Gunny2862

I might also suggest sounding out your new SM over a cup of coffee and finding out what his vision is. After all while you are there for the boys, you'll also cause no end of trouble if you step in and start overruling him, whether under or over the table.

Find out what he sees, see what the troop does, and also go to training. Have more cups of coffee with the SM and show him what the book says if it's different than how you do it. But remember that if you undercut him, you need to be ready to wear the hat and carry the responsibility, and fix any bad feelings you stirred up in the process.

Disclaimer, the troubles continue from Cub Scouts on up into Boy Scouts. I wrote in the other thread and chose not to post a rather blistering opinion of some not named Commissioners.

Included was a caveat that there are some great Commissioners out there (and four whom I deal with locally that I walk towards, rather than applying my bag of Ninja skills to avoid) - the ones who know they aren't there to run the unit I serve, undercut any outreach I might be doing with my Parents, who understand they are there to HELP me and provide me with info on resources I might not know I have, but not to directly contact my Scout Parents, and most of all who don't show up at a camping event and gripe me out in front of the parents AND the boys. Mostly because I have thus far chosen not to attend Woodbadge (after having been told by other Commissioners that I shouldn't go(they implied couldn't go) until I had several years under my belt after getting "Trained" as it was really a "Capstone" training event for "Seasoned" Scouters) and also because I don't "force" the Scouts to every single District or Council event.

Well, we have our own Calendar and sometimes the boys choose not to go to the Council event because theirs is more fun AND (for instance)some group of Commissioners are threatening to burn their sled after the Klondike.

Commissioners really need to learn their own (can I say ding-dang here?)jobs before they come and interfere with mine. Be a resource, not a road block Commissioners.

http://www.nypost.com/p/entertainment/health/fat_chance_xvtJFYgRW25bQ3OfY52KgJ

Need to make a few points here: He started as a Personal trainer AND a Chef , he KNOWS how his body and food work.

He did this intentionally, he was only planning on gaining 100 lbs.

He still,"began to think hed never drop the weight."

"I had a complete [mental] breakdown at 264 pounds, says James, who hopped on a plane to Tokyo, locked himself in a hotel room, closed the drapes and had McDonalds delivered.

Soon, he eschewed food completely, but still packed on 5 more pounds.""

"Empathy is my favorite word. I even have it tattooed on the inside of my wrist, he says flipping his arm over to reveal the ink."

In the interest of it being about the boys, and a game with a purpose, this is one of those areas where I take the youth who is asking for the double dipping into account.

If I know a Scout is doing 1-3 hours a week of Service every week that I would take as meeting either or both his Star and/or Citizenship in the Community MB requirement/s over any given 6 month period( after all he's going to put out between 24 and 72 hours in his regular service anyway(and in the case I'm thinking of, that's in addition to working others Eagle projects, and the other opportunities our troop does that might count)), then I would also know that in the course of his regular life that he would meet those requirements. DO I then require him to do additional hours so that he is doing them FOR the purpose of meeting those requirements? No, of course not.

In the same, or similar vein, if a Scout has to be prodded into doing ANY service hours then I can certainly see a valid argument against counting a singular group of hours for dual sets of requirements - to me it's more about the boys here, than a set of rules that apply to them all evenly. The message in this case is being tailored to the boy in question rather than a one size fits all answer.

Retired Marine

I understand and agree with all of the first 3 posts.

Comments:

According to the rules: The only real boss/es in the sense of the word boss is/are the IH and or the COR depending on how the IH wants that situation to work.

According to the boots on the Ground: normally the CM is the boss and he has a Boss who is either the committee, CC, COR, IH or any combination of the above.

All others are on the same team and may report to, or mentor, each other but don't have boss/subordinate roles.

To extend the metaphor, everyone exists to support and train the sharp end of the spear (warfighters)/(cubs) where all the action happens.

As much as many of us beat up on our Councils, try to find out what your Council Camp is and start out there. Even if Summer Camp is over, most Council camps can be used for Troop Camping for either no cost or a very small fee.

State Parks.

State Conservation areas - check with your Department of Conservation, some reserved areas require special permission or special use permits but are still free.

Friends of the Troop or Chartering Organization (CO) who own property they'd let you use - in some cases ideal for primitive camping as they like that you are cutting their overgrowth for the purpose - check what the use parameters are with them first.

We have had provisional's join us and we've sent a few provisional's.

IMHO and experience, the main theme of being a successful provisional camper is joining in with the Troop you go with. Do your turn/s at clean up, follow their Troop rules, work thru their SPL, keep their SM informed as necessary(Act as though you are a part of that Troop). Ensure you get any necessary signatures before pack up time.

Provisional's who've joined us have reported back that they had a great time and our provisional's say the same when they've gone with other Troops - we still have Provisional Parents tell us how their Scout is doing, when we run into them, because they know we invested in their Scout that week.

When we went in 2010, I made the limit by 5#. They did a Weight check 2x(screener and then MD), and BP (2x also screener and then MD).

I agree the BMI chart is inaccurate at best and it's noted that it isn't designed to accommodate people who have put on muscle on purpose has makes no accommodation for us.

That said, the proposed fitness test would have to be on some kind of standard equipment that you could do at your city of residence, who would want to go to Philmont to take a strenuous test and only then after the fees and vacation were expended find out if you were going to be able to hit the trail? At least with some(any) weight limit you do have some control before you go and know what the target is.

And there's part of the problem. I don't Police my kid, never have. I Parent him, which includes how to responsibly carry and utilize items I'm going to expect him to be able to use after I am not in a position of supervision to him.

