normal situations. If you are driving along legally and the speed limit is 60 and you come up a rise and behind the hill is a 35 MPH sign and you can't possibly slow fast enough after seeing the sign then that is a trap. If the sign is hidden behind a bush, pole or other sign (I have actually seen this one!) then it is a trap. There has to be a reasonable effort to make the driver aware of changes in speed limits

Just a note to clear up the community strip versus R/W council patches. The community strips were used at the same time as the R/W council patches but they existed for seperate purposes. The community strip was worn by local unit members and the R/W council patches were worn by professional Scouters and Jamboree contingent members. I do believe the dates of change varied slightly and I know that here in area it was in 1973. The funny part is I know this because of when our council was formed. By coincidence it was already mentioned, I am in the area that was the old Arrowhead Area council (I c

You are correct, it was a letter to the employees that I was shown not to Scouters (sorry, I did not mean to imply that it was for all eyes). As far as the hats go, isn't that what I wrote? LOL Thanks(This message has been edited by Hawkrod)