The idea of parents policing their children promotes the idea of punishing them for mistakes rather than teaching them how to correctly and responsibly navigate life.

As to not sending medication to school with your child, must be nice not to have to negotiate dosing schedules with school administrators who don't have either a full-time nurse or a designated staff member who is authorized to disburse prescribed meds. on the required schedule. In some cases due to the schools own unrealistic policies the choices become: 1)kid carries the meds, 2) Kid does without meds, 3) Parent quits job so they can be there(after checking in with the office, checking the kid out of class, taking them off of school property, administering the med, returning the child to school, checking them back in).

Oh and how about those sisters who got sunburned (2nd degree) because the school in their infinite wisdom decided that they couldn't allow the children to put on their prescription sunblock because the nurse wasn't there to do it for them - and they wouldn't let the kids stay in the shade either?

I don't really know if it's me procrastinating or being driven to do things at the last minute due to parental inaction and youth venue shopping - Really? 21 days prior to turn in the Tour Plan for a Float trip when I truthfully don't know who will be attending until the Monday prior??? who is kidding whom?

I get about two a year on average looking and I get about 1/2 of those as transfers, usually from Troops that have changed Adult leadership,

(most often a new SM but a couple of times a new ASM) and the Scout(or Parent) does not (for what ever reason) like the change.

To date, every Scout we have had come over from another Troop has finished at Life or Eagle.

So, to answer the posed questions:

Change within the previous Troop causing enough discomfort they left their buddies.

Yes and Yes.

Looks like Camp Arrowhead, Marshfield, MO is outside your travel radius, approx 1330 miles and 22 hours according to Google maps. But Kentucky certainly isn't closer and the Little Rock camp mentioned isn't very far away.

Activity driven, but generally: Hiking=Trousers, Backpacking=Shorts(Switchbacks or other convertible with the legs dropped and acting kind of like gaiters when moving), Summer=Shorts, All other seasons=Trousers.

Stosh, as a Communications Equipment Maintenance/Repair manager in the Marine Corps I had the same sign on my desk.

We had to do this this year, no form = no ride.

In the past we could run them out to town and pay $30 and get it turned around in about 1/2 a day but the camp no longer allows that, late check-in fine, bad check-in go home.

I still use my whistle, with both the Troop and my almost 18 year old. They know to look and then hands signals if it's too far, or otherwise too loud to yell.

Get him to try a "rock and Roll garage band" with some off his friends - watch how quickly they weed out the one/s who can't play, or learn new songs, or won't practice to come up to the level of the groups play.

Leads directly to the discussion you want to have and is in the same field making comparisons easy.

BTDT, worked great, Orchestra for us instead of Marching Band but the comparison is there.

Nike, for your specific purposes, I would:

1) If not Registered, not a Committee Member.

2) If not a Committee Member, voice but no vote.

3) If ScoutParents want a vote all they need to do is fill out one more sheet of paper and pay the fee and preferably take on a task that might be overburdening someone else.

4) The Committee Meeting quorum rule you already have in place answers the unasked other question.

You know the organization you are crafting this for and while in Civilian life I now want all the wiggle room I can finagle, the folks you are submitting this to are rule followers looking for rules to be followed, that will keep THEM out of trouble. The easier it is for them to decipher who the members of the organization are and the better the documentation on that the happier they (and maybe you) will be.

Agree with most of the above, what was the location and outside temp? If she left the lot and came back, I'd probably not entertain her claim at all, not sure if that's there or if I'm reading it in that she left and came back.

This kind of thing wasn't uncommon down in South Florida, most fundraisers I dealt with down there had a "At Own Risk" disclaimer, form, to be signed at the donation/payment table depending on what organization was doing it. Because the business owners who would let us do Washes on their lots had had enough of people coming after them.

Cold Water and REALLY hot glass don't mix. At least not as well as you might think.

If someone tried that here in the middle of flyover country though, I'd be much more inclined to let the Insurance folks play their games. If it's that hot, we probably are going swimming instead of washing cars here in the mid-states, so I've not seen that happen around here.

Thanks for your reply!

I'm an Introvert, you'd never know it at Camp, or at a Camp out, but I seriously need to recharge with some alone time afterwards. I put on a pretty good show sometimes...

Overt Leadership however doesn't require a Showman, it does require occasionally showing the Flag in front of the Troops, but not necessarily being the Ringmaster - and even the Ringmaster has the floods switch to whatever act is performing before it comes back to allow him to announce the next event. One might even say the guy controlling the lights is in charge more than the Ringmaster, and you never see him...

Since there are many who would disagree with your position(I wasn't around and reserve my opinion) and we don't often hear from someone who doesn't have an axe to grind.

A) Could you elaborate on what ways you think it is better now, than then?

B) Could you give some example of things you think could be improved by going back to how it was then, and how/why?

You aren't expected/required to wear the uniform by the BSA, but your unit and yourself might decide the parents might feel more comfortable explaining your presence and acting as an ASM if you wore the standard uniform on the occasions you are able to attend. Standard patching if you exercise this option, no special uniform designators for 92U.

Oh, Inability to Train. I know some great Outdoor guides who would be Outstanding Outfitters but who couldn't train a boy out of a paper bag...

Lack of ability to carry out the Program.

Being overloaded due to Lack of Support, either from Parents, Lack of Adult Resources - having to do to many tasks that should be handled by the Committee, Lack of ASM's, or of Trained ASM's who support the SM.

Lack of understanding of the Program.

And finally, some folks just shouldn't BE Scoutmasters. It may not be their FAULT, but some folks are in fact, just weak.